Christians..................... and their worldly wealth.

[oldbadger]

I need Christians, especially those who believe that the bible is the unerring, infallible, divine word of God, to read the verses below, and then to confirm that they live a life free from Mammon, High Status, Wealth and other Riches.

If not....... Why not?

MATTHEW {19:23} Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. {19:24} And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

MARK {10:24} And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and
saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God! {10:25} It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

LUKE {18:24} And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful, he said, How hardly shall they that have riches
enter into the kingdom of God! {18:25} For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle’s eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

PS: Please excuse the OP for being a fat, comfy pagan Deist! Hell! I've even got a bicycle!

 

[McBell]

The verses do not say that a rich person cannot enter, only that is is harder for a rich man to enter.

 

[rusra02]

Few professed Christians actually follow Christ's teachings, IMO. But true Christians do live simple lives while they give priority to spiritual riches and doing God's will. (Matthew 6:33) Interestingly, some early Christians were wealthy.(1 Timothy 6:17)

 

[Neo Deist]

The "eye of the needle" is metaphorical for a gate that led into Jerusalem. At night, the main gates would be closed, but a smaller, side gate would remain open for travelers. However, that gate could only be passed through by a camel if the baggage/luggage/wares were removed.

The verse is stating that a rich man has to dump his baggage (greed, pride, vanity, etc.) before passing into Paradise. It does not mean that you have to be dirt poor to get in.

 

[Kemosloby]

Why on Earth would a rich person give away all his money to follow Jesus?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The verses do not say that a rich person cannot enter, only that is is harder for a rich man to enter.

I've yet to hear of a camel that can actually pass through the eye of a needle.

The "eye of the needle" is metaphorical for a gate that led into Jerusalem. At night, the main gates would be closed, but a smaller, side gate would remain open for travelers. However, that gate could only be passed through by a camel if the baggage/luggage/wares were removed.

Doubtfully
Eye of a needle - Wikipedia

The "Eye of the Needle" has been claimed to be a gate in Jerusalem, which opened after the main gate was closed at night. A camel could only pass through this smaller gate if it was stooped and had its baggage removed. This story has been put forth since at least the 15th century, and possibly as far back as the 9th century. However, there is no widely accepted evidence for the existence of such a gate.[4][5]

Why on Earth would a rich person give away all his money to follow Jesus?

My guess is because Jesus told them to.

 

[Valjean]

Why on Earth would a rich person give away all his money to follow Jesus?

Matthew 19:21
"Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me."

Luke 18:22
"Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me."

Matthew 6:19-21
19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

 

[Kemosloby]

Matthew 19:21
"Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me."

Luke 18:22
"Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me."

Matthew 6:19-21
19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

What good is treasure in heaven when you're living on Earth. Wouldn't it be better to keep your wealth on Earth where you can spend it?

 

[Valjean]

What good is treasure in heaven when you're living on Earth. Wouldn't it be better to keep your wealth on Earth where you can spend it?

Christians are just passing through. Earth isn't their home, just a stage in their processing.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

What good is treasure in heaven when you're living on Earth. Wouldn't it be better to keep your wealth on Earth where you can spend it?

Now you're arguing with the Lord? Tsk tsk.

 

[savagewind]

I think there is a problem and it is big.

I think no one gives the writers or even God credit for being deeper than the surface.

There is rich and there is property.

Sometimes rich just means satisfied. A person satisfied with the way things are will not enter into the Kingdom of God. A satisfied person is feeling rich even if he does not have much wealth.

The way Matthew 19:21 and Luke 18:22 is translated it would appear that a person should make himself poor to be a proper disciple of Jesus. It isn't the person's wealth that Jesus is warning about. It is his possessions. They need taking care of. So......why not look at it this way? Instead of selling your stuff and giving the proceeds to the poor, thus becoming poor yourself, read it as though he is saying, "sell your things, even give the things away. If you did that, you could still have your wealth, but your life would be simpler.

If a person lives to be wealthy he can't live for God. A wealthy person can live for God IF he does not make his things his job. I am sure you know people who are wealthy for the sake of riches. That is what Jesus warns about. I certainly think it is OK by Jesus Christ is a person has financial security.

 

[savagewind]

Just compare what is written.

It is written that the beggars of the spirit are they that have access to the Kingdom of the Heavens.

It is written that a rich man will have difficulty that way.

Rich people do not beg. Poor people beg. What kind of poor? How are poor people poor?
Money wise or spirit wise?

Isn't Jesus for teaching about The Spirit? You all take that away from him. Don't you?

And then I hear this, Revelation 16:15.

Look, I come like a thief! Blessed is the one who stays awake and remains clothed, so as not to go naked and be shamefully exposed

Revelation 3:11
I am coming soon. Hold fast to what you have, so that no one will take your crown.

 

[Valjean]

Rich people do not beg. Poor people beg. What kind of poor? How are poor people poor?
Money wise or spirit wise?

Isn't Jesus for teaching about The Spirit? You all take that away from him. Don't you?

It's hard to improve the spirit till you improve the material welfare. It's Maslovian. Basic needs are addressed before actualization needs.

 

[savagewind]

There are different ways to be rich and different ways to be poor. To be understanding scriptures about rich and poor only one way is sophmoric, imo.

A person of wealth can be poor and a person of little means can be rich.

There is poor which means not having enough to live on and there is poor toward God.
There is rich which means having an excess and there is rich toward God.

To be having more than enough is good because then you will have the joy of sharing.
A poor person who does a lot of sharing will have worry along with it. A rich person won't.

Both of them can be rich toward God.

 

[metis]

Anyone ever seen pictures of Joel Osteen's humble dwellings?

 

[RabbiO]

Anyone ever seen pictures of Joel Osteen's humble dwellings?

I'm guessing this ain't it.

 

[RabbiO]

Anyone ever seen pictures of Joel Osteen's humble dwellings?

Must be this one -

 

[RESOLUTION]

I need Christians, especially those who believe that the bible is the unerring, infallible, divine word of God, to read the verses below, and then to confirm that they live a life free from Mammon, High Status, Wealth and other Riches.

If not....... Why not?

MATTHEW {19:23} Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. {19:24} And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

Jesus speaking to the Jews. God made all Jews prosperous who upheld his word. In fact history shows countries which Jews resided in became prosperous something Hitler feared.
The OT story of Joseph and Egypt. How God's people enslaved because they feared they would take over. In life Lazarus and Dives explains best why a rich man would not enter the Kingdom of Heaven. In life those who have no use for God or his ways can perish. Dives could have helped Lazarus but his heart was not right with God he did nothing to relieve the suffering of those in front of him. Wealth on it's own is worth nothing if it does not work for the good of others.

MARK {10:24} And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and
saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God! {10:25} It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

TRUST.. being the operative word. How hard is it for them that trust in their riches. Man cannot serve both God and mammon. The Rich man told to give away all he had and come follow Christ. The Kingdom of God is not about love of money it is about TRUTH and rebirth in Gods Spirit through Christ. You can gain the world but what if you lose your soul.
So Christians do not trust in their riches. Those in the Kingdom trust in their God.

LUKE {18:24} And when Jesus saw that he was very sorrowful, he said, How hardly shall they that have riches
enter into the kingdom of God! {18:25} For it is easier for a camel to go through a needle’s eye, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

God makes Grace abound unto the believer. But the truth is money is a good servant but a bad master. God has to be first... and the Kingdom must be the number one priority in a believers life saving souls. Jesus never needed money. He took that which God has already provided for his needs and for others. When the fig tree refused to give him fruit it was unable to give anyone after that day. But Christ used what God has created. Such a time will come when a piece of bread will buy a bag of Gold. The things of God have more value than those things in the world.

PS: Please excuse the OP for being a fat, comfy pagan Deist! Hell! I've even got a bicycle!

Alright! I found that funny but I have to add... behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. You have to admit God has a wonderful sense of humour. At least his tyres won't go flat.

 

[oldbadger]

Alright! I found that funny but I have to add... behold, there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven. You have to admit God has a wonderful sense of humour. At least his tyres won't go flat.

That description gets more interesting day by day, especially now that three planets 38 light years away have been discovered which can support life.

Maybe Elijah was collected by spaceship?

 

[oldbadger]

The verses do not say that a rich person cannot enter, only that is is harder for a rich man to enter.

Ah ha! So you've got a wedge stashed away, then?
I suppose a camel could get through that eye if it went on a modern diet.