Chimpanzee Religion

[Mock Turtle]

'Bonobos and Chimpanzees are BOTH our closest relatives Bonobos and Chimpanzees both share close to 98%'

And socially we don't use sex for group bonding like bonobos

And Chimpanzees are rather violent at times - just like us - so we are more a mix of both.

 

[Heyo]

And walking on water, don't forget the walking on water

 

[ChristineM]

Love the way it repeats the moment before it stops for a breather

 

[Bear Wild]

Well, I didn't say it was your list.
Only that you listed it.

Those are things which would apply to atheists too.

Icon reverence?
Holding church services?

So are icon reverence and holding church services necessary for a religion?
Would you say that a case for chimpanzee religion cannot be made? How would you know if chimpanzees do not have behaviors that could be seen as religion?

 

[cladking]

Come on! How is an animal going to have religion with no ability to make abstractions? Granted very few words are known yet in any animal language but they have no words for "thought", "belief", reductionism, and taxonomies. When there is sufficient sample size we'll find they break Zipf's Law as well. We are merely anthropomorphizing their behavior which has never really been studied in any animal since "consciousness" has never been defined. Without abstractions and symbolism what exactly could they believe in and what evolutionary advantage can belief and superstition possibly confer?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/prairie-dogs-language-decoded-by-scientists-1.1322230

We don't understand language and consciousness so we tend to ascribe them where they don't exist. We think and use abstraction, metaphor, and symbolism to communicate but no evidence exists that this has always been true or is true today for animals.

No, animals have no religion old time or other.

 

[The Hammer]

'Bonobos and Chimpanzees are BOTH our closest relatives Bonobos and Chimpanzees both share close to 98%'

And socially we don't use sex for group bonding like bonobos

Maybe we should, we are just as sexually active as they are.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It wouldn't suprise me if there was some sort of proto-spirituality or religiosity to be detected in the behaviours of chimps.

There would need be self reflection and contemplation first I think.

As evolution continues I think it can be developed as the progression for sapience draws closer.

I'm probably one of the few people here at RF who thinks Planet of the Apes could actually come true in the far future.

 

[cladking]

I'm probably one of the few people here at RF who thinks Planet of the Apes could actually come true in the far future.

It already has.

 

[Revoltingest]

So are icon reverence and holding church services necessary for a religion?

Merely indicators.

Would you say that a case for chimpanzee religion cannot be made? How would you know if chimpanzees do not have behaviors that could be seen as religion?

Chimpanzee religion is like pornography....I'll know it when I see it.

 

[Twilight Hue]

And socially we don't use sex for group bonding like bonobos

Except for Woodstock. But that was just an analgomey.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It already has.

Ok. Heh. Can't argue with that. *Grin*

Let's just say we're waiting for our distant cousins arrival then.

 

[Left Coast]

Chimpanzee Religion

Do Chimpanzees have religion?

Do we have any evidence that Chimpanzees have religious behavior or is there clear evidence that chimpanzees cannot have religion.

James B. Harrod proposed the following Trans species dimensions to try and define what may be observed as evidence for religion.

“· Reverence (showing devotion, intense love, deep respect)

· Careful observance, which may involve a calling-out announcement or remark

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of dread (awe in its terror or astonishment aspect) before that which overwhelms the subject by its magnitude, grandeur, beneficence, or lethality; mysterium tremendum

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of wonder (awe in its fascina-tion, curiosity, or desire-to-know-more aspect) with respect to a phenomenon (especially a movement) which is surprising, non-ordinary, extraordinary, special, or ‘miraculous’; mysterium fascinans

· Binding individuals together or back together in empathic intimacy or communion with respect to experiences of aliveness and animacy, including other living beings or things that appearto be alive, which may secondarily involve the witnessing of this by a collective social group. “



The article and its evidence can be read at this sight.

www.researchgate.net/publication/276915021_The_Case_for_Chimpanzee_Religion_2014



The evolution of humans behavior patterns has created religion in humans. Certainly our closely related family on this planet – the other apes – have significant behavioral traits in common with us.

Is there a case for chimpanzee religion?

People, especially atheists, are giving you a pretty hard time about this for some reason, but personally I think the basic idea is plausible. Obviously other primates don't have anything as complex and nuanced and ideologically developed as what we call "religion." But from a naturalistic perspective, religion certainly had to come from somewhere, and it's clear that it operates at a very basic emotional, almost instinctual level in people. It makes sense that other primates would display proto-religious behaviors, as our primate/hominid ancestors likely did before us. Thanks for sharing.

As an aside, there is analogous research on moral behavior in animals.

 

[Windwalker]

Chimpanzee Religion

Do Chimpanzees have religion?

Do we have any evidence that Chimpanzees have religious behavior or is there clear evidence that chimpanzees cannot have religion.

James B. Harrod proposed the following Trans species dimensions to try and define what may be observed as evidence for religion.

“· Reverence (showing devotion, intense love, deep respect)

· Careful observance, which may involve a calling-out announcement or remark

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of dread (awe in its terror or astonishment aspect) before that which overwhelms the subject by its magnitude, grandeur, beneficence, or lethality; mysterium tremendum

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of wonder (awe in its fascina-tion, curiosity, or desire-to-know-more aspect) with respect to a phenomenon (especially a movement) which is surprising, non-ordinary, extraordinary, special, or ‘miraculous’; mysterium fascinans

· Binding individuals together or back together in empathic intimacy or communion with respect to experiences of aliveness and animacy, including other living beings or things that appearto be alive, which may secondarily involve the witnessing of this by a collective social group. “



The article and its evidence can be read at this sight.

www.researchgate.net/publication/276915021_The_Case_for_Chimpanzee_Religion_2014



The evolution of humans behavior patterns has created religion in humans. Certainly our closely related family on this planet – the other apes – have significant behavioral traits in common with us.

Is there a case for chimpanzee religion?

I downloaded the PDF and can't wait to read it. The abstract really grabbed me. I have little doubt this is not completely true. We humans think much too highly of ourselves that we completely unique and above all other animals.

 

[cladking]

... and it's clear that it operates at a very basic emotional, almost instinctual level in people. It makes sense that other primates would display proto-religious behaviors, as our primate/hominid ancestors likely did before us.

I don't see that that is clear at all. Even were I to grant that the belief in "God" is "natural" how is an animal to hold or formulate such an abstraction?

How can an animal go from perception of what's around him to something or someone must have caused it?

 

[james bond]

Nice.

Chimpanzees can't even walk bipedal . They're not human and didn't become human.

 

[Left Coast]

I don't see that that is clear at all. Even were I to grant that the belief in "God" is "natural" how is an animal to hold or formulate such an abstraction?

We're animals and we hold and formulate such an abstraction. How do we do it?

Are you an atheist? If so, if belief in God isn't "natural," what is it?

How can an animal go from perception of what's around him to something or someone must have caused it?

We're animals and we go from perceptions of what's around us to inferring cause. How do we do it?

You understand that I'm not suggesting that other primates literally have a religion, or that they're as cognitively evolved as us, right?

 

[viole]

Chimpanzee Religion

Do Chimpanzees have religion?

Do we have any evidence that Chimpanzees have religious behavior or is there clear evidence that chimpanzees cannot have religion.

James B. Harrod proposed the following Trans species dimensions to try and define what may be observed as evidence for religion.

“· Reverence (showing devotion, intense love, deep respect)

· Careful observance, which may involve a calling-out announcement or remark

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of dread (awe in its terror or astonishment aspect) before that which overwhelms the subject by its magnitude, grandeur, beneficence, or lethality; mysterium tremendum

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of wonder (awe in its fascina-tion, curiosity, or desire-to-know-more aspect) with respect to a phenomenon (especially a movement) which is surprising, non-ordinary, extraordinary, special, or ‘miraculous’; mysterium fascinans

· Binding individuals together or back together in empathic intimacy or communion with respect to experiences of aliveness and animacy, including other living beings or things that appearto be alive, which may secondarily involve the witnessing of this by a collective social group. “



The article and its evidence can be read at this sight.

www.researchgate.net/publication/276915021_The_Case_for_Chimpanzee_Religion_2014



The evolution of humans behavior patterns has created religion in humans. Certainly our closely related family on this planet – the other apes – have significant behavioral traits in common with us.

Is there a case for chimpanzee religion?

Chimpanzee Religion

Do Chimpanzees have religion?

Do we have any evidence that Chimpanzees have religious behavior or is there clear evidence that chimpanzees cannot have religion.

James B. Harrod proposed the following Trans species dimensions to try and define what may be observed as evidence for religion.

“· Reverence (showing devotion, intense love, deep respect)

· Careful observance, which may involve a calling-out announcement or remark

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of dread (awe in its terror or astonishment aspect) before that which overwhelms the subject by its magnitude, grandeur, beneficence, or lethality; mysterium tremendum

· Experiencing or expressing emotion of wonder (awe in its fascina-tion, curiosity, or desire-to-know-more aspect) with respect to a phenomenon (especially a movement) which is surprising, non-ordinary, extraordinary, special, or ‘miraculous’; mysterium fascinans

· Binding individuals together or back together in empathic intimacy or communion with respect to experiences of aliveness and animacy, including other living beings or things that appearto be alive, which may secondarily involve the witnessing of this by a collective social group. “



The article and its evidence can be read at this sight.

www.researchgate.net/publication/276915021_The_Case_for_Chimpanzee_Religion_2014



The evolution of humans behavior patterns has created religion in humans. Certainly our closely related family on this planet – the other apes – have significant behavioral traits in common with us.

Is there a case for chimpanzee religion?

probably. And those pious chimps get mad when some cleverer chimp tells them that they share a common ancestor with humans.

ciao

- viole

 

[cladking]

probably. And those pious chimps get mad when some cleverer chimp tells them that they share a common ancestor with humans.

I'd be interested to know which group flings the most poo.

 

[cladking]

We're animals and we hold and formulate such an abstraction. How do we do it?

Are you an atheist? If so, if belief in God isn't "natural," what is it?

Abstractions like "thought", "belief", reductionism, and taxonomies are part of modern languages and these languages are the formatting of thought. We do it by means of a highly complex and symbolic language. Animal languages are neither complex nor symbolic. Like Ancient Language they lack the vocabulary and means to express any sort of abstraction.

We're animals and we go from perceptions of what's around us to inferring cause. How do we do it?

That there exists a cause at all is an abstraction. I'm sure all animals see that all effects have causes but the the extrapolation that there mustta been an initial cause is an abstraction and that this initial cause is a consciousness is a speculation and circular argument. This is what Homo Omnisciencis does; create circular arguments and then live our lives in terms of these arguments.

 

[Heyo]

Nice.

Chimpanzees can't even walk bipedal . They're not human and didn't become human.