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Christianity vs Islam
- Thread starter Jimmy
- Start date
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
I tend to believe it was used metaphorically.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
Of course
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
So you don't believe that Jesus was born of Mary?
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
I don’t believe in anything before Jesus. He appeared out of the womb as a child. And he brought all you see and know with him. Although I don’t call him Jesus.
The term Son of God is a title which any believer can attain.
John 1:12
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name
God is a Spirit John 4:24
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
This ridiculous notion of worshipping the body and flesh of Jesus and that He is the physical son of God is against the Bible. Christ was born of the Holy Spirit. God is a Spirit so too Christ is a Spirit. Sadly Christians have descended into worship of His name and body
As to Muhammad He too was imbued with the Spirit of God through the Holy Spirit. No difference between Jesus and Muhammad except Christians have been indoctrinated by their priests to believe Jesus is superior. Priests do this to keep their followers from joining other religions but there is absolutely no truth to it. Both are equal. Muhammad too was God’s Son just as Jesus was.
That Christ was born through miraculous means is in the Gospels, which you apparently have never read but have the gall to want to lecture Christians about. Hilarious. The Gospels of Matthew and Luke make it clear that Mary was a virgin and Joseph wasn't the father. So how did He come to be if that's not true? Are you saying the Gospels lied? Are you accusing Mary of being an adulteress, which is highly offensive?
It's because Jesus is superior to us, and the Gospels do have people worshipping Him as God. He's literally God incarnate. We're not joking when we say that's what we believe. When you have God in the flesh, there's no point in some other religion or prophet. He is what the prophets were pointing to in the first place. Muhammad was just a man, if he even existed as said (I am learning there's a controversy over this). The Holy Spirit is available to all believers and lives inside of us, as well.
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I used the word "came" not "born". All Prophets were exalted souls before humanity was even part of the agenda of God. If Angels stayed humble and worshipped God sincerely, then perhaps, humanity and the trials of Adam (a) Angels faced would not be needed.
There is a verse that says "there came a period of time when the human was not even a thing remembered".
However, God coming only through Jesus (a) would make pre-Jesus religion and post, two different religions. If one is about incarnation of God or trinity thing, and the other lacks that, then it's two different religions.
I don't see how you refute my point about consistency of religion. The consistency is bread and butter of how Quran argues for the religion of the truth. Of course, there is some differences, and one big one is that humanity is coming to a universal linkage, where interaction is a global thing, as we see today. Therefore, a Messenger send today would have a global impact or expected to as opposed to first impact being local, and then the local people who believe become messengers (not appointed by God, I'm speaking in a general sense) who convey the religion to others.
As many cities were destroyed in the past because of how they reacted to miracles, signs and proofs of the Messengers, the Mahdi has been delayed - so that he can come in good terms.
However, Quran shows, it's upon God to deliver the believers. So there is good terms the Mahdi (a) can come in and there is bad terms. Unfortunately, the world failed the tests and warnings of Quran regarding the Ahlulbayt (a).
We can say there is some recovery now, but there is still a big danger, that Mahdi (a) although meant as a mercy and favor, will be a means where so many people and cities are destroyed.
Jesus (a) is not the first to stay alive. Enoch (a) and Elijah (a) per the Bible are also alive, and this is confirmed in the Quran (Idris (a) explicitly while Elyas (a) implicitly).
This means Enoch (a) was saved for some reason. It means God saved many souls of past chosen Ahlulbayts for a reason. And this is because there will be a remaining alive person from all sorts of Ahlulbayts all over the earth. And this is needed or otherwise, the world is nationalistic and racist and would probably deny if the Mahdi (a) was coming alone.
So we can see the final global plan - is not a change of the ways of God - but perfection of his light and ways of guidance. We know Khidr (a), Elyas (a), Idris (a), Jesus (a) and the Mahdi (a) is alive, but there per universal standards one or two from each family of guidance of the past.
This probably means the 313 commanders of Imam Mahdi (a) will be chosen ones and infallible guides of the past saved for that. It means it's not that there needs to be 313 believers, what is meant by the word "momineen" in the 313 are the "granters of safety" which is the position of the chosen ones.
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It is true that Islam does not view Jesus as the literal "Son of God". However one could argue the New Testament brings a theological narrative in regards the Nature of Christ that is best not taken literally.
The Quran does revere Jesus as an important Prophet and extols the Gospel. So for me, the Quran encompasses Jesus and the Revelation He brought through the Gospel. On the other hand Christianity does not acknowledge Muhammad as a Prophet or the Revelation He brought through the Holy Quran.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe God's son is in the Qu'ran but the translation I read had a non-textual phrase in brackets saying: May it never be.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe that would be followers of Islam. Islam itself does not say that.
Muffled
Jesus in me
I believe anyone other than a born again Christian is on sinking sand. We are on the Rock.I think that what brings us together should be the topic of discussion.
The respect towards other religions is based upon the common ground.
Maninthemiddle
Active Member
I believe Jesus was referring to himself as a Son of God, as in Mankind are all Children of God.
What's "sinking sand?"
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
How do you explain John 3:16, which says that Jesus is the ONLY begotten son of God?
This mean as of now he is the only chosen exalted one from God alive.
"son of God" has different metaphorical meaning. Sometimes it refers to generally those born out of light and other times it refers especially those close to God way more then rest of mankind (the chosen ones).
McBell
Unbound
If the modifier "only begotten" is not a modifier, why is it there?
Dimi95
Прaвославие!
This is vague my friend
John 1
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
and continues in John 14:6
"I am the way and the truth and the life."
He claims to be the way , the truth and the life, so that means also the light.
That is very different from your interpretation.
I don't think that you understand what 'Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made' means.
muhammad_isa
Veteran Member
Who said that?
It wasn't Jesus, now was it?
I prefer the version in Genesis ..
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
That verse from John is too philosophical to me .. "logos" (translated 'word') is Greek, which Jesus did not speak.
He was God, and was with God.. huh??
Dimi95
Прaвославие!
Who said that?
It wasn't Jesus, now was it?
I prefer the version in Genesis ..
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
I will show you how the Torah points to the Gospels.
Look at this:
If you go every 50 letters in the Book of Genesis you will get the spelling of TORAH
If you go every 50 letters in the Book of Exodus you will get also the spelling of TORAH
If you skip Leviticus and go to Numbers,you go every 49 letters and you will get TORAH spelled backwards!
If you go to Deuterenomy every 49 letters you will also get TORAH spelled backwards!
Why?
They are both pointing at Leviticus
In Leviticus in every 7 letters you will get the spelling of YAHWEH - Y-H-V-H(I am that I Am)
Every 7 letters - the entire book of Leviticus!
The book of Leviticus shows that it would take the sacriface of the perfect Lamb - Jesus Christ to atone our sins.
What from 'the Word was God' do you not understand ?
What confuses you there?
Maybe what oneness means?
And btw, Logos means the principle of reason.
One other thing that you should note is that Matthew was a tax collector , so most probably he spoke other languages such as Greek.