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Can we all agree that violence -- whether from the Left or from the Right -- should be Condemned?

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Yes, and to broaden that, there is a fundamental difference quite apart from ideology, policy etc

conservatives generally support the will of the people versus political elites.

Not so the other way around. Many liberals often openly express disdain for 'the people' . The leftist ideology is so inherently superior in their minds, it is perfectly justified to be forced on the majority - this is fundamentally more important than democracy. This is the explicit rationale of socialist dictators and ultimately- demonstrably- the most dangerous position in human history.

Not that I see anything going that far here, so far these mostly look like fairly harmless kids, who want to vent a bit and go home. My fear is that the media will try to escalate it into a more extreme movement, as we saw with BLM
So far, I've not seen coverage which would exacerbate the problem.
I even took in a bit of MSNBC to see how they're covering things.
No complaints.
 

Guy Threepwood

Mighty Pirate
So far, I've not seen coverage which would exacerbate the problem.
I even took in a bit of MSNBC to see how they're covering things.
No complaints.

yes fingers crossed it will die down.. for now.. but wait until Trump starts trying to enact some of that people's will... opening the keystone pipeline, defunding alternative energy etc

If I had a kid in college, I'd worry about them having any study time left- with all the protest assignments handed out by professors
 

ShivaFan

Satyameva Jayate
Premium Member
Totally insane.

An anti-Trump protester guy is swinging a bat too danerously close to other anti-Trump protesters in the crowd smashing things in senseless animal-like state (oh, I am sorry, animals are better than him and he wasn't alone with the basehall bat and crowbars) when some flying broken metal just misses the face of a female protester that would have permanently disfigured or killed her, she screams "STOP!" then the freak attacks her and shoving her to the cement for objecting to his brute and dangerous insanity, a Muslim female in Muslim attire then screams "You hit a woman!", the guy starts screaming "f you!" at the Muslim woman then joined with others of his ilk squaring off on a Muslim female and the next thing you know a brawl breaks out between factions of the anti-Trump protesters in Oregon with blacks on the one side and white females defended by Muslims on the other side.

You can't make this stuff up folks.
 

suncowiam

Well-Known Member
Yes, and to broaden that, there is a fundamental difference quite apart from ideology, policy etc

conservatives generally support the will of the people versus political elites.

Not so the other way around. Many liberals often openly express disdain for 'the people' . The leftist ideology is so inherently superior in their minds, it is perfectly justified to be forced on the majority - this is fundamentally more important than democracy. This is the explicit rationale of socialist dictators and ultimately- demonstrably- the most dangerous position in human history.

Not that I see anything going that far here, so far these mostly look like fairly harmless kids, who want to vent a bit and go home. My fear is that the media will try to escalate it into a more extreme movement, as we saw with BLM

There's fault on both sides. You're just continuing the same type of thinking you're accusing others of doing.

Peace can happen when the left and right start admitting their faults and try to find ground in the middle, instead of all this finger pointing.

I'm mostly left, accept the results of the election and am not protesting. Can we just agree that there are hypocrites and idiots all over the worlds regardless of their ideologies?
 
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Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I'm mostly left, accept the results of the election and am not protesting. Can we just agree that there are hypocrites and idiots all over the worlds regardless of their ideologies?
But I did see you put a whoopee cushion on esmith's chair.
Tell me that's not partisan revenge!
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Violence is the primary tool of class struggle, only perhaps rivaled by the general strike.
Marxists oppose individual terrorism, however encouraging nonviolence will sustain undemocratic and tyrannical governments all over the world.
The system does not support the change we want to institute, the violent path has been imposed on the revolutionary, it is not their preferred method of change.
Any protesters, either anti or pro Trump, who dare try such tactics against
my business might discover that the violent path has a painful downside.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!
 

Parchment

Active Member
One difference between the anti-Trump protests and the apparently Trump-inspired hate crimes seems to be that the violence which has occurred during some of anti-Trump protests appears to be directed at breaking store windows and setting fire to dumpsters and such. But the Trump-inspired hate crime violence has been targeted not only at property (mostly in the form of hate-themed graffiti) but also targeted at people:
Can we at the very least all agree that violence -- any violence -- whether from the Left or from the Right -- should be unequivocally condemned by everyone of us?

There was plenty of personal violence against Trump supporters before the election and most likely it is still continuing, it is easily found from numerous sources and you know this.
Here is one example :
Anti-Trump Violence Sweeps the Nation | LifeZette.
Although not all the protesters are college students I found this interesting and agree with Rudy Giuliani's assessment of them:
Rudy Giuliani calls anti-Trump college students 'spoiled crybabie
It was a fair election and Trump won, if one doesn't like it they can try again in four years.
As to your original question I fully condone the anti-Trump protesters use of violence because it exposes them as the intolerent, democracy hating thugs that they truly are which in turn will only further to strengthen the resolve of the right. As far as the admittedly small amount of violence supposedly committed by Trump supporters, I see it as senseless and counterproductive.
 

Quetzal

A little to the left and slightly out of focus.
Premium Member
That is the correct message.

Unfortunately @Sunstone did not say this. He sought to distinguish between the violence depending on party affiliation.
I didn't see his intention that way. I do not think that was the purpose of the OP. At any rate, probably just a misunderstanding.
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
I'm curious what those people who have so passionately condemned the anti-Trump protests make of these developments:

Donald Trump's victory followed by wave of hate crime attacks against minorities across US - led by his supporters

KKK announces North Carolina ‘victory’ parade

People Share Frightening Images In The Aftermath Of Trump’s Victory

Welcome to Trump’s America: 87 reports of people bullied by emboldened bigots — and the list is growing

Trump fans film themselves driving through women’s college and harassing black students

One difference between the anti-Trump protests and the apparently Trump-inspired hate crimes seems to be that the violence which has occurred during some of anti-Trump protests appears to be directed at breaking store windows and setting fire to dumpsters and such. But the Trump-inspired hate crime violence has been targeted not only at property (mostly in the form of hate-themed graffiti) but also targeted at people:


Can we at the very least all agree that violence -- any violence -- whether from the Left or from the Right -- should be unequivocally condemned by everyone of us?

Answering the question at the end which is title for the thread, I agree. But I see it as shallow gesture. I think each side needs to take care of own foremost, and if that fails for whatever reason, then rest assured that the other side will seek to halt it. Hopefully correct it. Hopefully we can all work together to correcting it.

The one difference thing you cite is not what I'm seeing. Plenty of video evidence on RF of anti-Trump people assaulting people or emotionally tormenting (children) for even daring to support Trump.

Which just relates to the narrative of this thread. You present link after link of pro-Trump people engaging in criminal type actions, but ignore the same on own side. Intellectually dishonest in this type of thread, if I do say so myself. I'd address each of the links and what I think ought to be done, but currently don't see why, when there is seemingly no balance at work in the thread. I hope that changes.
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
I noticed @Acim keeps rating my posts funny. It would be nice if he actually had something intelligent to offer instead of hiding behind passive-aggressive ratings.

He does, but perhaps you could follow him to find out. Or just continue to violate forum rules for reasons that aren't clear.
 

Mister_T

Forum Relic
Premium Member
He does, but perhaps you could follow him to find out. Or just continue to violate forum rules for reasons that aren't clear.
I'd be interested to hear why you think my post is funny since we appear to be at opposite ends.

Also, there's a report button for any perceived violation of forum rules that you are free to use at any time.
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
I'd be interested to hear why you think my post is funny since we appear to be at opposite ends.

Also, there's a report button for any perceived violation of forum rules that you are free to use at any time.

Why wouldn't you ask me why I found it funny in PM? Why make the point about my intelligence on open forum rather than the points up for discussion? The post right before yours is example of me offering something intelligent to the point up for discussion in this thread, and yet, you asked it on open forum anyway. How special of you.
 

Mister_T

Forum Relic
Premium Member
Why wouldn't you ask me why I found it funny in PM? Why make the point about my intelligence on open forum rather than the points up for discussion? The post right before yours is example of me offering something intelligent to the point up for discussion in this thread, and yet, you asked it on open forum anyway. How special of you.
Because it's seems pretty obvious we don't agree, am I mistaken? If so, then I apologize. You still avoiding to answer why you find my posts "funny" in that regard though, seems to confirm you just wanting to be passive aggressive, when I'd actually be more interested in hearing your rebuttal.
 

Acim

Revelation all the time
Because it's seems pretty obvious we don't agree, am I mistaken? If so, then I apologize. You still avoiding to answer why you find my posts "funny" in that regard though, seems to confirm you just wanting to be passive aggressive, when I'd actually be more interested in hearing your rebuttal.

Fine, I'll do it here on open forum. The reason (as if I need one) why I rated your post saying, "Let's agree you're being unashamedly biased" is because I see that as hypocrisy galore on this thread. So, I see it as "let's agree you are being unashamedly bias." That's the not so funny rebuttal, but to me, your statement is best read as "we are all (plausibly) being unashamedly bias." Yet, because you assertion seeks to somehow, magically, exclude you from the unashamed bias, I find that funny. Hilarious, in fact.
 
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