Christians in politics, what say you regarding this?

[Epic Beard Man]

Its another example of a news network not sticking to the news and trying to scare everyone to death.

I am scared as well. Considering we have a racist, bigot, misogynist, and idiot that have the keys to the nukes. He had a large portion of the country believing that Obama was not a citizen, something ridiculous considering any government office the government does background checks on any applicant applying for a U.S. government job. If he can convince the people Obama was a citizen just imagine the stupidity and the danger that comes a long with it?

 

[Brickjectivity]

I am scared as well. Considering we have a racist, bigot, misogynist, and idiot that have the keys to the nukes. He had a large portion of the country believing that Obama was not a citizen, something ridiculous considering any government office the government does background checks on any applicant applying for a U.S. government job. If he can convince the people Obama was a citizen just imagine the stupidity and the danger that comes a long with it?

There are always people like Donald Trump in corridors of power. We don't always see them there. How does he become so visible and well known? Part of the reason he getts elected is these news agencies pretending they can do political commentary when they are driven by advertising. Anything outlandish or frightening or sensational becomes their repetitive day-in day-out message -- or whatever their sponsors desire either. Thus they help this man obtain power through negligence. Even now they are helping him.

 

[metis]

I discern from these scriptures that a Christian cannot be part of this world for all the reasons Jesus gave.

Then maybe stop eating because food is "part of this world".

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with politics, and all religious bodies, including yours, have a political aspect to them because decisions have to be made by someone. Also, we see God actually setting up political leadership at times, such as with David, so if "be not of this world" is incumbent on politics, then why did God violate his own supposed teachings?

IMO, what Jesus was teaching was not to avoid politics, which is virtually impossible anyway, but for the purpose of setting priorities. If all "righteous" people never get involved in politics, doesn't that leave all leadership, including with your JW's, to the "unrighteous"?

 

[David T]

If I were Christian watching this, I'd seriously consider atheism...

Normal. So Sad they believe they aren't.

 

[Stanyon]

If I were Christian watching this, I'd seriously consider atheism...

So a group of six women who extend forgiveness and understanding as per their stated religious beliefs seem to dictate should cause others of that religion to turn away from it? Please explain the logic you used to come to your speculation

Considering we have a racist, bigot, misogynist, and idiot

All powdered allegations from political opponents that were mixed into the kool-aid jug meant for consumption by the greater unwashed masses.

idiot that has the keys to the nukes.

Despite numerous threats and provocations somehow we have not had a nuclear war with North Korea, or concentration camps for Muslims, or an open season on black people.

Donald Trump condemned all sides in Chalottesville = obviously a Nazi

Jacob Zuma sings Kill the Boer (whites) in South Africa = Hero?

After the line "we going to shoot them" I was waiting for the line " an da PO- lices won't do nuffins!"

 

[PureX]

If a Christian cannot serve two masters, then he should not engage in representational politics. Because in a representational democracy, such as ours is supposed to be, it is the politician's duty and responsibility to serve the will of his/her constituents. Not the will of his/her God.

 

[Jumi]

After the line "we going to shoot them" I was waiting for the line " an da PO- lices won't do nuffins!"

Way out of line...

 

[Aldrnari]

After the line "we going to shoot them" I was waiting for the line " an da PO- lices won't do nuffins!"

Distasteful and disgraceful...

 

[pearl]

If a Christian cannot serve two masters, then he should not engage in representational politics. Because in a representational democracy, such as ours is supposed to be, it is the politician's duty and responsibility to serve the will of his/her constituents. Not the will of his/her God.

Until John Paul II it was permissible for clergy to be elected to public office, but in the case of Father Robert Drinan, he seemed to have 'served his constituents.'

It was gossiped at the time that the bishops of the United States pressed Pope John Paul II into forbidding priests from holding public office simply to get Father Drinan out of Congress. It is likely that many American bishops complained about him to the Vatican. It is hard to believe that the pope -- so committed to respecting life of the unborn and so insistent that priests represent the Church authentically -- would have been indifferent to such complaints.

Father Drinan indeed was a most unfortunate tutor for Catholic laypeople holding political office at the time of his service and thereafter. In fact, many Catholic politicians in office today eulogized him in late January by saying that they took their cue from him, and, sadly, they found in him the excuse to ignore the Church's teaching regarding abortion, certainly to ignore the spirit of this teaching if not the letter. (Former presidential candidate Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) was Father Drinan's campaign manager in 1970.)

Father Drinan's legacy

 

[Stanyon]

Way out of line...

Distasteful and disgraceful...

Strive to look for the good in everyone

Murder rate for these white farmers 20 times international average

South Africa farm murders: Jacob Zuma calls for white land to be confiscated

#BlackMonday: White farmers protest against farm murder | South Africa News | Al Jazeera

How To Kill A Country - The Atlantic

South Africa | U.S. Agency for International Development
I want my money back

 

[Aldrnari]

Strive to look for the good in everyone

Murder rate for these white farmers 20 times international average

South Africa farm murders: Jacob Zuma calls for white land to be confiscated

#BlackMonday: White farmers protest against farm murder | South Africa News | Al Jazeera

How To Kill A Country - The Atlantic

South Africa | U.S. Agency for International Development
I want my money back

Oh, I agree that Jacob Zuma is an evil person. What I'm confused by, though, is what racist African American stereotypes have to do with him. Enlighten me about the connection, please. Maybe I'm mistaken (or, at least, I hope I am).

 

[PureX]

Until John Paul II it was permissible for clergy to be elected to public office, but in the case of Father Robert Drinan, he seemed to have 'served his constituents.'

It was gossiped at the time that the bishops of the United States pressed Pope John Paul II into forbidding priests from holding public office simply to get Father Drinan out of Congress. It is likely that many American bishops complained about him to the Vatican. It is hard to believe that the pope -- so committed to respecting life of the unborn and so insistent that priests represent the Church authentically -- would have been indifferent to such complaints.

Father Drinan indeed was a most unfortunate tutor for Catholic laypeople holding political office at the time of his service and thereafter. In fact, many Catholic politicians in office today eulogized him in late January by saying that they took their cue from him, and, sadly, they found in him the excuse to ignore the Church's teaching regarding abortion, certainly to ignore the spirit of this teaching if not the letter.

I agree with the pope's position on priests avoiding political office. However, I think priests must be free to engage in political activism if they feel compelled to do so by the Holy Spirit. I also believe they must be free to do so even when doing so conflicts with the church's position on socio-political matters.

 

[Deeje]

Then maybe stop eating because food is "part of this world".

Taking our que from Jesus and the apostles, it is not difficult to draw appropriate lines and not cross them.

Did Jesus eat? Whilst walking through a field on one occasion, Jesus and his companions grasped a handful of grain and ate it on the move. It was a Sabbath and the Pharisees accused them of harvesting. Was the son of God breaking the Sabbath? Was the law meant to be taken so rigidly? The legal eagles apparently thought so.
So eating is OK by Jesus' own example. A balanced approach is needed. Many of the Israelites were farmers, so growing food is OK, cooking it is too. Jesus cooked breakfast for his apostles.

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with politics, and all religious bodies, including yours, have a political aspect to them because decisions have to be made by someone.

In speaking of the world and its ruler we can see what Jesus meant when speaking of the rulers of this world. (1 John 5:19; 2 Corinthians 4:3-4) Having an organised body to take the lead and accept responsibility for its actions is important in any organisation, no matter how big...or small. How the peace and stability of that organisation is maintained is largely about how roles and duties are performed and the correct attitude demonstrated towards others. Jesus said "all are brothers" which means no 'bosses'. (Matthew 22:8-9; Phillipians 2:2-4)

What is "intrinsically wrong" with politics is the well known fact of human nature that "power corrupts"...we all know it does, so in any political or religious organisation, there needs to be oversight, but not power. The buck has to stop with someone, and in Israel, there was order and duty, but the head of their nation was God, represented by those he appointed. All answered to him. It was God's rules that had to be followed, but as the Pharisees demonstrated, for every law, they made many, virtually impossible rules. No wonder the sheep got lost.

Also, we see God actually setting up political leadership at times, such as with David, so if "be not of this world" is incumbent on politics, then why did God violate his own supposed teachings?

Having a human king in Israel was not God's idea. It was the people who wanted a human king to make them like the nations. God warned them about the downside of this arrangement, but the people would not listen. (as usual) So Jehovah instituted human kings (only from Judah) and allowed the people to again experience the full consequences of their ill conceived decision. How many wicked kings led their nation astray, warranting often severe punishment from God? Please think about that.

IMO, what Jesus was teaching was not to avoid politics, which is virtually impossible anyway, but for the purpose of setting priorities.

Again, what example did Jesus and his apostles set in this regard? Did they ever advocate entering the Roman political scene in order to lift the oppressive yoke of pagan political domination? The Jewish zealots were constantly plotting against Rome, but there were none of Jesus' disciples among them. Not once do we see Jesus advocating political involvement.

When speaking about the political powers of this world, we never see Jesus saying that politics would solve any of their problems.....in fact, it was the political powers and the people who supported them that were opposing the work that Jesus and his disciples were doing. They advocated God's kingdom as the only hope for mankind. And the worldly kingdoms were going to be "crushed" out of existence when the judge comes for his accounting. (Daniel 2:44) We cannot be found supporting this world's rulers when they don't follow Christ's teachings. In spite of some claiming to be "Christians", they have so much blood on their hands. (Isaiah 1:15)

If all "righteous" people never get involved in politics, doesn't that leave all leadership, including with your JW's, to the "unrighteous"?

Just because the governments of this world control our lives to a relative degree, we still have to live in this world and God sees to it that his will can be done in spite of it. If we involve ourselves in politics, conflict will divide our loyalties. If we are part of the problem, we can never be part of the solution.

The "unrighteousness" are not necessarily "bad" people but simply not believers, which means that their behavior and agenda is not governed by God's laws....they can make their own. Many "good" humanitarians are atheists. God never said that being a "good" person was all that was needed.

When we consider what God has required of human beings from day one...."obedience" to his commands....then it becomes obvious where the line of demarcation begins and ends. We must be good, but we must also be obedient to God from the heart. He must be our Sovereign ruler.

Christians are not to be either "pro" or "anti" politics....we are to be completely neutral....i.e. we are to obey the laws of the land so that none of us suffer as a criminal (a thief or a murderer etc) but we also cannot break God's law if our government asks us to....i.e. to kill another human being just because they are of a different nation, religion or political persuasion. Christians are to love their brothers as well as their enemies.....a command to go to war and kill those who fall under those categories divides our loyalties and separates us from God.

We cannot serve two masters. Those who want to be citizens of God's kingdom cannot pledge allegiance to any worldly nation. We are to pledge our alliegance to God alone. Where there is a conflict of interest, then there is only one choice for Christians. This is how we view things.

 

[Jumi]

Strive to look for the good in everyone

Shallow perspectives noted. You don't need to try, you have memes. You can be as lazy as you want and make as many random connections to things that aren't connected. As long as you have memes and a few webpages to link without any explanation, you probably think your propaganda is working or even right?

I want my money back

Wanting isn't going to change anything.

 

[Stanyon]

You can be as lazy as you want

Hey, thanks for the permission!

 

[Epic Beard Man]

There are always people like Donald Trump in corridors of power. We don't always see them there. How does he become so visible and well known? Part of the reason he getts elected is these news agencies pretending they can do political commentary when they are driven by advertising. Anything outlandish or frightening or sensational becomes their repetitive day-in day-out message -- or whatever their sponsors desire either. Thus they help this man obtain power through negligence. Even now they are helping him.

Agreed. Then again I've never been a man that never trusted politicians or wannabes but I'll admit, I was fooled this time.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Way out of line...

I wont even give a response to that.....

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Distasteful and disgraceful...

The cool part is I don't have to address something so obvious to you and @Jumi.

 

[Aldrnari]

The cool part is I don't have to address something so obvious to you and @Jumi.

And yet, @Stanyon has yet to address my request. His silence speaks volumes to me.

 

[metis]

Jesus said "all are brothers" which means no 'bosses'.

False, as God is a "Boss", Jesus is a "Boss" to Christians, and the apostles were "Bosses" to the Christian community. At no point in time with Jesus' ministry did he ever say or suggest that Christianity was a "do your own thing" type of relationship. Jesus "taught with authority", so I do think it's very clear that he was "Boss" over this community, and that it was God, the ultimate "Boss", that he took direction from. Since the NT did not exist at first, it was these "Bosses" that people were guided by, and that same exact paradigm was followed by the church as it went through decade after decade and century after century.

What is "intrinsically wrong" with politics is the well known fact of human nature that "power corrupts"...we all know it does, so in any political or religious organisation, there needs to be oversight, but not power.

And there also is "oversight" in a democratic country to try and check corruption. And can be corruption in a religious community as well, btw-- just ask my one set of former JW neighbors that left.

It was God's rules that had to be followed, but as the Pharisees demonstrated, for every law, they made many, virtually impossible rules. No wonder the sheep got lost.

The "building the fence around the Torah" was done in order to try and protect the Law because it's human nature to try and "fudge" on laws, with they be religious or secular.

Having a human king in Israel was not God's idea.

False, as there are quite a few Laws given to Moses that deal with guidelines that are to be followed by whomever is king, and they are found in Torah: Judaism 101: A List of the 613 Mitzvot (Commandments)

When speaking about the political powers of this world, we never see Jesus saying that politics would solve any of their problems....

If you actually believe in what you're saying, then what you would logically be in favor of would be "anarchy", and I think history well shows that anarchy is unstable, usually resulting in being replaced by an authoritarian system.

What you keep on missing is the very simple fact what even an elementary Sunday School child well knows, and that is that in the OT God "anointed" kings, such as David, and He also has rules for kings. What that leaves us with is that either God is a scatterbrained idiot who can't make up his mind or that your depiction of God, vis-a-vis politics, is seriously flawed, and I would suggest that it's the latter.