TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
He sounds like a butthurt 5-year old with serious anger management issues and extreme psychological insecurities.
A real basket case.
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Comprehension of Evolution and Creation
- Thread starter questfortruth
- Start date
A real basket case.
wellwisher
Well-Known Member
Evolution does not have a sense of direction. This is one of the reasons it is hard to predict the future using the correlation of evolution. Creation, on the other hand, has a sense of direction, since it is part of a plan that takes time to unfold; build a house. Creation can better anticipate the future states. The dinosaurs evolved and then became extinct due to an asteroid. Who saw that coming? The i-phone was created and under went size changes in the lab and in board meetings. Many Apple executives and engineers saw it coming since they lead the change.
Evolution has an internal potential that drives and resists change; DNA. The I-phone does not change or resist change from the inside, via anything analogous to DNA. It is molded from the outside in R&D labs. There is no genetic resistance or assistance to change. Resistance and assistance to change is also from the outside; bean counters and collectors. Humans evolved from apes, but the modern humans who started civilization were created. Civilization, which was created by man, set artificial potentials that are planned, to help create a cultural human. This is not the same as evolution and natural selection. It is artificial selection; creation.
The invention of writing about 6000 years ago; science based estimate due to carbon dating, coincides with the creation of Adam and Eve. The bible claim that Adam and Eve were also created 6000 years ago was based on the external potentials cause by the new pivotal invention. It would lead to a repression of DNA based instinct; tree of life is removed.
Repression was predictable. It would detach the natural human animal consciousness, from its genetic based roots. Writing then took further advantage of the split between mind and body and widened the gap ; loss of instinct. How many humans know what natural instinct is? This was due to law or knowledge of good and evil. Cultural rules of right and wrong do not have to be natural or objective, to be enforced and followed. Laws and rules can be based on bad ideas. This created predictable natural problems that widened the gap even further. Adam and Eve were created by a split in their mind and body caused by writing. This was not in their DNA. It was a choice via willpower. When they ate of the tree of knowledge; cultural rules and law, they departed from natural evolution into artificial creation. They started the modern era.
Evolution is natural and does not create a regression into a worse natural state. Creation can advance or regress. The long term impact of any invention can be negative; TNT. The domestic dog is not as fit as the wolf in the natural wild. His instincts are detached from nature to some degree. However, the domestic dog is more adapted to the artificial environments of civilization ,via an inroad to humans. It was created by human selection, instead of natural selection, to better align with the emotional and work needs of humans.
Both evolution and creation are correct in their own areas, but the line between them is not clear to most people, due to each side wanting to assume one way or the high way. Adam and Eve had human DNA, but their natural consciousness connected their DNA, became repressed; created a new type of human. Their natural consciousness of paradise; DNA, was replaced by a created consciousness, due to writing, culture and civilization. The rules of work and camping are different.
Like the domestic dog, if civilization was disrupted, very few humans are prepared for the potentials of the natural environment, because of the split within their DNA based instincts. In such a case, human evolution would reappear; natural drive with minimal cultural potential. The mountain man would separate and thrive. The cultural man will scavenge and steal
Creating the universe is something that science does in his imagination; man made. We build tools to extend our senses and try to make sense of what we see. These models change over time, since the previous model was created ,and was not the final truth of natural universe evolution. Genesis contained the first published theory of the universe and evolution created by man; created. If science ever reached the steady truth of physical reality, there would be no need to fund any further science. The fact that we still fund science shows doubt even in latest creations.
Evolution has an internal potential that drives and resists change; DNA. The I-phone does not change or resist change from the inside, via anything analogous to DNA. It is molded from the outside in R&D labs. There is no genetic resistance or assistance to change. Resistance and assistance to change is also from the outside; bean counters and collectors. Humans evolved from apes, but the modern humans who started civilization were created. Civilization, which was created by man, set artificial potentials that are planned, to help create a cultural human. This is not the same as evolution and natural selection. It is artificial selection; creation.
The invention of writing about 6000 years ago; science based estimate due to carbon dating, coincides with the creation of Adam and Eve. The bible claim that Adam and Eve were also created 6000 years ago was based on the external potentials cause by the new pivotal invention. It would lead to a repression of DNA based instinct; tree of life is removed.
Repression was predictable. It would detach the natural human animal consciousness, from its genetic based roots. Writing then took further advantage of the split between mind and body and widened the gap ; loss of instinct. How many humans know what natural instinct is? This was due to law or knowledge of good and evil. Cultural rules of right and wrong do not have to be natural or objective, to be enforced and followed. Laws and rules can be based on bad ideas. This created predictable natural problems that widened the gap even further. Adam and Eve were created by a split in their mind and body caused by writing. This was not in their DNA. It was a choice via willpower. When they ate of the tree of knowledge; cultural rules and law, they departed from natural evolution into artificial creation. They started the modern era.
Evolution is natural and does not create a regression into a worse natural state. Creation can advance or regress. The long term impact of any invention can be negative; TNT. The domestic dog is not as fit as the wolf in the natural wild. His instincts are detached from nature to some degree. However, the domestic dog is more adapted to the artificial environments of civilization ,via an inroad to humans. It was created by human selection, instead of natural selection, to better align with the emotional and work needs of humans.
Both evolution and creation are correct in their own areas, but the line between them is not clear to most people, due to each side wanting to assume one way or the high way. Adam and Eve had human DNA, but their natural consciousness connected their DNA, became repressed; created a new type of human. Their natural consciousness of paradise; DNA, was replaced by a created consciousness, due to writing, culture and civilization. The rules of work and camping are different.
Like the domestic dog, if civilization was disrupted, very few humans are prepared for the potentials of the natural environment, because of the split within their DNA based instincts. In such a case, human evolution would reappear; natural drive with minimal cultural potential. The mountain man would separate and thrive. The cultural man will scavenge and steal
Creating the universe is something that science does in his imagination; man made. We build tools to extend our senses and try to make sense of what we see. These models change over time, since the previous model was created ,and was not the final truth of natural universe evolution. Genesis contained the first published theory of the universe and evolution created by man; created. If science ever reached the steady truth of physical reality, there would be no need to fund any further science. The fact that we still fund science shows doubt even in latest creations.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
The basic process, namely that life forms tend to evolve over time, is considered to be an "axiom". And in the scientific arena, "theory" means something quite different than in common usage of that terminology:
"A theory is a carefully thought-out explanation for observations of the natural world that has been constructed using the scientific method, and which brings together many facts and hypotheses. ... A scientist makes an observation of a natural phenomenon." -- What Do We Mean by “Theory” in Science?.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
See above.
questfortruth
Well-Known Member
There are problems with criminality in pre-Flood humankind:
1. People have now eaten animals, but they have eaten people. They were all cannibals, except Noa's family.
2. They have manipulated the DNA.
Perhaps it was not clear, but that was my point in mentioning Newton and gravity. Newton did not have a complete theory, but it was good enough to be useful and form the basis of further inquiry.
What about Santa?
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
So do you invent these claims as you go, on the spot?
questfortruth
Well-Known Member
No, they are outputs of my analytical mind, with sufficient reasoning.
Reason one: God loves sinners, but not so much the very bad sinners like Hitler.
TagliatelliMonster
Veteran Member
You say "no", but then go on to actually confirm that indeed, you make these claims up as you go along.
More claims.
I recently learned a German word for that, which you might like if not already familiar with it:
"Fremdscham - shame felt for actions done by someone else; vicarious embarrassment, secondhand embarrassment."
Biological evolution is a form of adaptation, the adaptation of populations to their environments over generations due to natural selection acting on genetic variation. And Darwin didn't discover adaptation.
There are other forms of adaptation, such as tanning in the sun, but this does not involve a change in DNA and occurs in an individual rather than a population. There is also non-biological adaptation, such as what we went through this past year in response to a pandemic. Or, one can adapt a screenplay to the stage. The term is broader in its extension than you acknowledge.
A Vestigial Mote
Well-Known Member
I consider myself somewhat of a logophile (I used to keep long lists of words that I read that I didn't know the definitions for so I could look them up in the dictionary), so I do thank you for the new vocab addition!
Really? So do I. I have a Word document where I deposit words I see and want to retain, like fremdscham. Here's a sample:
Agnotology - the study of how ignorance arises via circulation of misinformation calculated to mislead.
Univocal - (of a word or term) having only one possible meaning; unambiguous.
Job's comforter - a person who aggravates distress under the guise of giving comfort.
Retcon - (shortened form of RETroactive CONtinuity; first made popular in the comic book world) 1. (original meaning) Adding information to the back story of a fictional character or world, without invalidating that which had gone before. 2. (more common usage) Adding or altering information regarding the back story of a fictional character or world, regardless of whether the change contradicts what was said before. 1. Although they had previously been shown to have two other sets of parents, the retcon of making Quicksilver and the Scarlet Witch the children of Magneto only altered the meaning of past events, not what had happened.2. Retconning Dawn Summers into "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" in the fifth season was one of the rare instances where the fact that history has been altered for our characters was recognized in the story, even though the characters all still remembered the "new" versions of events.
Dysania - the state of having a hard time waking up and getting out of bed in the morning.
Experrection - waking up or awakening.
Hypnagogic jerks, hypnopompic jerks - hypnagogic jerks are the spasms that happen right when you fall asleep; hypnopompic jerks happen right when you are waking up.
Indicia - signs, indications, or distinguishing marks.
Longanimity - calmness in the face of suffering and adversity; forbearance.
Vexatious Litigation - a legal action or proceeding initiated maliciously and without Probable Cause by an individual who is not acting in Good Faith for the purpose of annoying or embarrassing an opponent.
Term of Art - A word or phrase that has special meaning in a particular context. Terms of art abound in the law. For example, the phrase double jeopardy can be used in common parlance to describe any situation that poses two risks. In the law, Double Jeopardy refers specifically to an impermissible second trial of a defendant for the same offense that gave rise to the first trial.
Stadials and interstadials - phases dividing the Quaternary period, the last 2.6 million years. Stadial are colder periods and interstadials are warmer. Each phase has a Marine Isotope Stage (MIS) number, working backwards from the present, with stadial having even numbers and interstadials odd numbers. Thus the current Holocene is MIS1 and the most recent ice age is MIS2
Verificationism - the doctrine that a proposition is only cognitively meaningful if it can be definitively and conclusively determined to be either true or false (i.e. verifiable or falsifiable).
Sodality – fellowship or comradeship, an association or society.
Cabotage - navigation or trade along the coast.
Incunabula - the earliest stages or first traces of anything.
Subrogate - to put into the place of another; substitute for another.
Longueur - A long and dull passage in a work of literature
Periphrasis - the use of an unnecessarily long or roundabout form of expression; circumlocution.
Peripetia - A sudden or unexpected change of fortune, especially in a literary work
Comminate - to threaten with divine punishment or vengeance.
Beau-nasty- a slovenly fop; one finely dressed, but dirty. This term's also used to refer to mobsters, who appear nice on the surface, but are nasty thugs underneath.
Foodways - the cultural, social and economic practices relating to the production and consumption of food. Foodways often refers to the intersection of food in culture, traditions, and history.
Carminative - an herb or preparation intended to either prevent formation of gas in the gastrointestinal tract or facilitate the expulsion of said gas, thereby combating flatulence.
Escamotage - juggling, sleight of hand, trickery
Obscurantism - the practice of deliberately preventing the facts or full details of something from becoming known.
Moral realism – the idea that moral truths have an objective reality outside of the heads of sentient creatures. The rebuttal is that “objective values” is an oxymoron, since because they depend on preference, values are inherently subjective. So-called objective truths are then unjustifiably attached by fiat to the whims of a transcendent lawgiver. It’s a circular argument that because morality exists, a god exists, and morality is defined by a presumed existence of a god
Self-licking ice cream cone - a self-perpetuating system that has no purpose other than to sustain itself.
Metopic - of or relating to the forehead.
Ultracrepidate - to venture beyond one's purview. From the Latin phrase ultra crepidam ("beyond the sandal")
Fallibilism - the principle that propositions concerning empirical knowledge can be accepted even though they cannot be proved with certainty, or the philosophical principle that human beings could be wrong about their beliefs, expectations, or their understanding of the world, and yet still be justified in holding their incorrect beliefs, since mankind is incapable of knowing when we have come upon the truth. The truth may exist, and we may even believe the truth, but we will never know for sure when or if we do. Yet it is still our duty to seek the truth. We do this is by guessing (hypothesizing), experimenting, and then seeing if our guess was correct. Fallibilism applies to ethics, too. Truth about human behavior may exist - an absolute standard we are meant to follow. But we will never know if we have discovered that truth. And so our duty is to observe and contemplate which actions lead to the best results for humanity. With continued effort and experimentation, we might come closer to knowing how to live. In the most commonly used sense of the term, fallibilism consists of being open to new evidence that would contradict some previously held position or belief, and in the recognition that "any claim justified today may need to be revised or withdrawn in light of new evidence, new arguments, and new experiences. This position is taken for granted in the natural sciences.
A Vestigial Mote
Well-Known Member
I'm handy with web-coding (HTML, client-side scripting, CSS an the like) and several years ago I created a vocabulary tester page to which I could quickly and easily add more entries. When opened the page presents a random word from the list, and gives 4 possibilities as to the definition from like word categories (nouns are only presented with the definitions to nouns, verbs with verb definitions, etc.) Believe it or not the items from your sample list "cabotage", "sodality" and "comminate" are already in it!
Some other examples from my store:
soporific - adj. causing or tending to cause sleep; pertaining to or characterized by sleep or sleepiness; sleepy; drowsy
contretemps - n. an inopportune occurrence; an embarrassing mischance
lumpen - adj. of or pertaining to disfranchised and uprooted individuals or groups, especially those who have lost status. ; -n. a lumpen individual or group
pavonine - adj. of or like a peacock; resembling the feathers of a peacock, as in coloring
thaumaturgy - n. the working of wonders or miracles; magic
otiose - adj. being at leisure, idle, indolent; ineffective or futile. superfluous or useless
nonpareil - adj. having no equal; peerless.
cavil - vb. to raise irritating and trivial objections; find fault with unnecessarily (usually followed by at or about )
meretricious - adj. alluring by a show of flashy or vulgar attractions; tawdry; based on pretense, deception, or insincerity; pertaining to or characteristic of a prostitute
eldritch - adj. eerie; weird; spooky.
litotes - n. understatement, especially that in which an affirmative is expressed by the negative of its contrary, as in "not bad at all."
frore - adj. frozen; frosty.
You may know quite a few of those from above - this was just a quick grab from the script of some of the ones I found to be interesting and caught my eye for this particular scan.
I should start using the script again. Keeps the vocabulary fresh with tests and reaffirmation of both the words and their meanings. I find that the more one's vocabulary is increased, the more even relatively "advanced" words from prior knowledge become part of normal usage.
We're kindred spirits in this area.
How about some more? I also like to collect lists of similar or related words and look at them collectively to help distinguish them from one another, a great way to grow one's vocabulary. You'll enjoy these I suspect:
Cursorial - running birds (roadrunner, ostrich)
Raptorial - swoops and steals prey like an owl or pelican.
Insessorial - perching (jays)
Scansorial - climbing (woodpeckers) climb.
Gressorial - walking (penguins)
Natatorial - swimming (ducks, penguins)
Piscatorial - fishing (pelicans)
Saltatorial - hopping (sparrows)
Rasorial - scratching (chickens).
Jaculatory - darting (hummingbirds)
Suctorial - adapted for sucking
[1] Acrotomphiliac - one sexually attracted to stumps of amputees
[2] Chremasitophiliac - one excited by paying for sex
[3] Dysmorphophiliac - one who prefers deformed sexual partners
[4] Eproctolagniac - one who is sexually stimulated by farting (active or passive)
[5] Hybristophiliac - one sexually excited by being with a criminal
[6] Klismaphiliac - a person with a fetish for enemas
[7] Mysophiliac - one with a fetish for filth or excretions
[8] Parepithymia - perverted craving due to mental illness
[1] Vale - a valley (used in place names or as a poetic term): "the Vale of Glamorgan."
[2] Glen - a narrow, often deep valley.
[3] Strath - a large valley, typically a river valley that is wide and shallow
[4] Dale - a valley, esp. a broad one.
[5] Mountain cove - a small valley, closed at one or both ends.
[6] Hollow - a small valley surrounded by mountains or ridges
[7] Coon (or combe or coombe) - a deep, narrow valley.
[8] Canyon - a deep gorge, typically one with a river flowing through it, as found in North America.
[9] Gorge - narrow valley between hills or mountains, typically with steep rocky walls and a stream running through it.
[10] Ravine - a deep, narrow gorge with steep sides.
[11] Gully - a water-worn ravine.
[12] Arroyo - a steep-sided gully cut by running water in an arid or semiarid region.
[13] Gulch - a narrow and steep-sided ravine marking the course of a fast stream.
[14] Kloof - (in South Africa) a deep glen; ravine.
[15] Droke - a valley with steeply sloping sides (Canadian, chiefly Atlantic Provinces and Northwest Territories).
blatherskite - person who babbles about inane matters.
blowmaunger - a person so fat that his cheeks puff out
breedbate - a troublemaker looking for an argument or a fight
clatterfart - chattering woman
clodhopper - clumsy, awkward fellow
codswallop - nonsense, balderdash.
crambazzle - a worn-out, dissipated old man
crepehanger - a pessimistic killjoy, always warning, deflated, predicting failure. etc.
cumberground - worthless object or person that is just in the way
cumberworld - one so infirm, disfigured or lazy as to be a useless burden to society
draffsack - a major glutton and his huge belly
dunderwhelp - a detestable numbskull
flibbertigibbet - chattering or flighty, light-headed person.
gilly-gaupus - awkward person, foolish or silly person.
gubbertush - a bucktoothed person
gundygut - an offensive, mannerless eater
guttersnipe - a child who spends most of his time in the streets especially in slum areas
jobberknowle - am obese, dim-witted person
knipperdollin - a fanatical idiot
lackwit - idiot
lickspigot - a revolting parasite
lickspittle - fawning underling, toady
mumblecrust - a toothless old beggar
ninnyhammer - fool or simpleton
quakebuttock - coward, sissy
quibberdick - nasty quibbler
quockerwodger - a wooden toy or person that jerks its limbs when pulled by a string
ripesuck - one who is easily bribed
scapegrace - habitually unscrupulous person; scamp
scofflaw - a person flagrantly defying the law
seeksorrow - one who seeks to give himself vexation
shotclog - a bore tolerated only because he buys the drinks
slotterhodge - a messy eater
smellfungus - perpetual pessimist
sneckdraw - a sneak-thief who quietly enters houses
snivelard - someone who speaks through the nose; a nasal or whiny person
snollygoster - an unprincipled person, especially in politics
snoutband - one who constantly interrupts to contradict
swartwouter - a fleeing embezzler
throttlebottom - purposeless incompetent in public office.
tommyrot - nonsense
A Vestigial Mote
Well-Known Member
I see what you mean with the grouping, and that makes a lot of sense. I find it interesting how many words there are for women doing certain negatively connotated things. Like your "clatterfart" (what a word!). in my script I was perusing earlier, I came across two others:
virago - n. a loud-voiced, ill-tempered, scolding woman; shrew
harridan - n. a scolding, vicious woman; hag; shrew
It's making me want to research what specific words there are for men of negative ascription (perhaps like "crambazzle").
Also - I am stealing some of those you listed here to add to my script, which you have inspired me to dust off. So thanks!
questfortruth
Well-Known Member
The bulldog gives birth to a bulldog, not to a german shepherd. Therefore, the bulldog specie has its own unique DNA.
Bear Wild
Well-Known Member
How in the world did we then get a Pekepoo then? Poodles sleeping with Pekingese, oh my, what is this world coming too!!!
Bear Wild
Well-Known Member
I am such a curmudgeon for not knowing all of these. I will seek to do better.
The individual bulldog has it's own unique DNA. But that is irrelevant to my point, which is that biological evolution is a form of adaptation. Your comment that what we observe is adaptation and not evolution is to say that an element of a set (evolution) is not a member of the set (the various forms of adaptation).
Adaptation is simply modification in order to better accomplish a purpose. It can be biological, psychological/behavioral (nonbiological personal change), or cultural (nonbiological group change).
Among forms of biological adaptation are biological evolution, which as was noted, occurs in populations over generations and is caused by changes in the population's gene pool subject to natural selection, and changes that occur in the bodies of individuals within a lifetime, such as tanning to adapt to increased personal insolation or acclimating to higher altitudes by increasing red cell production. Behavioral adaptation is what drug and alcohol rehab hopes to facilitate, as is the case with prisons and criminal behavior. Cultural adaptation is in the news now as the US scrambles to adapt to cyberterrorism attack, or as religions change over time as we see with the pope.
In each example something is changing - an individual or a population - to be better able to live or function better in its present environment.
I'll tell you what others have surely told you in the past: You have zero chance of accomplishing your presumed goal of promoting your world view if it antiscientific, your audience includes the scientifically literate, and you make errors of fact and/or logic in your presentation.
I'd also like to point out something from the philosophy of argumentation/rhetoric, the word logos refers to the spoken or written message, and ethos refers to the perceived character and credibility of its source. If your ethos is damaged, your logos is less well received, perhaps not even listened to seriously. Your audience judges you on how well you appear to know the material, how clear you are in presenting it, whether you seem honest or have a hidden agenda, whether the speaker has shared values with the audience, and even personal appearance if the author of the message is visible to the audience.
Your ethos is shot here. The people rebutting you have seen that you don't understand evolution at all even as you argue against its validity. Perhaps you don't agree that that has happened, but surely you would agree that when it does, it renders the speaker powerless to persuade the critical thinker in the way the speaker/writer intended.
GardenLady
Active Member
In general, breeds (not species) of dogs are not a good example of evolution. They do not result from natural selection; they result from directed selection with humans directing the breeding of dogs. Bulldogs are a breed of dogs, not a species; the definition of a species is the ability to breed and produce fertile offspring. Nearly all dog breeds can inter-breed and produce fertile offspring, giving us lots of cross-breeds.