Child free?

[Aquitaine]

Personally I don't see anything wrong with people who decide not to have children. There tend to be more problems when people who're unfit to be parents decide to conceive.

Besides, we're overpopulated anyways. :yes:

 

[dust1n]

I should get stipends for every 2-3 years I don't have a kid.

"Mr. dust1n, we were calling to check in and make sure you still don't have children."

"No, sir."

"Alright we're sending that forty thousand dollar check right away."

 

[Wherenextcolumbus]

My concern is that the higher the class of a person, or the more educated they are, the less likely they seem to be to have children. If the smart ones stop breeding we'll only be left with the welfare-dependent kids from families who don't understand what birth control is.

Thanks, I was one of those underclass kids.

 

[Titanic]

it is whatever the person's decide, if they want kid's then that is great, if they do not want kid's it is also great. Their should not be any stigma attached whatsoever for whatever decision they make on the subject. I respect both side's equally.[p.s although some people would have to have kid's for our species to survive and keep going].

 

[Alceste]

My concern is that the higher the class of a person, or the more educated they are, the less likely they seem to be to have children. If the smart ones stop breeding we'll only be left with the welfare-dependent kids from families who don't understand what birth control is.

That's ok, we childless couples will be so wealthy and productive we can hire and educate all those poor kids.

 

[Pegg]

having children should be a personal choice, not a cultural expectation. If you have them, you have a huge responsibility to care for them...so its not a small casual thing, its HUGE. And I admire people who dont have them for this reason. Its sad to see young inexperienced, ill-prepared people having kids and then not looking after them properly because they have no idea how to even look after themselves.

I have 4 kids, but i didnt have them before my circumstances were suitable for bringing kids into the world. And honestly, If i could go back in time with the knowledge i have now, i would choose not to have any kids... i think i'd wait a lot longer then i did.

 

[Penumbra]

How do you view people who chose to not have any children?

Is there a social stigma in your culture about it?

What about your religion or lack of?

Some people regret not having children but some also regret having them... Perhaps not everyone is fit to have them.

When I was younger, I thought I'd have one child, because that's the norm, to have children. Years went by and I still don't find babies cute and still no desire whatsoever. I am approaching my mid 20's and my husband is in his late 20's.

People in my family often ask when children are coming into the picture and when I reply I do not want them, looks of confusion are thrown at me. Or worse still, I get the answer "you're still young, you've still have yet to be hit with the desire".

Online, I've seen the debate on both sides. Neither seems to respect the other. And since we're on these forums, religions often encourage to have children, often implied many. And people who have no desire of it, are seen as horrible selfish beings.

But I wonder, is not having children so selfish? What about ecologically, financially or even mental capacity? I have been diagnosed with social phobia and depression, hardly function in society, would bringing a child into this context be a good choice? I am convinced that it wouldn't.

I think people shouldn't judge others for either decision. It is a huge commitment that asks lifelong dedication and maybe some people are not suitable for the job. Children in such an environment would perhaps suffer - and I'm not taking of necessarily needs but also feeling loved. I know because I experienced it first hand and never want to put a child through it.

Your thoughts?

Mathematically, if every person couples up, every couple has two children, and every child grows into an adult to couple up, then that's a sustainable population that neither increases nor decreases.

Since, in reality, not every person couples up, and unfortunately not every child grows into an adult, the average number of children per couple can be slightly over two in order for the population to be stable.

But if the average number of children per couple starts hitting 3, 4, 5, 6+, then that results in increases in human population. Even 2.5 is too high, I believe.

I don't think humans are programmed to think like that. We don't think about what's good for our whole species. We tend to make more individual mating decisions. But our planet has 7 billion humans and growing, and we're apex predators. That's a top-heavy food chain. We're straining our agricultural lands, overfishing, reducing forestation, polluting, using up limited resources, and filling landfills. Human population may be the #1 problem that humanity faces.

If one couple owns an SUV, likes to eat a lot of meat, tends to leave too many lights on, and has one child who couples up to have two children, and another couple owns a Prius, eats organic local vegetarian food, uses solar panels for part of their energy, and turns off the lights when they leave the room, but has three kids who on average each have two or three kids, then this second family is probably straining the environment a lot more than the first. The first couple resulted in three more humans over the next two generations, while the second family resulted in somewhere between nine and twelve. The number of children we decide to have is one of the largest, if not the single largest, decisions we can make that affect our environment.

Immanuel Kant's Categorical Imperative answers the moral question of children rather well:

Act only according to that maxim whereby you can, at the same time, will that it should become a universal law.

In other words, the idea is that for every action, ask yourself what would happen if everyone did it. If a couple has 3, 4, 5, or more children, and they ask what if everyone did this, then the answer is: unfathomable increases in population. It's an exponential increase on a finite world.

If most couples have zero, one, or two children, then population can stay steady or decrease. If couples are child free, I believe that their preference should be respected and their decision is admirable.

My concern is that the higher the class of a person, or the more educated they are, the less likely they seem to be to have children. If the smart ones stop breeding we'll only be left with the welfare-dependent kids from families who don't understand what birth control is.

Sounds like you saw the movie, 'Idiocracy', which was about exactly that.

 

[Treks]

Ok that really didn't come out how I intended it to. Sorry for causing offence.

 

[Katzpur]

How do you view people who chose to not have any children?

You want the truth? I view them as people who choose not to have children.

Is there a social stigma in your culture about it?

If you're speaking of my secular culture, there's probably a little bit of a social stigma attached to that choice.

What about your religion or lack of?

Yeah. I'm afraid that Mormonism puts such a strong emphasis on families that those who choose not to have children do feel as if something's wrong with them.

Some people regret not having children but some also regret having them... Perhaps not everyone is fit to have them.

Agreed.

When I was younger, I thought I'd have one child, because that's the norm, to have children. Years went by and I still don't find babies cute and still no desire whatsoever. I am approaching my mid 20's and my husband is in his late 20's.

When I was a teenager, I absolutely, positively, definitely did not ever want kids. By the time I got married, I had changed my tune. I wanted two kids, but not until some undefined time in the distant future. When I turned 30, I decided that if I was going to have kids, maybe I ought to get started. Concerns with genetic issues associated with my being an "older mother" were starting to bother me, too. After 9 1/2 years of marriage, I gave birth to the first of my two children (a son). 2 1/2 years later, my second (a daughter) was born. They're both grown now, and while I love them more than life itself and don't regret for a minute having had them, I am not, as a rule, attracted to babies. When I was working, and a new mother brought her baby into the office to show him off, I had to really work myself up to oooing and aaaahing over him. If, on the other hand, someone brought a new puppy into the office, I was falling all over myself to get to hold and cuddle it.

We're all different. It's too bad that choosing to be childfree can make people feel like such outcasts.

But I wonder, is not having children so selfish?

Absolutely not.

What about ecologically, financially or even mental capacity? I have been diagnosed with social phobia and depression, hardly function in society, would bringing a child into this context be a good choice? I am convinced that it wouldn't.

And I'm sure you know better than anyone else.

 

[illykitty]

They're both grown now, and while I love them more than life itself and don't regret for a minute having had them, I am not, as a rule, attracted to babies. When I was working, and a new mother brought her baby into the office to show him off, I had to really work myself up to oooing and aaaahing over him. If, on the other hand, someone brought a new puppy into the office, I was falling all over myself to get to hold and cuddle it.

We're all different. It's too bad that choosing to be childfree can make people feel like such outcasts.

Love the answers, oh I'm glad I'm not the only one having a hard time with people showing their babies! I feel the same as you do, with cute animals, especially cats or kittens in my case.

Yeah it is too bad, people are diverse... And so are our choices.

 

[Alceste]

In my opinion, not having kids is the number one least selfish thing a human being can do in this day and age. Especially a western kid, who will likely consume enough resources in a year to feed an entire Bangladeshi family for a lifetime.

 

[StarryNightshade]

How do you view people who chose to not have any children?

Is there a social stigma in your culture about it?

What about your religion or lack of?

Some people regret not having children but some also regret having them... Perhaps not everyone is fit to have them.

When I was younger, I thought I'd have one child, because that's the norm, to have children. Years went by and I still don't find babies cute and still no desire whatsoever. I am approaching my mid 20's and my husband is in his late 20's.

People in my family often ask when children are coming into the picture and when I reply I do not want them, looks of confusion are thrown at me. Or worse still, I get the answer "you're still young, you've still have yet to be hit with the desire".

Online, I've seen the debate on both sides. Neither seems to respect the other. And since we're on these forums, religions often encourage to have children, often implied many. And people who have no desire of it, are seen as horrible selfish beings.

But I wonder, is not having children so selfish? What about ecologically, financially or even mental capacity? I have been diagnosed with social phobia and depression, hardly function in society, would bringing a child into this context be a good choice? I am convinced that it wouldn't.

I think people shouldn't judge others for either decision. It is a huge commitment that asks lifelong dedication and maybe some people are not suitable for the job. Children in such an environment would perhaps suffer - and I'm not taking of necessarily needs but also feeling loved. I know because I experienced it first hand and never want to put a child through it.

Your thoughts?

1.) I don't ever want to have children...ever. So I, obviously, don't have an issue with it.

2.) As a whole, America is (from my perspective) slightly neutral on the issue; but there are a lot of people who stigmatize those who don't want children. I view wanting/not wanting kids as a personal thing and I think a good percentage of other people do too.

3.) Since I'm in between religions, my religion doesn't have anything to say on the matter.

4.) Agreed. Not everyone is fit to be a parent...in fact, I'd say most aren't really fit to be parents. At least those who have a ton of them, starting at an early age.

5.) Same here. When I was younger I thought about what it would be like to be a parent, but now I have no desire to be one whatsoever. :no:

6.) I get that response all the time. "Just wait until you're older, then you will want them". Uh...no thanks. I have a Masters/PhD that wil take many more years to accomplish and a career to start. There are people in my family who had dreams to put on hold because they started a family at a young age. Very few, if any, have actually accomplished said goal/dream and seem regretful because of it. Even if I did change my mind and wanted children, it won't be until I have all of my degrees and a career to support them.

7.) I'm going to combine your last few statements into one answer. A.) Yes, people need to be more respectful of others viewpoints, B.) I myself have Aspergers syndrome and struggle with adult interactions, let alone children. So I understand coming from that perspective. C.) No, not wanting children is not selfish. Honestly, when I hear people who do want children say "I don't want to adopt, because I want my children to be from me"; that seems more selfish. Narcissistic, even.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

In my opinion, not having kids is the number one least selfish thing a human being can do in this day and age. Especially a western kid, who will likely consume enough resources in a year to feed an entire Bangladeshi family for a lifetime.

This seems a little antinatalist

 

[John Martin]

The decision to have children or not should be left to the individual choice. But this choice has to be understood according to the general scheme of life. In the book of Genesis God reveals the purpose of human existence: Be fruitful and multiply. This fruitfulness and multiplication is not limited to the physical multiplication of children. It means manifesting the divine attributes of love and compassion in human relationships. it is also multiplication of what is needed to the humanity. Jesus Christ did not multiply children but he multiplied what is needed to the people: multiplication of fish and bread, changing water into wine, healing the people, consoling people, liberating people from all oppressions. The life of Jesus was the life of fruitfulness and multiplication. Bringing forth physical children is only one area and people should make the decision according to their conditions and capacities and whether it is necessary for the welfare of the society. Our life should be life of love and we need to be fruitful and multiply love and compassion and sharing. Jesus was angry with the barren fig tree. The fig tree was the symbol of human beings. Jesus saw that human beings were like that fig tree. There were living but barren.They were not fulfilling the plan of God for them. They were not fruitful. they were wasting the land. We need to make our life fruitful, to give birth to children according to our capacities:children are not only physical but also psychological, intellectual and spiritual: It is basically manifesting love in relationships. It is the multiplication of love.We may not have physical children but we may give birth hundreds and thousands of love manifestations.

 

[McBell]

The decision to have children or not should be left to the individual choice. But this choice has to be understood according to the general scheme of life. In the book of Genesis God reveals the purpose of human existence: Be fruitful and multiply. This fruitfulness and multiplication is not limited to the physical multiplication of children. It means manifesting the divine attributes of love and compassion in human relationships. it is also multiplication of what is needed to the humanity. Jesus Christ did not multiply children but he multiplied what is needed to the people: multiplication of fish and bread, changing water into wine, healing the people, consoling people, liberating people from all oppressions. The life of Jesus was the life of fruitfulness and multiplication. Bringing forth physical children is only one area and people should make the decision according to their conditions and capacities and whether it is necessary for the welfare of the society. Our life should be life of love and we need to be fruitful and multiply love and compassion and sharing. Jesus was angry with the barren fig tree. The fig tree was the symbol of human beings. Jesus saw that human beings were like that fig tree. There were living but barren.They were not fulfilling the plan of God for them. They were not fruitful. they were wasting the land. We need to make our life fruitful, to give birth to children according to our capacities:children are not only physical but also psychological, intellectual and spiritual: It is basically manifesting love in relationships. It is the multiplication of love.We may not have physical children but we may give birth hundreds and thousands of love manifestations.

Man, you really love your sermons.

I gotta ask...
Is the enter/return key on your keyboard broken?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

In my opinion, not having kids is the number one least selfish thing a human being can do in this day and age. Especially a western kid, who will likely consume enough resources in a year to feed an entire Bangladeshi family for a lifetime.

I am far too selfish with my time for the decision to be considered selfless.

 

[Karl R]

Years went by and I still don't find babies cute and still no desire whatsoever. I am approaching my mid 20's and my husband is in his late 20's.

People in my family often ask when children are coming into the picture and when I reply I do not want them, looks of confusion are thrown at me. Or worse still, I get the answer "you're still young, you've still have yet to be hit with the desire".

You'll probably keep hearing that for a few more decades. I'm in my 40s, my wife is in her 50s, and I get those reactions every month or two. Heck, they even say "you're still young", which makes me want to recommend that they schedule a visit with their optometrist.

The people who say these things generally aren't thinking things through clearly. Do they really think we want to be raising a teenager when we're in our 60s and 70s, respectively?

 

[WyattDerp]

What the world needs now... is 500 billion people at least. With 3D printers we surely can create plenty of stackable living space? Or maybe just drill wells into the earth, and put people into self-contained modules that get dropped into those shafts... yeah! Seeing how by then everybody will be hooked to FaceHug 24/7, and that nobody will use their optical cortex for their actual eyes anymore, no sane person would mind.

It's not selfish to not help build that future, just misguided. :slap:

 

[illykitty]

Lol, WyattDerp, I certainly believe that technology can help sustain more people but I don't think it's clever or a good choice to multiply ourselves much more. I know you were sarcastic though. We probably should use technology to alleviate nature's burden from us... We have abused it so much especially in the last few centuries alone. :/

I'm glad having my husband and a cute little cuddly cat as our happy little family. It's plenty for me!

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I guess I'll revive this thread since the OP linked it in the new child free thread.

I love kids. I do wish to be a father someday. But that's not going to happen for a long time. I have no partner and can't even take care of myself. I have severe depression, too. But in the future, when I'm a stable and healthy person, I would like to adopt. It would have to be adoption since the medication I'm on will make me sterile soon.

I do think there's a bit of a social stigma towards remaining childless, but it is lessening over time. No, my religion doesn't care either way. I don't really see one group as being better than the other. I don't see that we're on the edge of a global catastrophe because people reproduce (birth rates are dropping below replacement level so our concerns are probably misplaced on that). What I am concerned about is the quality of the parents since child abuse is a huge issue for me. I think there's a lot of people who shouldn't have kids because they're unfit for parenthood.

One thing I don't quite get is why marry if you're not planning on being parents? To me, I view marriage as largely being irrelevant as a social institution except when it comes to providing a stable foundation for raising a family. But that's just my opinion on it.