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Challenge: The Quran is not taken from the Bible

This is in reply to Bowman, who continually states that the Quran is merely copied from the Bible. Bowman has asked I provide any portion of the Quran, and he will show where it has been plagiarised from in the bible.

I would ask a moderator to please judge this discussion. Bowman has a habit to not accept manifest truth.

So, the portion I select is Surah-Fatiha. It is called the "Mother of the Book" (i.e. Quran). The Holy Prophet has stated that it is a summary of the Quran, and contains all it's beauties and truths.

Provide a passage from the bible that contains the same spiritual truths as contained in this short chapter of the Quran. And by passage, I mean provide the same explanation of this verse as I provide, which I will based on the Qur'an. If this is a passage from the bible, show from where it is, and show how the passage from the bible is better than it is written in Fatiha.

So, it's a challenge of exegesis and explanation as well. Accept if you please, but make sure you provide a detailed commentary as well, otherwise, we'll just be bickering.
 

Bowman

Active Member
This is in reply to Bowman, who continually states that the Quran is merely copied from the Bible. Bowman has asked I provide any portion of the Quran, and he will show where it has been plagiarised from in the bible.

I would ask a moderator to please judge this discussion. Bowman has a habit to not accept manifest truth.

So, the portion I select is Surah-Fatiha. It is called the "Mother of the Book" (i.e. Quran). The Holy Prophet has stated that it is a summary of the Quran, and contains all it's beauties and truths.

Provide a passage from the bible that contains the same spiritual truths as contained in this short chapter of the Quran. And by passage, I mean provide the same explanation of this verse as I provide, which I will based on the Qur'an. If this is a passage from the bible, show from where it is, and show how the passage from the bible is better than it is written in Fatiha.

So, it's a challenge of exegesis and explanation as well. Accept if you please, but make sure you provide a detailed commentary as well, otherwise, we'll just be bickering.


Please provide your rendering of this chapter for comparison, brother...
 

ZooGirl02

Well-Known Member
I don't know if the Quran was taken from the Bible or not. I do know that it has many similarities to the Bible though. That said, I do not believe that the Quran is a divine book.
 

Islam432

Practicing Muslim
1. MUHUMMAD (PBUH) WAS AN ILLITERATE

The theory that Muhummad (pbuh) authored the Qur’an or copied from other sources can be disproved by the single historical fact that he was illiterate.

Allah testifies Himself in the Qur’an

In Surah Al-Ankabut chapter no.29 verse 48

"And thou was not (able) to recite a Book before this (Book came), nor art thou (able) to transcribe it with thy right hand: in that case, indeed, would the talkers of vanities have doubted."

[Al-Qur’an 29:48]

Allah (swt) knew that many would doubt the authenticity of the Qur’an and would ascribe it to Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). Therefore Allah in His Divine Wisdom chose the last and final Messenger to be an ‘Ummi’, i.e. unlettered, so that the talkers of vanity would not then have the slightest justification to doubt the Prophet. The accusation of his enemies that he had copied the Qur’an from other sources and rehashed it all in a beautiful language might have carried some weight, but even this flimsy pretence has been deprived to the unbeliever and the cynic.

Allah reconfirms in the Qur’an in Surah Al A’raf chapter 7 verse 157:

"Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (Scriptures) in the Law and the Gospel"


The prophecy of coming of the unlettered Prophet (pbuh) is also mentioned in the Bible in the book of Isaiah chapter 29 verse 12.

"And the book is delivered to him that is not learned."

[Isaiah 29:12]

The Qur’an testifies in no less than four different places that the Prophet (pbuh) was illiterate. It is also mentioned in Surah A’raf chapter 7 verse 158 and in Surah Al-Jumu’a chapter 62 verse 2.

2. ARABIC VERSION OF THE BIBLE WAS NOT PRESENT

The Arabic version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet. The oldest Arabic version of the new Testament was published by Erpenius in 1616 C.E. - about a thousand years after the demise of our Prophet.

3. SIMILARITIES IN THE QUR’AN AND THE BIBLE DUE TO COMMON SOURCE

Similarities between the Qur’an and the Bible does not necessarily mean that the former has been copied from the latter. In fact it gives evidence that both of them are based on a common third source; all divine revelations came from the same source - the one universal God. No matter what human changes were introduced into some of these Judeo-Christian and other older religious scriptures that had distorted their originality, there are some areas that have remained free from distortion and thus are common to many religions.

It is true that there are some similar parallels between the Qur’an and the Bible but this is not sufficient to accuse Muhummad (pbuh) of compiling or copying from the Bible. The same logic would then also be applicable to teachings of Christianity and Judaism and thus one could wrongly claim that Jesus (pbuh) was not a genuine Prophet (God forbid) and that he simply copied from the Old Testament.

The similarities between the two signify a common source that is one true God and the continuation of the basic message of monotheism and not that the later prophets have plagiarised from the previous prophets.

If someone copies during an examination he will surely not write in the answer sheet that he has copied from his neighbour or Mr. XYZ. Prophet Muhummad (pbuh) gave due respect and credit to all the previous prophets (pbut). The Qur’an also mentions the various revelations given by Almighty God to different prophets.

4. MUSLIMS BELIEVE IN THE TAURAH, ZABOOR, INJEEL AND QUR’AN


Four revelations of Allah (swt) are mentioned by name in the Qur’an: the Taurah, the Zaboor, the Injeel and the Qur’an.

Taurah, the revelation i.e. the Wahi given to Moosa (a. s.) i.e. Moses (pbuh).

Zaboor, the revelation i.e. the Wahi given to Dawood (a.s.) i.e. David (pbuh).

Injeel, the revelation i.e. the Wahi given to Isa (A.S.) ie. Jesus (pbuh).

‘Al-Qur’an’, the last and final Wahi i.e. revelation given to the last and final Messenger Muhammad (pbuh).

It is an article of faith for every Muslim to believe in all the Prophets of God and all revelations of God. However, the present day Bible has the first five books of the Old Testament attributed to Moses and the Psalms attributed to David. Moreover the New Testament or the four Gospels of the New Testament are not the Taurah, the Zaboor or the Injeel, which the Qur’an refers to. These books of the present day Bible may partly contain the word of God but these books are certainly not the exact, accurate and complete revelations given to the prophets.

The Qur’an presents all the different prophets of Allah as belonging to one single brotherhood; all had a similar prophetic mission and the same basic message. Because of this, the fundamental teachings of the major faiths cannot be contradictory, even if there has been a considerable passage of time between the different prophetic missions, because the source of these missions was one: Almighty God, Allah. This is why the Qur’an says that the differences which exist between various religions are not the responsibility of the prophets, but of the followers of these prophets who forgot part of what they had been taught, and furthermore, misinterpreted and changed the scriptures. The Qur’an cannot therefore be seen as a scripture which competes with the teachings of Moses, Jesus and the other prophets. On the contrary, it confirms, completes and perfects the messages that they brought to their people.



Another name for the Qur’an is the ‘The Furqan’ which means the criteria to judge the right from the wrong, and it is on the basis of the Qur’an that we can decipher which part of the previous scriptures can be considered to be the word of God.
 

Islam432

Practicing Muslim
5. SCIENTIFIC COMPARISON BETWEEN QUR’AN AND BIBLE

If you glance through the Bible and the Qur’an you may find several points which appear to be exactly the same in both of them, but when you analyse them closely, you realise that there is a difference of ‘chalk and cheese’ between them. Only based on historical details it is difficult for someone who is neither conversant with Christianity or Islam to come to a firm decision as to which of the scriptures is true; however if you verify the relevant passages of both the scriptures against scientific knowledge, you will yourself realize the truth.

a) Creation of the Universe in Six Days

As per the Bible, in the first book of Genesis in Chapter One, the universe was created in six days and each day is defined as a twenty-four hours period. Even though the Qur’an mentions that the universe was created in six ‘Ayyaams’, ‘Ayyaam’ is the plural of years; this word has two meanings: firstly, it means a standard twenty-four hours period i.e. a day, and secondly, it also means stage, period or epoch which is a very long period of time.

When the Qur’an mentions that the universe was created in six ‘Ayyaams’, it refers to the creation of the heavens and the earth in six long periods or epochs; scientists have no objection to this statement. The creation of the universe has taken billions of years, which proves false or contradicts the concept of the Bible which states that the creation of the Universe took six days of twenty-four hour durations each.

b) Sun Created After the Day

The Bible says in chapter 1, verses 3-5, of Genesis that the phenomenon of day and night was created on the first day of creation of the Universe by God. The light circulating in the universe is the result of a complex reaction in the stars; these stars were created according to the Bible (Genesis chapter 1 verse 14 to 19) on the fourth day. It is illogical to mention the result that is the light (the phenomenon of day and night) was created on the first day of Creation when the cause or source of the light was created three days later. Moreover the existence of evening and morning as elements of a single day is only conceivable after the creation of the earth and its rotation around the sun. In contrast with the contents of the Bible on this issue, the Qur’an does not give any unscientific sequence of Creation. Hence it is absolutely absurd to say that Prophet Muhummad (pbuh) copied the passages pertaining to the creation of the universe from the Bible but missed out this illogical and fantastic sequence of the Bible.


c) Creation of the Sun, The Earth and the Moon

According to the Bible, Book of Genesis, chapter 1, verses 9 to 13, the earth was created on the third day, and as per verses 14 to 19, the sun and the moon were created on the fourth day. The earth and the moon emanated, as we know, from their original star, the Sun. Hence to place the creation of the sun and the moon after the creation of the earth is contrary to the established idea about the formation of the solar system.

d) Vegetation Created on the third day and Sun on the fourth day

According to the Bible, Book of Genesis, chapter 1, verses 11-13, vegetation was created on the third day along with seed-bearing grasses, plants and trees; and further on as per verses 14-19, the sun was created on the fourth day. How is it scientifically possible for the vegetation to have appeared without the presence of the sun, as has been stated in the Bible?



If Prophet Muhummad (pbuh) was indeed the author of the Qur’an and had copied its contents from the Bible, how did he manage to avoid the factual errors that the Bible contains? The Qur’an does not contain any statements which are incompatible with scientific facts.


e) The Sun and the Moon both Emit light

According to the Bible both the sun and the moon emit their own light. In the Book of Genesis, chapter 1, verse 16 says, "And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night".

Science tells us today that the moon does not have its own light. This confirms the Qur’anic concept that the light of the moon is a reflected light. To think that 1400 years ago, Prophet Muhummad (pbuh) corrected these scientific errors in the Bible and then copied such corrected passages in the Qur’an is to think of something impossible.

6. ADAM (PBUH), THE FIRST MAN ON EARTH, LIVED 5,800 YEARS AGO

As per the genealogy of Jesus Christ given in the Bible, from Jesus through Abraham (pbuh) to the first man on earth i.e. Adam (pbuh), Adam appeared on the earth approximately 5800 years ago:

1948 years between Adam (pbuh) and Abraham (pbuh)

Approximately 1800 years between Abraham (pbuh) and Jesus (pbuh)

2000 years from Jesus (pbuh) till today

These figures are further confused by the fact that the Jewish calendar is currently on or about 5800 years old.

There is sufficient evidence from archaeological and anthropological sources to suggest that the first human being on earth was present tens of thousands of years ago and not merely 5,800 years ago as is suggested by the Bible.

The Qur’an too speaks about Adam (pbuh) as the first man on earth but it does not suggest any date or period of his life on earth, unlike the Bible - what the Bible says in this regard is totally incompatible with science.



7. NOAH (PBUH) AND THE FLOOD



The Biblical description of the flood in Genesis chapter 6, 7 and 8 indicates that the deluge was universal and it destroyed every living thing on earth, except those present with Noah (pbuh) in the ark. The description suggests that the event took place 1656 years after the creation of Adam (pbuh) or 292 years before the birth of Abraham, at a time when Noah (pbuh) was 600 years old. Thus the flood may have occurred in the 21st or 22nd Century B.C.

This story of the flood, as given in the Bible, contradicts scientific evidence from archaelogical sources which indicate that the eleventh dynasty in Egypt and the third dynasty in Babylonia were in existence without any break in civilisation and in a manner totally unaffected by any major calamity which may have occurred in the 21st century B.C. This contradicts the Biblical story that the whole world had been immersed in the flood water. In contrast to this, the Qur’anic presentation of the story of Noah and the flood does not conflict with scientific evidence or archaeological data; firstly, the Qur’an does not indicate any specific date or year of the occurance of that event, and secondly, according to the Qur’an the flood was not a universal phenomenon which destroyed complete life on earth. In fact the Qur’an specifically mentions that the flood was a localised event only involving the people of Noah.

It is illogical to assume that Prophet Muhummad (pbuh) had borrowed the story of the flood from the Bible and corrected the mistakes before mentioning it in the Qur’an.

8. MOSES (PBUH) AND PHARAOH OF THE EXODUS


The story of Moses (pbuh) and the Pharaoh of the Exodus are very much identical in the Qur’an and the Bible. Both scriptures agree that the Pharaoh drowned when he tried to pursue Moses (pbuh) and led the Israelites across a stretch of water that they crossed. The Qur’an gives an additional piece of information in Surah Yunus chapter 10 verse 92:


"This day shall We save thee in thy body, that thou mayest be a sign to those who come after thee! But verily, many among mankind are heedless of Our Signs!"

[Al-Qur’an 10:92]



Dr. Maurice Bucaille, after a thorough research proved that although Rameses II was known to have persecuted the Israelites as per the Bible, he actually died while Moses (pbuh) was taking refuge in Median. Rameses II’s son Merneptah who succeeded him as Pharaoh drowned during the exodus. In 1898, the mummified body of Merneptah was found in the valley of Kings in Egypt. In 1975, Dr. Maurice Bucaille with other doctors received permission to examine the Mummy of Merneptah, the findings of which proved that Merneptah probably died from drowning or a violent shock which immediately preceeded the moment of drowning. Thus the Qur’anic verse that we shall save his body as a sign, has been fulfilled by the Pharaohs’ body being kept at the Royal Mummies room in the Egyptian Museum in Cairo.



This verse of the Qur’an compelled Dr. Maurice Bucaille, who was a Christian then, to study the Qur’an. He later wrote a book ‘The Bible, the Qur’an and Science’, and confessed that the author of the Qur’an can be no one else besides God Himself. Thus he embraced Islam.


9. QUR’AN IS A BOOK FROM ALLAH

These evidences are sufficient to conclude that the Qur’an was not copied from the Bible, but that the Qur’an is the Furqaan - ‘the Criteria’ to judge right from wrong and it should be used to decipher which portion of the Bible may be considered as the Word of God.



The Qur’an itself testifies in Surah Sajda chapter 32 verse 1 to 3

Alif Laam Meem.

(This is) the revelation of the Book in which there is no doubt – from the Lord of the Worlds.

Or do they say, ‘He has forged it’? Nay, it is the Truth from thy Lord, that thou mayest admonish a people to whom no warner has come before thee: in order that they may receive guidance." [Al-Qur’an 32:1-3]
 

DeitySlayer

President of Chindia
Er, Islam432, current scientific conensus on evolution also invalidates the Qur'an. Yet you claim that this will be overturned some time in the future, and Creation will be proved correct. Can Christians not claim the same of the 'errors' in the Bible, i.e. current consensus on the formation of the solar system, radiocarbon dating, how long ago humans were on Earth, etcetera.
 

Bowman

Active Member
2. ARABIC VERSION OF THE BIBLE WAS NOT PRESENT

The Arabic version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet. The oldest Arabic version of the new Testament was published by Erpenius in 1616 C.E. - about a thousand years after the demise of our Prophet.

You just keep right on plagarizing webpaste don't you brother?

Can't you come up with your own original material?

The authors of the Koran copied their opus from the original Biblical languages, brother.

The authors whom you cut-n-pasted your plagiarism from should have known this.
 

fatibi

New Member
You just keep right on plagarizing webpaste don't you brother?

Can't you come up with your own original material?

The authors of the Koran copied their opus from the original Biblical languages, brother.

The authors whom you cut-n-pasted your plagiarism from should have known this.
Hi i read ur comment,
@"Can't you come up with your own original material?"
his own original material?He is giving u historical facts,its a fact that The Arabic version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet. The oldest Arabic version of the new Testament was published by Erpenius in 1616 C.E. - about a thousand years after the demise of our Prophet.
r u denying these facts?
the similarities between Qur'an and Bible r because they r from same source,i.e. the one and only creator of the universe,Allah(swt).
 

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet.
However, you neglect to point out that there were still Arab Jews and Christians. They would have known their material. Arabic, Aramaic and Hebrew are sister languages--Semitic languages. Translating from one to the other language would not be the most difficult task in the world because they are related to some degree. It's not translating from Zulu to Chinese, it's not much different(in the case of Hebrew to Arabic) to translating from Dutch or German into English.

Therefore, although there was no written text of the Old or New Testament, there were still adherents to those faiths there, who would have had some understanding of the texts and would have been comfortable discussing their religious views. There were adherents, who would have discussed it, who would be fluent in Hebrew and Aramaic, and even some who were learned in Koine Greek and Latin, who would have had a good idea of the meanings behind it, so there is every possibility that Muhammad learnt of the stories of the Bible from people who knew them who spoke the same language as him: Arab-speaking Jews and Christians.

the similarities between Qur'an and Bible r because they r from same source,i.e. the one and only creator of the universe,Allah(swt).
Can you prove that?
 

Bowman

Active Member
]
Hi i read ur comment,
@"Can't you come up with your own original material?"
his own original material?He is giving u historical facts,its a fact that The Arabic version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet. The oldest Arabic version of the new Testament was published by Erpenius in 1616 C.E. - about a thousand years after the demise of our Prophet.
r u denying these facts?

The authors of the Koran quite plainly state that they translated the Holy Bible into Arabic.

The Holy Bible was written in Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek.

Why are you looking for an Arabic Bible?






the similarities between Qur'an and Bible r because they r from same source,i.e. the one and only creator of the universe,Allah(swt).

Thanks for noting that there are similarities.

Most followers of Islam deny even this simple fact.

The reason they are so similar is because the Koran copied the Holy Bible.

>75% of the Koran was wholesale copied from the Biblical Book of Revelation, alone.
 

A Thousand Suns

Rationalist
Er, Islam432, current scientific conensus on evolution also invalidates the Qur'an. Yet you claim that this will be overturned some time in the future, and Creation will be proved correct. Can Christians not claim the same of the 'errors' in the Bible, i.e. current consensus on the formation of the solar system, radiocarbon dating, how long ago humans were on Earth, etcetera.

"current scientific conensus on evolution also invalidates the Qur'an"

plz show me
 

yodh

Member
This is in reply to Bowman, who continually states that the Quran is merely copied from the Bible. Bowman has asked I provide any portion of the Quran, and he will show where it has been plagiarised from in the bible.

I would ask a moderator to please judge this discussion. Bowman has a habit to not accept manifest truth.



So, the portion I select is Surah-Fatiha. It is called the "Mother of the Book" (i.e. Quran). The Holy Prophet has stated that it is a summary of the Quran, and contains all it's beauties and truths.

Provide a passage from the bible that contains the same spiritual truths as contained in this short chapter of the Quran. And by passage, I mean provide the same explanation of this verse as I provide, which I will based on the Qur'an. If this is a passage from the bible, show from where it is, and show how the passage from the bible is better than it is written in Fatiha.

So, it's a challenge of exegesis and explanation as well. Accept if you please, but make sure you provide a detailed commentary as well, otherwise, we'll just be bickering.

The so called quran was not God-inspired.
If so, 1John 4:1 states "Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world."
If the Bible is the ONLY book given by God, then disregard Quran.
 

England my lionheart

Rockerjahili Rebel
Premium Member
Hi i read ur comment,
@"Can't you come up with your own original material?"
his own original material?He is giving u historical facts,its a fact that The Arabic version of the Bible was not present at the time of Prophet Muhummad (pbuh). The earliest Arabic version of the Old Testament is that of R. Saadias Gaon of 900 C.E. - more than 250 years after the death of our beloved Prophet. The oldest Arabic version of the new Testament was published by Erpenius in 1616 C.E. - about a thousand years after the demise of our Prophet.
r u denying these facts?
the similarities between Qur'an and Bible r because they r from same source,i.e. the one and only creator of the universe,Allah(swt).

Would it be the case that the stories in the OT were conveyed orally and as Muhammed was a Merchant and travelled could he have heard these stories many times.
 

Starsoul

Truth
You just keep right on plagarizing webpaste don't you brother?

Can't you come up with your own original material?

The authors of the Koran copied their opus from the original Biblical languages, brother.

If i was to copy anything from bible to the Quran, being a muslim, you think I'd include chapters and references given to Jews and christians in the Quran? how silly to even say that bible got copied into Quran (AstaghfirullAh) you havent even read the book, it is just That obvious. ( with due respect, isnt it strange coming from people who cannot even assemble or agree upon one version of bible to show any coherence in their stance, There are well over tens and forties of versions of just one bible and yet it is not comprehensive, )

I and all muslims Totally Respect the book even then, and All muslims have complete regard for the bible and the torah (because they were originally divine scriptures untill they got interrupted), The only point christians and jews mis-interpret about Islam, to the point where they even REFUSE to acknowledge any Prophet other their own, and Any book other than their own, how biased is that? It is only fair to point out the fact that to understand one divine religion, one has to go through all books to even have an opinion against one, out of pure bias.

It is Quran that talks about christianity, judaism and Islam being the same spirits of a same religion, coming from a same source. It is highly probable that earlier divine books went through personal human modifications( out of jealousy or whatever) to misguide the humanity, because SOME people wanted to gain out of it, and they HAVE gained tremendously out of it , for those who do not see that they rule the world today and all its resources.

If Quran had several versions too, one could doubt its origin, but i guess it makes some people sad and angry that The Quran is the only un-disputed One version divine book from day one to the day it will last. Its only bias that would keep people away from it, nothing else.
 
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Starsoul

Truth
The so called quran was not God-inspired.
If so, 1John 4:1 states "Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world."
If the Bible is the ONLY book given by God, then disregard Quran.

A fine example of pure Bias :)

My book is the real one, leave yours. valid argument. What you quoted from the bible says,

Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world

If there wasn't to arrive another inspired expression from God, why would God include this VAGUE quote in the bible that You must test the inspired expression to see whether it comes from God? If Bible was the final word of God, why would God even indicate towards testing of new inspired versions? Care to comment?
 
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