Christians Only: The Book of Mormon

[sojourner]

Why would that be the criteria ? Do you only trust and believe things only if authored by the person in question . Don't we trust eyewitnesses. Consider the bible. Written over 1500 years with over 40 different authors all converging together a historical narrative and events on a timeline of events.

Because you said you’d trust Jesus over anyone else. That must include biblical authors.

 

[sojourner]

Is this what you have learned through reading the bible?

Through exegeting the biblical texts, yes.

 

[John1.12]

The Bible doesn’t list authors except for Paul, who was not an eyewitness.

How do you know Paul wasn't an eyewitness? What Paul didn't see or hear anything?

 

[sojourner]

I trust who Jesus is by what was written about him . Surely you believe things about people who have been written about from eyewitness in history ?

Nothing was written by eyewitnesses.

 

[sojourner]

So we only have Paul's name in the entire bible? No other name is mentioned as the one writing...at all ? Just Paul ? No clues at all of any other named author..like not even one ?

Yes. None of the earliest texts are signed or ascribed, other than Paul.

speaking specifically of the gospel texts. The other letters are far too late to have been penned by an eyewitness.

 

[John1.12]

Because you said you’d trust Jesus over anyone else. That must include biblical authors.

I meant like Muhammad, Joseph Smith , Charles Taze Russell , ect

 

[sojourner]

I meant like Muhammad, Joseph Smith , Charles Taze Russell , ect

How are unnamed biblical authors more reliable than anyone else?

 

[John1.12]

Yes. None of the earliest texts are signed or ascribed, other than Paul.

Let's pretend we have no clue about names ( Bart Erhman) ,would it matter ? Does John ,Peter ,Luke , James ect matter?.what difference would it make ?

 

[Jane.Doe]

You test it . You read it .

I have. My ultimate test is ruining things by God Himself.

How about you? How do you know that any book claiming to be of God really is?

 

[John1.12]

Nothing was written by eyewitnesses.

That's not what the bible says .

 

[sojourner]

How do you know Paul wasn't an eyewitness? What Paul didn't see or hear anything?

First, Paul never claims to be an eyewitness to any of the Jesus events. Second, not all letters attributed to Paul were written by him, but by someone later on, probably students or followers of his.

 

[John1.12]

How are unnamed biblical authors more reliable than anyone else?

What's the obsession with names ?

 

[sojourner]

What's the obsession with names ?

Names are very helpful in establishing provenance. No name = limited credibility.

 

[John1.12]

First, Paul never claims to be an eyewitness to any of the Jesus events. Second, not all letters attributed to Paul were written by him, but by someone later on, probably students or followers of his.

Paul literally saw Jesus , heard Jesus and was taught directly by Jesus. These are his claims.

 

[John1.12]

Names are very helpful in establishing provenance. No name = limited credibility.

You want the name of a fisherman?

 

[sojourner]

Let's pretend we have no clue about names ( Bart Erhman) ,would it matter ? Does John ,Peter ,Luke , James ect matter?.what difference would it make ?

If you don’t have a name, you can’t establish either eyewitness or apostolic provenance.

 

[John1.12]

First, Paul never claims to be an eyewitness to any of the Jesus events. Second, not all letters attributed to Paul were written by him, but by someone later on, probably students or followers of his.

This is even radical by Bart Erhman s standards.

 

[sojourner]

Paul literally saw Jesus , heard Jesus and was taught directly by Jesus. These are his claims.

Paul saw a vision of post-resurrection Jesus. He was not an eyewitness to Jesus’ ministry.

 

[sojourner]

This is even radical by Bart Erhman s standards.

No it’s not.

 

[sojourner]

You want the name of a fisherman?

Why a fisherman? We’re trying to establish eyewitness or apostolic provenance. There is no evidence to assume such.