Changing Races , Changing Religions?

[bobhikes]

Race/Ethnicity is just an imperfect way to classify the diversity in the human race across the globe. It is not something that can be precisely defined and labeled as you seem to be implying its proponents claim. It helps us understand the relationship and closeness of the various ethnic groups of the world. Classification systems are not perfect but not meaningless either.

In the scientific world race has been found to be relativity useless even ethnicity is not very useful. People of the same ethnicity that live on the coast will be genetically different than the ones that live in the mountains. A man is more genetically similar to another man of any ethnicity than a non-ancestral woman of the same ethnicity. So race, which doesn't exist and can't be precisely defined and is imperfect only maintains the ability to have bigotry of race.

 

[George-ananda]

In the scientific world race has been found to be relativity useless even ethnicity is not very useful. People of the same ethnicity that live on the coast will be genetically different than the ones that live in the mountains. A man is more genetically similar to another man of any ethnicity than a non-ancestral woman of the same ethnicity. So race, which doesn't exist and can't be precisely defined and is imperfect only maintains the ability to have bigotry of race.

Classification is useful in understanding the diversity of man. For example two Australian Aborigine ethnicities are more closely related to each other than they are to a American Indian tribe. Classification is just a way to organize our understanding of humanities spread over the planet. No harm in that. Bigotry is a separate subject and shouldn't stop us from wanting to understand the evolution of the human race.

 

[bobhikes]

Classification is useful in understanding the diversity of man. For example two Australian Aborigine ethnicities are more closely related to each other than they are to a American Indian tribe. Classification is just a way to organize our understanding of humanities spread over the planet. No harm in that. Bigotry is a separate subject and shouldn't stop us from wanting to understand the evolution of the human race.

Unless you genetically map them you could not know that. Check the science behind it. The physical differences you see are only minor genetic codes. It is just as likely as the Aborigine have more genetic differences than one Aborigine and the American Indian or even both are more similar to the American Indian than each other. Genetics has advanced they now even understand that the environment is constantly shaping our genetics. They are not fixed from birth as thought.

 

[George-ananda]

Unless you genetically map them you could not know that. Check the science behind it. The physical differences you see are only minor genetic codes. It is just as likely as the Aborigine have more genetic differences than one Aborigine and the American Indian or even both are more similar to the American Indian than each other. Genetics has advanced they now even understand that the environment is constantly shaping our genetics. They are not fixed from birth as thought.

People within an ethnic group are more genetically similar to others in their ethnic group than they are to an ethnic group from the opposite side of a globe.

 

[gnostic]

Michael Jackson had a skin disorder, vitiligo, that did that to him.
Autopsy reveals Michael Jackson's secrets - CNN.com
Doctor who did autopsy confirms Jackson had "vitiligo, a skin pigmentation disease"

That ridiculous.

If MJ had vitiligo, he would have been like piebald horse. There would be no way that his pigment would been so uniform, across his entire body, so quickly. It would have happened in patches over periods of time.

 

[bobhikes]

People within an ethnic group are more genetically similar to others in their ethnic group than they are to an ethnic group from the opposite side of a globe.

Not true Genetic differences are just as great within ethinic groups as without

Wilkapedia
A 2000 study by Celera Genomics found that human DNA does not differ significantly across populations. Citizens of any village in the world, in Scotland or Tanzania, have 90 percent of the genetic variability humanity has to offer. Only .01 percent of genes account for a person's appearance.[15] Biological adaptation plays a role in bodily features and skin type. According to Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza, "From a scientific point of view, the concept of race has failed to obtain any consensus; none is likely, given the gradual variation in existence.


Ethnicity and Nationality in Mixed Genetics
Dr. Orville Boyd Jenkins
Genetic heritage is different from our ethnicity. Ethnicity is developed or to some degree agreed upon by participants, and depends on the shared experiences and mutual acceptance. You see this in the groupings within one society, that at some level might be considered as one society, but in reality contains many ethnic groups. The native language of most groups of people in the US, for instance, is English.

But we will find distinctions at some level of society. Sometimes it is due to enforced distinction, which may be largely artificial, like the more obvious color distinctions that led to the creating of "race" as "color" in the US, forcibly separating the residents of African origin from those of European origin. Similar steps were taken against Asians and Eastern Europeans.

So the number of immigrants settling in the same community or the number of people of any similar culture living together, whether by their own choice of enforced by others, can lead to a distinction of class or caste that becomes one aspect of self-definition. These factors go into ethnic identity. Ethnicity is largely an interaction of Self-Identity with the attitude of others.

 

[JoStories]

To those that believe race is a constant feature for a person and not just homo sapiens. Please list for me the scientific definitions for the races of the world, because I have been unable to find them. Is it the White , Caucasian or European race, Is it the Black, Negro or African race and what other official races are there and there respective titles. It would help me a lot if someone can give me a scientific breakdown of race. If you can if you could identify the race of my children for me. I am French Canadian, Lithuanian, Dutch and Irish(I'm assuming you'd label me White, Caucasian or European) and my wife is (El Salvadorian which I assume is Latina, indian or Hispanic). How are my kids defined scientifically or are they a new race?

Responding only to my remark, I stand by that but and this is a large but, owing the the fact that people of various races have intermingled over generations, race is becoming less and less a factor, which I think is great. You say you are part this and that, and that proves this. I am half Scottish and half NA. My children are 1/4 NA, etc. Over more time, I think race will no longer be a factor at all but rather than we will all just be human. I look forward to that day as things like racism and bigotry will be a thing of the past. Still, there continue to be genetic markers that are only seen in some races, such as diseases that are specific to a particular race.

 

[JoStories]

That ridiculous.

If MJ had vitiligo, he would have been like piebald horse. There would be no way that his pigment would been so uniform, across his entire body, so quickly. It would have happened in patches over periods of time.

No, actually, its not ridiculous. He wore a lot of makeup to cover his vitiligo. And he did look like what you call a piebald horse. I know a doctor who has this and he does look that way. It is a well documented fact that he had this problem. I'm not sure why you are so vehemently denying this.

 

[Curious George]

Responding only to my remark, I stand by that but and this is a large but, owing the the fact that people of various races have intermingled over generations, race is becoming less and less a factor, which I think is great. You say you are part this and that, and that proves this. I am half Scottish and half NA. My children are 1/4 NA, etc. Over more time, I think race will no longer be a factor at all but rather than we will all just be human. I look forward to that day as things like racism and bigotry will be a thing of the past. Still, there continue to be genetic markers that are only seen in some races, such as diseases that are specific to a particular race.

That is ethnicity not race.

 

[JoStories]

That is ethnicity not race.

I was not aware that being Black American and being prone to Sickle Cell had now become an ethnicity rather than a racial tendency toward that particular disease.

 

[Curious George]

I was not aware that being Black American and being prone to Sickle Cell had now become an ethnicity rather than a racial tendency toward that particular disease.

Oh, glad to make you aware. Cheers.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That ridiculous.

If MJ had vitiligo, he would have been like piebald horse. There would be no way that his pigment would been so uniform, across his entire body, so quickly. It would have happened in patches over periods of time.

So even though some doctors have speculated he did have it before he died, and the doctor who done the autopsy said he really did have it, it's ridiculous to say he had it?

 

[George-ananda]

Unless you genetically map them you could not know that. Check the science behind it. The physical differences you see are only minor genetic codes. It is just as likely as the Aborigine have more genetic differences than one Aborigine and the American Indian or even both are more similar to the American Indian than each other. Genetics has advanced they now even understand that the environment is constantly shaping our genetics. They are not fixed from birth as thought.

What I am getting at is things like this:

Genetic Distance Between Ethnicities

You clearly see the closer together groups evolved geographically correlates to their similarities genetically. Studying these things help us understand the diversity of mankind.

 

[1robin]

I thought about this post for most of the afternoon, trying to decide how I was going to respond to you and I think it best to simply say this Robin.
This is my field of expertize that you so cavalierly dismiss as so much hooey. I have conducted double blind research topics in the area, written numerous papers and developed from scratch and teach a course for graduate students in the area. This subject is now taught at medical schools and is an intergral part of The Cancer Treatment Centers of America. PhD level researchers have pursued this topic alone for the PhD. Dr Swinton being one of those, along with Sister Calista Roy, PhD, Dr. Jean Watson, and let's not forget that Florence Nightingale was a staunch Christian who incorporated this practice as long ago as 150 years, and Doreatha Dix...the list is endless. There now exists a certification in Pastoral Nursing, if you're of an interest and I sincerely doubt they would suggest head hunters. There are dozens of books and text books in the topic from top names. This is what you insult madame. THe lives and work of thousands of educated and brilliant minds.

That said, we are done now.

Well I am confused. I did not say anything against what your doing. I would in fact encourage it. However it reminded me of some of those strange religions that have practices that could not be allowed in a hospital. Voodoo and the like. I wanted to know how they were handled, if you had seen any documented proof of them helping in general, and more detail. I did not insult any one or thing. I don't know what you got so offended about. I did not dismiss anything, even if a religion is false it may have some benefit. I am all for it in all but a few cases.

 

[gnostic]

So even though some doctors have speculated he did have it before he died, and the doctor who done the autopsy said he really did have it, it's ridiculous to say he had it?

no, you right. sorry

 

[JoStories]

Well I am confused. I did not say anything against what your doing. I would in fact encourage it. However it reminded me of some of those strange religions that have practices that could not be allowed in a hospital. Voodoo and the like. I wanted to know how they were handled, if you had seen any documented proof of them helping in general, and more detail. I did not insult any one or thing. I don't know what you got so offended about. I did not dismiss anything, even if a religion is false it may have some benefit. I am all for it in all but a few cases.

Ok. Maybe I misread your post and if that is the case, I am so terribly sorry Robin. I apologize to you to the nth degree. I will go back and find that post and answer you sincerely.

 

[JoStories]

That makes sense to me but I will explain why it also shocked me.



1. I am not surprised this occurs, I am surprised it is common. Medicine is a field of science and in modern times scientists have formed what almost amount to a cult (called scientism). They deny anything beyond the natural universe and so I am surprised spiritualism is considered a form of therapy these days.
2. Maybe it has value as a placebo effect but I would be hard pressed to have any confidence that any of the millions of forms of spiritualism these days contain any actual power to heal. I may bring the patient what ever priest they want I would not expect that priest to be of much medical benefit.
3. Since most religions (if true) render many others false I would feel like I had a spiritual tool box which contained 90% useless tools. I would be happy to give them their dysfunctional tool for comfort sake but I would not do so thinking it would make them better.just

As long as that person receives his or her religious authority of choice I do not see any harm in it , but unless they choose a religion which is true I can't see how it would have any power to help, except maybe as a placebo.


What if the patient is from a tribe of head hunters and the healing ritual requires sacrificing a chicken and having the blood sprinkled around the room? What about an exorcism? Or the drinking of sacred plant juices that you as a nurse know are harmful?

ok..to respond now..
1. its become known that people have a holistic ...no, that's the wrong word...we have more to us than just bones and blood. We have families and and as you know, most have a faith or spirituality. Medicine now acknowledges that as an integral part of who we are and it impacts our health. People have used massage, Reiki and such for some time, so this is a natural extension.
2. Studies have shown that battling disease can be positively impacted by scent, prayer, therapeutic touch and much more. These studies were serious double blind investigations that showed that these practices can and do impact health, such as lowering BP, heart troubles and much more. And as I said, CTCA use this extensively. Naturopathic doctors, once scoffed at as being too 'new age' are now well respected and utilized areas that impact health.
3. This remark I am not clear about and it is the one that set me to thinking you were being disrespectful. The bottom line of this is that most faiths have a common core that any person can use. Prayer exists in many faiths. Reading religious texts, regardless of which one, is beneficial to many. I don't know what you mean by 'dysfunctional tool'. Can you explain please? Also what do you mean by choosing a religion that is true? Is your faith 'true' to you? I suspect it would be. Is is any less true for a Jew or Muslim or Pagan or Zoroasterian and so on? If it helps them, it is true to them.

As for the more unique practices, I have been, as a traveling nurse, to many places. NA tribal lands regularly use smudging with sage sticks, sings and more. Of course no blood would be allowed but for the most part, using a Cantor in the case of a Jewish person is very much allowed. As for Voodoun, and it is not in truth called Voodoo, there is much that can be done at the bedside of a patient. I hope this helps you understand.