Christianity offers wings not weight

[Heneni]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

1. You have to clear your own conscience
2. Find your own meaning
3. Uphold your own cause
4. Carry your own burdens
5. Protect your own life
6. Overcome your own fears
7. Heal your own wounds
8. Secure your own future
9. Comfort yourself in death.

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.

Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

Heneni

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Ah, like Red Bull.

 

[Mr Cheese]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

1. You have to clear your own conscience
2. Find your own meaning
3. Uphold your own cause
4. Carry your own burdens
5. Protect your own life
6. Overcome your own fears
7. Heal your own wounds
8. Secure your own future
9. Comfort yourself in death.

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.

Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

Heneni

Sounds very islamic....

a burden?

well because the greatest battle is to overcome our selves...
............

“True will is participation in Divine Will. True awareness is participation in Divine Mind. True life is actually participation in Divine Life. We don’t own them, we only participate.

If I am not the owner of will and consciousness, only a participant, then who am I?

The truth is that the self is the most elusive, most difficult to cognize. Why is this so? Because the self is that which is seeing. The eyes cannot see themselves.”

- David Aaron

The highest good is like water;
Water is good at benefiting the ten thousand things

and yet It does not

compete with them.

It dwells in places the masses of people detest,
Therefore it is close to the Way.

In dwelling, the good thing is the land;
In the mind, the good thing is depth;
In giving, the good thing is being like Heaven;
In speaking, the good thing is sincerity;

In governing, the good thing is order;

In affairs, the good thing is ability;

In activity, the good thing is timeliness.
It is only because it does not compete, that therefore it
is without fault.

–Tao Te Ching

 

[Wandered Off]

For me, it wasn't a burden so much as a set of empty, second-hand promises. Everything I let go of turned out to be still there, un-handled, and the most common explanation I got was that this was my fault.

 

[Mr Cheese]

For me, it wasn't a burden so much as a set of empty, second-hand promises. Everything I let go of turned out to be still there, un-handled, and the most common explanation I got was that this was my fault.

well that is the unfortunate doctrine of original sin, predestination and the like....

"Ye are born into filth" so to speak.....:thud:

 

[ChristineES]

When it comes to my relationship with God, I live by the JFK rule: Ask not what God can do for you, but what you can do for God.

 

[Andal]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

1. You have to clear your own conscience
2. Find your own meaning
3. Uphold your own cause
4. Carry your own burdens
5. Protect your own life
6. Overcome your own fears
7. Heal your own wounds
8. Secure your own future
9. Comfort yourself in death.

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.

Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

Heneni

I'm glad I have Krishna, otherwise all of those things would be very hard.

When it comes to my relationship with God, I live by the JFK rule: Ask not what God can do for you, but what you can do for God.

Simply beautiful!

 

[blackout]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

gOd is the living sentient UniVerse.
What can I do apart from the fabric of my own existence?

1. You have to clear your own conscience
There is nothing in my conscience to clear.
I love people deeply, and treat them well.
I love mySelf deeply, and treat mySelf well.
2. Find your own meaning
THIS is one of the very most EXCITING aspects of BEing a creative being.
Finding new meaning/s in things is one of my favorite endeavors.
3. Uphold your own cause
I don't attempt to "uphold" causes that are bigger than what I am capable of...erm... holding up.
4. Carry your own burdens
I learned long ago that the sooner I lay a burden to rest...
the more rested I am.
5. Protect your own life
Live smart.
6. Overcome your own fears
Whoooo Hoooo!!!
7. Heal your own wounds
A deep and WONDERFUL process of creative introspection.
8. Secure your own future
Sew what you want to reap.
9. Comfort yourself in death.
I have no discomfort with the notion of death.
I have died and risen in this life many times already.

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.
"Boss"?

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.
No worries here. none. I had far more worries as a christian.
And I say that in ALL SINCERITY.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.
I'm perfectly capable of putting down my own bags.
Aren't you?


Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

The People who know how to "let go",
are the people who know how to live.
~Violet~

Heneni

 

[Heneni]

Ah, like Red Bull.

Only better

Sounds very islamic....

It does?

well because the greatest battle is to overcome our selves...

If Jesus came to reconcile us to god,to make peace between us and Him, do you think it is advantageous to make ourselves our worst enemy? To not be at peace with ourselves causes distress doesnt it? The thing is god commands us to do things we basically cant do. LOL. Not without him. For example...the command 'be perfect' . Can we do that by ourselves? It can very well become a burden to us, if we think that we have to do it.

“True will is participation in Divine Will. True awareness is participation in Divine Mind. True life is actually participation in Divine Life. We don’t own them, we only participate.

The sovereign will of god does not allow us to choose participation. In that way we are like puppets. We cannot circumvent his sovereign will. However the revealed will of god does require our participation.

If I am not the owner of will and consciousness, only a participant, then who am I?

If you can expand on that a little...

The truth is that the self is the most elusive, most difficult to cognize. Why is this so? Because the self is that which is seeing. The eyes cannot see themselves.”

Faith looks unto God does it not? Putting our eyes on god, takes the focus of ourselves and makes us enter into something far grander than ourselves. To look at self is to become more of self. To look at god, is to transform. Are we too easily pleased with ourselves? Or are we suppose to not be? I think that the burden to be someobody or the disgrace we feel when we feel like a nobody fades away when you find your meaning in God. The kind of peace that the world brings is rooted in being happy with who I am making myself into. The kind of peace that god brings is rooted in being happy with who He is. God is enough. Enough to satisfy our every need.

Thanks for your input
Heneni

 

[Heneni]

For me, it wasn't a burden so much as a set of empty, second-hand promises. Everything I let go of turned out to be still there, un-handled, and the most common explanation I got was that this was my fault.

And to carry the burden around of 'it was my fault' must be terrible. You dont have to carry that burden.

well that is the unfortunate doctrine of original sin, predestination and the like....

"Ye are born into filth" so to speak.....:thud:

If you were born so to speak in heaven, youd still have the same issues perhaps. Did satan not fall yet he was not created in filth? He was created in heaven.

When it comes to my relationship with God, I live by the JFK rule: Ask not what God can do for you, but what you can do for God.

That is exactly the opposite to what I believe. What is there that I can do for my god. I can only love him. And i can only love him, because He loved me first. Loving God is my pleasure. Im in desperate need for god to do things for me everyday. Without him I am nothing. Praying to god acknowledges my brokeness and emptiness and my need for him to do something for me. He is my all sufficiency. If I had sufficiency of my own, i could do something for god in an area were he was not sufficient. I know that he is not lacking anything. Therefore I dont ask what can i do for god, but i humbly ask him to do things for me. By praying we dont ask god to be our genie in a bottle. To make things happen that will give us the illusion of happiness. Instead we ask god to give us what we need. More of him, more fruit, by this our father is glorified, if we bear much fruit. He is the gardener, he is the potter. We are his workmanship. Faith is futile and empty if it does not consider god to be the most treasured possession of the soul. If things are our treasure, god will not provide for our idols. But if he is our treasure, god will provide us with more of him. When god is your most treasured possession, you can ask whatever you will, and it shall be given unto you. Faith is rooted in the understanding that God is too be treasured above all things. God responds to the needs of those who treasure him. The giver gets the glory, that is why loves to give. And why he tells us to give us well.

 

[painted wolf]

Part of growing up is learning to rely on yourself.

God shouldn't be a looked at as a crutch....

wa:do

 

[Father Heathen]

Ah, like Red Bull.

The question is which of the two leaves the worst aftertaste?

 

[richardlowellt]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

1. You have to clear your own conscience

YES OF COURSE, I ALONE AM RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT I HAVE DONE

2. Find your own meaning

YES, WHY WOULD I LET ANYONE OR ANYTHING DETERMINE MY MEANING? I AM VERY COMFORTABLE DECIDING WHAT MY MEANING IS.


3. Uphold your own cause

YES MOST CERTAINLY!!

4. Carry your own burdens

THEY ARE MY BURDENS WHY EXPECT ANYONE ELSE TO CARRY THEM FOR ME?

5. Protect your own life

YES, AND THOSE THAT I LOVE A CARE ABOUT.


6. Overcome your own fears

WHAT BETTER WAY TO RID YOURSELF, NO ONE CAN TRULLY HELP YOU BUT YOURSELF.

7. Heal your own wounds

OF COURSE.

8. Secure your own future

THIS SEEMS LIKE A NO BRAINER, OF COURSE I AM GOING TO SECURE MY FUTURE

9. Comfort yourself in death.

DEATH IS THE END, THERE IS NO AFTERLIFE, YOU SIMPLE CEASE TO EXIST, THERE IS NOTHING TO COMFORT

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.

Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

Heneni

The mindset that a "big daddy" in the sky will take care of me is self defeating. One never learns how to cope with the rigors of life on their own, they grow weak and afraid always looking to the sky for guidance. The strong are those who stand on their own two feet and look life in the eye, learn to deal with adversity, shape their own destiny, and most important,develop inner strength.

 

[blackout]

The mindset that a "big daddy" in the sky will take care of me is self defeating. One never learns how to cope with the rigors of life on their own, they grow weak and afraid always looking to the sky for guidance. The strong are those who stand on their own two feet and look life in the eye, learn to deal with adversity, shape their own destiny, and most important,develop inner strength.

Nicely said. A powerful statement indeed.

 

[Heneni]

Part of growing up is learning to rely on yourself.

God shouldn't be a looked at as a crutch....

wa:do

Yes I knew that this response would eventually come. But the wisdom of the world is contrary to the wisdom of god. To be reliant on god shows our trust in him.To be self-sufficient glorifies ourselves. At the root of christianity is the hallowing of the name of god. God is hallowed in our lives when he is everything.

Self-help the bible says is not help at all. Anybody that has tried to live the christian life and has failed yet still wants to know god will tell you that whatever god requires of us, is impossible to do without him. We are bound to god in that way. There is no self salvation. There is only salvation through him.

I know that in society one is seen as week when you need some sort of crutch. However there is a life beyond this one, a life that no-one can access without the help of god, so for me, its the smartest thing to acknowledge that without god, it aint never going to happen. The things that god requires us to do cannot be done unless we use him as a crutch. We are not to lean on our own understanding but on His. We are to have His peace not the peace that the world gives. The fruit of the HS that we must develop can never develop itself without god. So yes, god is our crutch. We lean on him, rely on him, find refuge in him. Find purpose in Him, find meaning in him, find deliverance, forgiveness and salvation in Him.

To say that god is our crutch, does not offend God, it offends people who feel that 'self-sufficient' is the mature thing to do.

Christianity is Christ-exalting not self-exalting.

Now having said that christians are expected to grow in grace. Which means that having been planted firmly in grace, we keep on being sustained by it. There comes a time that every plant needs to grow up, but there never comes a time when the plant does not need soil. In the same way christians mature in the lord, by growing in grace. But we can never say, i am big enough now to surivive without the soil of gods grace. And grace in essence is the stooping down of god to help us.

Heneni

 

[Heneni]

The mindset that a "big daddy" in the sky will take care of me is self defeating. One never learns how to cope with the rigors of life on their own, they grow weak and afraid always looking to the sky for guidance. The strong are those who stand on their own two feet and look life in the eye, learn to deal with adversity, shape their own destiny, and most important,develop inner strength.

And again...having big daddy in the sky is not something that offends god but the one that does not want daddy.

We have a father 'in the sky' who we call ABBA father. God does not take our storms away but god shows us how to sing in the rain. We are not excluded from hard times, but our suffering is never in vain. It only strengthens our hope that we have in god. For somebody to loose hope they might as well die inside. And so mankind finds hope in whatever they can, but christians find hope in god. That hope allows them to suffer with dignity knowing that there is a hope that cannot dissapoint. Hope that is deferred makes the heart sick. For the world to put their hope in things that dont materialise makes their hearts sick. A christians hope lies in god, who does not dissapoint. But our hopes are not in anything on this earth, but in God who is eternal. Our treasure does not lie here, so our hopes does not lie here either, and so we can suffer in this world with dignity because we know that there is something to look forward to.

The world is offended by suffering and even blames god for it. Christians know that suffering is a given and we can endure it because we have a non shakeable hope. A living hope. That cannot dissapoint. So when we suffer we know that there is the 'daddy in the sky' who never leaves us nor forsakes us.

Heneni

 

[painted wolf]

This is where our faiths differ.
My faith is about showing humility in helping others, lowering the self... not expecting god to do it.

We save ourselves as Creator taught us to... not to glorify ourselves but to live up to the potential that Creator gave us.

After giving us everything... why beg for more? We focus on thanking Creator for what we have... not seeking what we want/need.

wa:do

 

[Heneni]

Some believe, that they alone choose everything that comes out of them, that they can invent and reinvent themselves, that they are their own engineer. They dont need god. Their OK without him. Ok...so does that follow then that

gOd is the living sentient UniVerse.
What can I do apart from the fabric of my own existence?

1. You have to clear your own conscience
There is nothing in my conscience to clear.
I love people deeply, and treat them well.
I love mySelf deeply, and treat mySelf well.
2. Find your own meaning
THIS is one of the very most EXCITING aspects of BEing a creative being.
Finding new meaning/s in things is one of my favorite endeavors.
3. Uphold your own cause
I don't attempt to "uphold" causes that are bigger than what I am capable of...erm... holding up.
4. Carry your own burdens
I learned long ago that the sooner I lay a burden to rest...
the more rested I am.
5. Protect your own life
Live smart.
6. Overcome your own fears
Whoooo Hoooo!!!
7. Heal your own wounds
A deep and WONDERFUL process of creative introspection.
8. Secure your own future
Sew what you want to reap.
9. Comfort yourself in death.
I have no discomfort with the notion of death.
I have died and risen in this life many times already.

If so..then i can understand why you want to be your own boss.
"Boss"?

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.
No worries here. none. I had far more worries as a christian.
And I say that in ALL SINCERITY.

Come to me, all ye that are burdened and heavy laden and I will give you rest. Its good to know that god does not lay burdens on us, but helps us carry it. Infact he removes our burdens.
I'm perfectly capable of putting down my own bags.
Aren't you?


Why do so many christians and non christians see a relationship with god as being burdensome when they really have all their burdens taken care of if they will only let go and let god.

The People who know how to "let go",
are the people who know how to live.
~Violet~

Heneni

Hi there, I tried the standing in front of the mirror thing saying: Your'e Okay, You are OKay.

It didnt work for me.

Heneni

 

[slave2six]

I can also understand why the bible says...that whoever the son has set free is free indeed. Free from all the worries that the above list might bring with it.

Yeah. Being free from personal responsibility is the bait that leads to the trap. The reason that people take personal responsibility for all the things you listed is because we are strong enough to do so without an invisible force who neither speaks in ways that humans can agree on as legitimate forms of communication nor makes his presence known unless we really really really concentrate hard and imagine that he's there.

Why not just try to convince people that you have magic wallpaper that, if placed in their homes, will give them perpetual youth? That's about how reasonable the idea of god is to those of us who have no problem with taking on those things you listed.

 

[slave2six]

When it comes to my relationship with God, I live by the JFK rule: Ask not what God can do for you, but what you can do for God.

Huh? What could God possibly need that any of us could provide (except belief which brought forth his existence in the first place)?