Can someone explain the Trinity please...

[moorea944]

God is One.
There are three, and the three are one and the same.

Can you please give us a verse that says that? That actually says, " there are three, and the three are one and the same"?
If not, then why believe in that?

 

[JM2C]

I see you do not care about what others say. That shows you do not care about the Truth. Why do you keep saying "Oneness"?

God is One.

A United One, Echad, and not an only one, Yachid..Study this and you will understand

 

[JM2C]

1 Corinthians 8:4

So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that "An idol is nothing at all in the world" and that "There is no God but one."

Deuteronomy 4:35

You were shown these things so that you might know that the LORD is God; besides him there is no other.

Deuteronomy 4:39

Acknowledge and take to heart this day that the LORD is God in heaven above and on the earth below. There is no other.

Deuteronomy 6:4

Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.

The Bible says there is only One God and that He is the Father.


Since there is only One God and He is the Father, then Jesus who is God is also the Father.

They mutually use the pronouns I, thou, he and him when speaking to or of each other.

"This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him" -Matt. 17:5.

"Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that the Son may glorify thee" -John 17:1.

"I came out from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go unto the Father" -John 16:28.

"When he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth: for he shall not speak from himself: but what things soever he shall hear, these shall he speak: and he shall declare unto you the things that are to come" -John 16:13.

 

[Yes]

Can you please give us a verse that says that? That actually says, " there are three, and the three are one and the same"?
If not, then why believe in that?

'One' means the same. Since we must go through Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, then we see that they are three, and the three must be one, which is the same.

Everything that Jesus does the Father does. Everything that the Holy Spirit does, he takes from what is Jesus'.

 

[Yes]

A United One, Echad, and not an only one, Yachid..Study this and you will understand

I do not have to study Greek to know God's Truth. God has always brought His message in the language of the hearer

Studying Greek has only got you further from God's Truth.

A "united" one is not the same as One God.

 

[Yes]

They mutually use the pronouns I, thou, he and him when speaking to or of each other.

"This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him" -Matt. 17:5.

"Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that the Son may glorify thee" -John 17:1.

"I came out from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go unto the Father" -John 16:28.

"When he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he shall guide you into all the truth: for he shall not speak from himself: but what things soever he shall hear, these shall he speak: and he shall declare unto you the things that are to come" -John 16:13.

Those scriptures prove that Jesus is God the Father come in the flesh.

 

[JM2C]

Well, seeing as how we are considering the Jewish perspective, how does the Complete Jewish Bible render that verse?

Romans 9:5...."the Patriarchs are theirs; and from them, as far as his physical descent is concerned, came the Messiah, who is over all. Praised be Adonai for ever! Amen."

No trinitarian spin put on that verse now is there?

The “Adonai” in that verse is referring to the Lord Jesus, right?

 

[JM2C]

Those scriptures prove that Jesus is God the Father come in the flesh.

Sir, please read and understand this: They mutually use the pronouns I, thou, he and him when speaking to or of each other.
Meaning God is talking to Lord Jesus and to the Holy Spirit and The Lord Jesus is talking to God and to the Holy Spirit.

 

[moorea944]

'One' means the same. Since we must go through Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, then we see that they are three, and the three must be one, which is the same.

Everything that Jesus does the Father does. Everything that the Holy Spirit does, he takes from what is Jesus'.

Know I'm understanding where your coming from then. I see your making the Holy spirit a "person". Ok, then. If you did that and put it into three people, yes, then you would get a trinity of some sort. But we have to understand that the Holy Spirit is not a person, it is the power of God. If the Holy Spirit was a person, as you say, then he would be Jesus's father.

"One" does not mean that two are the same, but.... they can be the same on thinking, doing, purpose, etc. Yes, two people can be "one" on that. Jesus was one with God, but the bible does not say that he is God.

[Those scriptures prove that Jesus is God the Father come in the flesh.]
No, it doesnt. Jesus is God's Word or logos made flesh. Jesus is God manifest. So, what your saying is, that God changed into a man and came to earth. Then who did Jesus (God) pray to? If Jesus is God, why did God feel that he had to change His name to Jesus? Too many changes in our Creator. God doesn not change. Esp, for us! And why this father and son thing. Why does God role play on this topic if they are the same person. Doesnt make sense, does it....

 

[JM2C]

I do not have to study Greek to know God's Truth. God has always brought His message in the language of the hearer


Studying Greek has only got you further from God's Truth.


A "united" one is not the same as One God.

Echad and Yachid I believe is Hebrew.

"The reason that the Jews have become estranged from the doctrine of the Triune God is found in the teachings of Moses Maimonides. He compiled thirteen articles of faith which the Jews accepted and incorporated into their liturgy. One of them is 'I believe with a perfect faith that the Creator, blessed be His name, is an absolute one' (Hebrew, 'Yachid' ) . This has been repeated daily by Jews in their prayers, ever since the twelfth century, when Moses Maimonides lived. This expression of an 'absolute one' is diametrically opposed to the word of God which teaches with great emphasis that God is not a 'Yachid,' which means an only one, or an 'absolute one,' but 'echad,' which means a united one.

In Deuteronomy 6:4 God laid down for His people a principle of faith, which is certainly superior to that of Moses Maimonides, inasmuch as it comes from God Himself. We read, 'Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is ONE,' stressing the sense of the phrase 'one' by using not 'yachid,' which Moses Maimanides does, but 'echad,' which means a unitedone. Loraine Boettner

 

[Yes]

Sir, please read and understand this: They mutually use the pronouns I, thou, he and him when speaking to or of each other.
Meaning God is talking to Lord Jesus and to the Holy Spirit and The Lord Jesus is talking to God and to the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit is God. Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

 

[JM2C]

Yes, Jesus Christ was a "mighty divine one" who willingly came from heaven as a mortal human to pay a debt that was not his. This mortal man was put to death. Are you suggesting that Almighty God can die? He is an immortal being, so if Jesus was God he could not die. That makes the ransom a fraud.

You said it yourself “Jesus Christ was a "mighty divine one" who willingly came from heaven as a mortal human” I guess you are referring this to John 1:14 “And the Word became flesh” and this “mighty divine one” who came from heaven is the one in John 1:1 who John said was “with God” and “was God” [SG2316]. God cannot die of course that is why this “mighty divine one” “came from heaven as a mortal human” to die for the sin of the world.

 

[Nada]

The Holy Spirit is God. Jesus is the Holy Spirit.

God is not the holy spirit.Holy spirit is poured out upon those God chooses.This is His active force.Jesus is not the holy spirit either.Jesus is the Son of God the Almighty.Jesus performed miracles by way of holy spirit.This is God's active force.Remember,the holy spirit was lifted from Jesus right before he was killed so that what was to be accomplished could take place.The holy spirit is not a person or God,or Jesus.It is simply the force that helps those serving God to accomplish their tasks.For instance,the writing of the holy scriptures was done by way of holy spirit upon man.

People have this misconception that they are all 3 in 1.This is not the case.

 

[Yes]

Know I'm understanding where your coming from then. I see your making the Holy spirit a "person".
Ok, then. If you did that and put it into three people, yes, then you would get a trinity of some sort. But we have to understand that the Holy Spirit is not a person, it is the power of God. If the Holy Spirit was a person, as you say, then he would be Jesus's father.

The Bible says the Holy Spirit is "he".
The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ.

"One" does not mean that two are the same, but.... they can be the same on thinking, doing, purpose, etc. Yes, two people can be "one" on that. Jesus was one with God, but the bible does not say that he is God.

One does mean the same.

[Those scriptures prove that Jesus is God the Father come in the flesh.]
No, it doesnt. Jesus is God's Word or logos made flesh.

The scriptures say the Word is God.

Jesus is God manifest.

That is right.

So, what your saying is, that God changed into a man and came to earth.

God gave up His glorified body in heaven and got a flesh body when He came to earth.

Then who did Jesus (God) pray to?

Jesus prayed to the invisible God who lives in unapproachable light.

If Jesus is God, why did God feel that he had to change His name to Jesus?

Because he became nothing for us, he came in the likeness of sinful flesh.

Too many changes in our Creator. God doesn not change. Esp, for us!

Are you kidding? Jesus is EXACTLY like the Father, for Jesus ONLY SAYS and DOES what the Father says and does.

And why this father and son thing. Why does God role play on this topic if they are the same person. Doesnt make sense, does it....

If a person comes forth from you, what do you call that person?

 

[JM2C]

"God" in English is "Elohim" in Hebrew, correct?

The word ”God” [SG2316] in the N.T. all 1155 of them, except for a few, was referred to either God the Father or the Son of God. Translating again to “Elohim” in Hebrew from Greek is not going change the meaning of the word “God [SG2316]”, right?

 

[Kolibri]

The Bible says the Holy Spirit is "he".
The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ.

This is because the Greek language attributes gender to its nouns, like Spanish, but not exclusively so.
Holy spirit is referred to as a him, when it is called a "helper" because "helper" is inherently masculine.
Holy spirit is referred to as an it, when the pronoun points to the word "spirit," because, in Greek, that word is inherently neuter.
This is not a Bible teaching, but a conformity to Greek rules of grammar.

"And I will ask the Father and he will give you another helper to be with you forever, the spirit of the truth, which the world cannot receive, because it neither sees it nor knows it. You know it, because it remains with you and is in you." - John 14:16,17

"Nevertheless, I am telling you the truth, it is for your benefit that I am going away. For if I do not go away, the helper will not come to you; but if I do go, I will send him to you. And when that one comes, he will give the world convincing evidence concerning sin and concerning righteousness and concerning judgement:" - John 16:17,18

 

[JM2C]

How do you understand Jesus' words here recorded by John? (Again from the CJB)

John 10:31-36....."Once again the Judeans picked up rocks in order to stone him. Yeshua answered them, “You have seen me do many good deeds that reflect the Father’s power; for which one of these deeds are you stoning me?” The Judeans replied, “We are not stoning you for any good deed, but for blasphemy — because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God .” Yeshua answered them,“Isn’t it written in your Torah, ‘I have said, “You people are Elohim’ ”? If he called ‘elohim’ the people to whom the word of Elohim was addressed and the Tanakh cannot be broken, then are you telling the one whom the Father set apart as holy and sent into the world, ‘You are committing blasphemy,’ just because I said, ‘I am a son of Elohim’?"

What is the application of "Elohim" here?
YHWH himself called human judges "Elohim" (gods) so what are we to make of that? Calling someone "Elohim" did not make them anything but someone in a position of power or authority. It didn't necessarily make them deity, did it?

if you read Psalm 82:6 God was referring to the “gods” as “men” in verse 7 of Psalm 82.
The Lord Jesus Christ used Psalm 82:6 to strengthen His argument, a kind of fortiori argument.

Jn 10:35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken—
Jn 10:36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’?

If, terms like “gods” can be applied to ordinary mortals, how could they, the Jews, accused The Lord Jesus Christ of blasphemy when He applied it to Himself, “the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? –John 10:36”

The Lord Jesus Christ was not offering a false claim like a man who is desperate for an answer and out of the blue quoted Psalm 82:6 just to avoid stoning.

The Lord Jesus Christ was merely asserting what He was by right, and that is, The Son of God.

In verse 29 of John 10, The Lord Jesus Christ said, “My Father” as in the “only begotten Son of God” –John 1:18, from eternity “the glory which I had with thee before the world was” - John 17:5.

The “only begotten Son of God” –John 1:18 is the same as in Heb 1:8 “But about the Son he says, “Your throne, O God”

Therefore, calling His “only begotten Son” –John 1:18 as God in Hebrews 1:8 “Your throne, O God” is what the Jews were thinking when The Lord Jesus Christ said, “I and the Father are one.” –John 10:30, read also John 5:18.

Blasphemy, the Jews said.

 

[JM2C]

Those scriptures prove that Jesus is God the Father come in the flesh.

There was no proof of that at all.

 

[Yes]

God is not the holy spirit.

You are wrong.

Whose Spirit do you think is the Holy Spirit?

Holy spirit is poured out upon those God chooses.

The scriptures say God pours out the Holy Spirit.
Titus 3:5, 6 He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior, And Acts 2:18.

The scriptures say Jesus pours out the Holy Spirit.
Acts 2:33 Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear.

The scriptures say God pours out the Holy Spirit THROUGH JESUS. See Titus 3:6. whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior,

The scriptures say God pours out the Holy Spirit THROUGH THE HOLY SPIRIT.

Do you understand that? Do you understand that it proves God the Father, Jesus Christ the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one and the same?

If you say no, then you have claimed the Bible contradicts itself all the time.

Is that what you want to keep saying?

 

[JM2C]

God is not the holy spirit.Holy spirit is poured out upon those God chooses.This is His active force.Jesus is not the holy spirit either.Jesus is the Son of God the Almighty.Jesus performed miracles by way of holy spirit.This is God's active force.Remember,the holy spirit was lifted from Jesus right before he was killed so that what was to be accomplished could take place.


The holy spirit is not a person or God,or Jesus.It is simply the force that helps those serving God to accomplish their tasks.For instance,the writing of the holy scriptures was done by way of holy spirit upon man.


People have this misconception that they are all 3 in 1.This is not the case.

”Active force” from where did you get this teaching?

The Holy Spirit is God:

"Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thy heart to lie to the Holy Spirit? . . . Thou has not lied unto men, but unto God" (Acts 5:3,4);

"For who among men knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of the man, which is in him? even so the things of God none knoweth, save the Spirit of God" (I Cor. 2:11);

"But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall bear witness of me" (John 15:26).