Can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by your own thought ?

[chinu]

involuntary actions

This is not off topic, it directly replies to your op. Just because it is in opposition to your claim does not make it off topic, what it does is explain where the op is wrong.


The point is the Medulla oblongata was the first part of the brain of all mammals to evolve. Thinking came much later

Some info if you want to educate yourself
Medulla oblongata - Wikipedia

No one has control over involuntary actions.
Now, let me say ones actions are driven by involuntary actions and thoughts (both). Now can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by thought and involuntary actions ?

 

[sayak83]

If the question is -- How did we get here and where are we going .
Then the answer is -- Our thoughts brought us here, and we are driven by your own thoughts all the time. Even one of my thought compelled me to post this here on RF.

I don't know whether this realisation of mine is true or not, but, when I realised this I started crying helplessly becuase I failed to come across any of my action that was NOT driven by my thought/s.

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly, do you ?

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly becuase I think this helplessly-crying is only true devotion/prayer towards God to overcome my thoughts.

OR, can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by your own thought (other than involuntary actions) ?

I would want my actions to be driven by my thoughts. After all, much of what I am is a collection of thoughts. So basically this would mean that I am driving my actions...a happy state of affairs indeed.

 

[ChristineM]

No one has control over involuntary actions.
Now, let me say ones actions are driven by involuntary actions and thoughts (both). Now can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by thought and involuntary actions ?

What else is there i don't believe in magic

 

[Stevicus]

No one has control over involuntary actions.
Now, let me say ones actions are driven by involuntary actions and thoughts (both). Now can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by thought and involuntary actions ?

It could be a combination of the two, although sometimes even "thought" can be a bit murky. I think of this when I can't remember where I put something. I might be having a cup of coffee, and then go into some other room, set it down, and then forget that I put it there. So, I'm wondering, "Where the heck did I put my coffee cup?" It's obviously something I did, but somehow I wasn't maintaining any kind of awareness; I just set it down and couldn't remember my thoughts.

 

[bobhikes]

If the question is -- How did we get here and where are we going .
Then the answer is -- Our thoughts brought us here, and we are driven by your own thoughts all the time. Even one of my thought compelled me to post this here on RF.

I don't know whether this realisation of mine is true or not, but, when I realised this I started crying helplessly becuase I failed to come across any of my action that was NOT driven by my thought/s.

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly, do you ?

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly becuase I think this helplessly-crying is only true devotion/prayer towards God to overcome my thoughts.

OR, can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by your own thought (other than involuntary actions) ?

Reflex, Muscle contractions, presperation, crying (get a bug in the eye or etc), Blinking, Yawning, to be fair you mind sets up certain tasks that don't require thought as short cuts and a lot of your general activities are done without thought. Its why you do certain things everyday or do certain things a certain way everyday. An example would be getting out of bed you put a certain foot down every time, you don't think about it.

 

[chinu]

It could be a combination of the two, although sometimes even "thought" can be a bit murky. I think of this when I can't remember where I put something. I might be having a cup of coffee, and then go into some other room, set it down, and then forget that I put it there. So, I'm wondering, "Where the heck did I put my coffee cup?" It's obviously something I did, but somehow I wasn't maintaining any kind of awareness; I just set it down and couldn't remember my thoughts.

In this secnario the action is -- "You FORGOT where you put your coffee cup"

 

[chinu]

Reflex, Muscle contractions, presperation, crying (get a bug in the eye or etc), Blinking, Yawning, to be fair you mind sets up certain tasks that don't require thought as short cuts and a lot of your general activities are done without thought. Its why you do certain things everyday or do certain things a certain way everyday. An example would be getting out of bed you put a certain foot down every time, you don't think about it.

In this secnario the action is -- "What made you doing certain things everyday or doing certain things a certain way everyday"

 

[bobhikes]

In this secnario the action is -- "What made you doing certain things everyday or doing certain things a certain way everyday"

Its not a thought process, its a routine. The mind creates routines for repeated tasks so that it can free itself up to be able to think for exceptions, predictions and Indepth processing. I wake up in the morning and my process is get out of bed, make coffee, get clothes, and take shower, etc. None of it is a thought its just a setup routine unless an exception arises then my thoughts will resolve the exception. I will start the coffee and have a problem in the shower, I may have to go back and physically check if the coffee is on because I won't be able to remember as there was no thought process for doing it. If there was an exception with the making of the coffee I can easily remember. An exception could be I spilled coffee beans or banged the pot while filling it. Consider the routines basically the reflex's of the mind. Bang a Knee and the leg will move, your eye will blink, and your heart will beat, these things will happen even if your mind is out of function.

 

[Stevicus]

In this secnario the action is -- "You FORGOT where you put your coffee cup"

Yes, but did I think about forgetting, or was it an involuntary action?

 

[Twilight Hue]

.......

Whether involuntary actions came first, or thoughts came first, or both came at the same time. Point is NOT what is driving ones action. Point is helplessness.

I would say it's adequate proof we are not in charge.

That community of living organisms called 'you' actually is.

This thing commomly referred to as 'you' can only drive this organic mech called the body.

 

[Nakosis]

If the question is -- How did we get here and where are we going .
Then the answer is -- Our thoughts brought us here, and we are driven by your own thoughts all the time. Even one of my thought compelled me to post this here on RF.

I don't know whether this realisation of mine is true or not, but, when I realised this I started crying helplessly becuase I failed to come across any of my action that was NOT driven by my thought/s.

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly, do you ?

I don't feel shy/shame crying-helplessly becuase I think this helplessly-crying is only true devotion/prayer towards God to overcome my thoughts.

OR, can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by your own thought (other than involuntary actions) ?

Conscious or unconscious thought?

IMO, sure we are driven mostly by unconscious thought. Whatever is going on behind the scene at a level we are not consciously aware of.

Conscious thought rarely drives us forward. Usually we are reacting to whatever our unconscious mind thinks we should be doing at the time.

 

[Nakosis]

It is possible, with practice, to stop thinking. But is it possible to act without thinking? That might depend on how we define thought, and what an unclothed thought looks like. There are activities - sport, dance, sex - where apparently spontaneous action is both achievable and desirable. Spontaneity is action without forethought, is it not?

To act without consciously thinking, sure.
One can sit there as a conscious observer and watch the unconscious mind go about it's business.

Like with public speaking, if I new the subject well, I could just let my subconscious take over giving the speech while consciously I was not engaged.

I could watch myself including responding to questions without consciously thinking.

 

[Nakosis]

Heartbeat, breathing is NOT an action.

Not a conscious action. So again, if you limit it to conscious thought then yes. The subconscious or unconscious mind is perfectly capable of going about life without conscious direction.

 

[Nakosis]

No one has control over involuntary actions.
Now, let me say ones actions are driven by involuntary actions and thoughts (both). Now can you suggest any of your action that is NOT driven by thought and involuntary actions ?

Well you got voluntary and involuntary actions, what else is possible?

Being opposite of each other they include every possibility unless you think there is some external entity going about controlling us like puppets.

Well never mind that would fall under involuntary. So you are stating the obvious since every possibility is covered.

 

[RestlessSoul]

To act without consciously thinking, sure.
One can sit there as a conscious observer and watch the unconscious mind go about it's business.

Like with public speaking, if I new the subject well, I could just let my subconscious take over giving the speech while consciously I was not engaged.

I could watch myself including responding to questions without consciously thinking.

So there is a separation there, between the thinker, and the observer of the thought, which is most intriguing; who or what is the internal observer, detached from the thoughts unfolding in what appears to be a shared consciousness?

Eckhart Tolle covers some of this ground in 'The Power of Now' when he describes having the thought "I cannot live with myself", followed by the question "Who or what is this 'I', and who or what is the self it cannot live with?"

 

[Nakosis]

So there is a separation there, between the thinker, and the observer of the thought, which is most intriguing; who or what is the internal observer, detached from the thoughts unfolding in what appears to be a shared consciousness?

Eckhart Tolle covers some of this ground in 'The Power of Now' when he describes having the thought "I cannot live with myself", followed by the question "Who or what is this 'I', and who or what is the self it cannot live with?"

I agree it is intriguing. Something which is difficult to understand. It seems one cannot observe the observer.

 

[Trailblazer]

It is possible, with practice, to stop thinking.

I know. It is called thought stopping. I practice it a lot all throughout the day since there are many thoughts I do not want to have, thoughts about the past. If I have those thoughts I fast forward to the present.

Why think about the past and what we no longer have? The past is gone. Many people are in constant grief because they dwell upon the past.

 

[Whateverist]

If the question is -- How did we get here and where are we going .
Then the answer is -- Our thoughts brought us here, and we are driven by your own thoughts all the time. Even one of my thought compelled me to post this here on RF.

I don't know whether this realisation of mine is true or not, but, when I realised this I started crying helplessly becuase I failed to come across any of my action that was NOT driven by my thought/s.

I'm not so sure our thoughts have all that much to do with our actions. It is much more complicated than that. In his 2012 book The Righteous Mind: Why Good People are Divided by Politics and Religion Jonathon Haidt explores the nature of our moral sense and the role reason plays in how we act. In it he suggest that our reason is something like a mahout who sits on an elephant and directs his actions -to some extent, depending on the quality of their relationship and elephant's mood. We are embodied beings with emotions and feelings subject to the imprint of past learned experience. There is nothing simple about what we are or how we work, and it is certainly no where near as mechanistic as this may make it sound.

Great book by the way, not at all connected to religions but more insightful about morality/ethics than anything else I've read.

 

[Stevicus]

It is possible, with practice, to stop thinking. But is it possible to act without thinking? That might depend on how we define thought, and what an unclothed thought looks like. There are activities - sport, dance, sex - where apparently spontaneous action is both achievable and desirable. Spontaneity is action without forethought, is it not?

If you stop thinking, then how do you start up again?

With sports and other such activities, I've heard the term "muscle memory" in which you practice something so much that it becomes second nature and you don't have to even think about it.

 

[Whateverist]

I know. It is called thought stopping. I practice it a lot all throughout the day since there are many thoughts I do not want to have, thoughts about the past. If I have those thoughts I fast forward to the present.

Why think about the past and what we no longer have? The past is gone. Many people are in constant grief because they dwell upon the past.

I don't think it is thinking or thoughts that one should wish to stop, only the needless self narration of our doings. Words don't help.