Can Jewish law be fulfilled?

[smokydot]

1Kings Chapter 4 stops at verse 20

not in my Bible, it goes to v. 34.

and 2 Samuel 8:3. And David smote Hadadezer the son of Rehob, king of Zobah, as he went to extend his dominion to the Euphrates River.

extension to promised boundaries.

Not too sure where the fulfillment is

In 1Kgs 4:21, 24-25.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Yes, indeed, thank you, Plato. . .you explained it perfectly!

My god! Such exquisite irony! Wow.

 

[Rakhel]

In 1Kgs 4:21, 24-25.

What do those verses say? Because in mine, that chapter stops at 20.

 

[Pegg]

Have you ever noticed the nature of a "shadow?"
A shadow is not real as we understand the physical world.

BigRed
[/indent]

thats right

all the animal sacrifices made under the mosaic law were not real in terms of removing sins because the people still sinned. They were merely a 'foreshadow' of the sacrifice the Christ would give of himself...the 'real' offering that was to come which would be able to remove sins completely.

 

[smokydot]

.... and IT'S IRRELEVANT....:cover:

Agreed! . .the time of edit is absolutely irrelevant!

 

[smokydot]

What do those verses say? Because in mine, that chapter stops at 20.

1Kgs 4:21, 24-25: And Solomon ruled over all the kingdoms from the River (Euphrates) to the land of the Philistines, as far as the border of Egypt. . .For he ruled over all the kingdoms west of the River, from Tiphsah to Gaza, and had peace on all sides. During Solomon's lifetime Judah and Israel, from Dan to Beersheba, lived in safety, each man under his own vine tree.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

What do those verses say? Because in mine, that chapter stops at 20.

1 Kings 20-34 from the ESV (sry for the letters)


20Judah and Israel were as many(Q) as the sand by the sea. They ate and drank and were happy. 21[a](R) Solomon ruled over all the kingdoms from the(S) Euphrates to the land of the Philistines and to the border of Egypt.(T) They brought tribute and served Solomon all the days of his life.
22Solomon’s provision for one day was thirty cors of fine flour and sixty cors of meal, 23ten fat oxen, and twenty pasture-fed cattle, a hundred sheep, besides deer, gazelles, roebucks, and fattened fowl. 24For he had dominion over all the region west of the Euphrates from Tiphsah to(U) Gaza, over all the kings west of the Euphrates.(V) And he had peace on all sides around him. 25And Judah and Israel(W) lived in safety,(X) from Dan even to Beersheba,(Y) every man under his vine and under his fig tree, all the days of Solomon. 26(Z) Solomon also had 40,000 stalls of horses for his chariots, and 12,000 horsemen. 27And those officers supplied provisions for King Solomon, and for all who came to King Solomon’s table, each one in his month. They let nothing be lacking. 28Barley also and straw for the horses and(AA) swift steeds they brought to the place where it was required, each according to his duty.

29(AB) And God gave Solomon wisdom and understanding beyond measure, and breadth of mind(AC) like the sand on the seashore, 30so that Solomon’s wisdom surpassed the wisdom of all(AD) the people of the east(AE) and all the wisdom of Egypt. 31For he was(AF) wiser than all other men, wiser than Ethan the Ezrahite, and Heman, Calcol, and Darda, the sons of Mahol, and his fame was in all the surrounding nations. 32(AG) He also spoke 3,000 proverbs,(AH) and his songs were 1,005. 33He spoke of trees, from the cedar that is in Lebanon to the hyssop that grows out of the wall. He spoke also of beasts, and of birds, and of reptiles, and of fish. 34And people of all nations came to hear the wisdom of Solomon, and from(AI) all the kings of the earth, who had heard of his wisdom.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

What do those verses say? Because in mine, that chapter stops at 20.

The only reason why we have different texts - I suspect - is that yours isn't based on the Masoretic text.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Agreed! . .the time of edit is absolutely irrelevant!

That you edited it, however, renders it irrelevant.

 

[Rakhel]

1Kgs 4:21, 24-25: And Solomon ruled over all the kingdoms from the River (Euphrates) to the land of the Philistines, as far as the border of Egypt. . .For he ruled over all the kingdoms west of the River, from Tiphsah to Gaza, and had peace on all sides. During Solomon's lifetime Judah and Israel, from Dan to Beersheba, lived in safety, each man under his own vine tree.

Ok I found them. They were hiding in the first 5 verses of chapter 5. I almost had to call you a liar because I didn't see where those verses were. Thank you for providing the text.

 

[smokydot]

Nobody has ever questioned that the descendants of Abraham inherited the land.
We all know that they are living in Israel today.
But Abraham was promised the land and he never received even one foot of ground.
Genesis 17:8
"I will give to you and to your descendants after you, the land of your sojournings, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their God."
Acts 7:5
"But He gave him no inheritance in it, not even a foot of ground, and yet, even when he had no child, He promised that HE WOULD GIVE IT TO HIM AS A POSSESSION, AND TO HIS DESCENDANTS AFTER HIM.
This is proof positive that Jesus did not fulfill the Law and the Prophets.
Abraham NEVER received what was promised to him.
BigRed

Been there. . .done that. . .got the T shirt @ http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2321612-post558.html

 

[smokydot]

I am aware of that. But my answer remains as a useful answer to you.
It might not have been the answer you are looking for, but you could learn something from what I've said.

You can speak for him personally?

 

[smokydot]

I'll look it up. But as I said, the very fact that he was pushing Jews away from Torah law, and convinced people that "no one comes to God but through Jesus" - that is MORE than enough to show that whatever Paul may have learned as a Pharisee was useless, once he became an idolator, with Jesus as his idol.

I was thinking more of what Jewish customs he got wrong. . .of course, as a Christian he would disagree with Jewish tradition.

 

[smokydot]

That you edited it, however, renders it irrelevant.

Uh huh. . .whose rule is that? . .one who is looking for any flimsy veil they can find to cover their inability to refute my arguments. . .yeah, right! . .that's one pitiful try
at creating an irrelevant issue. . .which seem to be the only kind of issues and tries you have. . .

 

[smokydot]

Ok I found them. They were hiding in the first 5 verses of chapter 5. I almost had to call you a liar because I didn't see where those verses were. Thank you for providing the text.

Glad I dodged that bullet!

 

[Pegg]

I'm surprised that you don't see the silliness of your own question. Even if you believe you have the "forgiveness" that is supposed to be available because of Jesus, you are forgiven, but you still have to die? What does THAT mean, in terms of forgiveness?

some of us may die while we are awaiting for Gods intervention... but thats okay because Gods plan to resurrect any and all who have died will fix that.

The answer always given is that forgiveness is guaranteed in the World to Come. But God granted that long before there was a Jesus. Jesus, as far as the concept of God's forgiveness of humanity is concerned, is pointless.

i believe that 'world to come' is actually the world we are living in right now.

God set up two perfectly well functioning covenants with humanity: one with Noah, and one with Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and their children, the Jews.

Jesus was thereby irrelevant, unless you choose to MAKE him relevant. I still don't see the function he would have for you, as God and man already HAVE a relationship that is devoid of the need for Jesus.

Jesus has taken away the death penalty for sin. I think that makes him very relevant in terms of the world to come because at that time, with Gods full governance of the earth, no one will die.

But if your belief system incorporates what I see as a useless feature as its primary function, that is your lookout.
Just because the World to Come isn't mentioned in Jewish scriptures, it doesn't mean that we don't believe in it. Rather, our main focus is THIS world, right here.

Please tell me that you don't honestly believe that Jesus was the first person to have come up with the idea of an afterlife.

Jesus didnt come up with the idea of an afterlife.... He preached eternal life on this earth because he believed in what the Hebrews scriptures promise...eternal life on this earth.
Matthew 5:5 “Happy are the mild-tempered ones, since they will inherit the earth"

 

[smokydot]

And thank you Plato. :takeabow:
[and smoky thinks that he's presenting the bible without opinion]

Well, since both the letter to the Hebrews (Heb 10:1, 8:5; Col 2:17). . .and Plato --->http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2322208-post600.html***

are on my side of the argument on "shadows,". . .whose wrong arguments are really trafficking in uninformed opinion?

***See http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2322216-post602.html

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Uh huh. . .whose rule is that? . .one who is looking for any flimsy veil they can find to cover their inability to refute my arguments. . .yeah, right! . .that's one pitiful try
at creating an irrelevant issue. . .which seem to be the only kind of issues and tries you have. . .

Well, you refer to the "record" as if it were of legal quality (I assume) - you speak of facts and a court of law.

I suspect that a court would not allow a lawyer to continually redact his evidence without notifying the defense and the judge.

You are continually moving the target like a corrupt lawyer, making everything that you say invalid. You are perjuring yourself to no end... and it seems that you take pride in it.

And then you arrogantly proclaim your righteousness.

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Well, since both the letter to the Hebrews (Heb 10:1, 8:5; Col 2:17). . .and Plato --->http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2322208-post600.html***

are on my side of the argument on "shadows,". . .whose wrong arguments are really trafficking in uninformed opinion?

***See http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/2322216-post602.html

:thud:

 

[Harmonious]

You can speak for him personally?

For him personally? No.

But the issues you addressed in the post? Absolutely.

Remember - this is a MESSAGE BOARD. All kinds of people are reading along with you.

If you want to know something, and a different person answers the questions you've asked than the person you intended, you've been given an answer.

If the point you are trying to make is an attack on an individual, you deserve whatever you get in return.

But I answered the issues.