Could Consciousness Be the Universe's Self Awareness?

[Robert.Evans]

I am not sure how that is like what I am trying to say.

Relating it to that; "If there is a thing consisting of the universe that can produce atoms, then the universe can produce atoms." Because "If there is a part of the universe that produces consciousness, the universe produces consciousness."

Our entire body is built from the universe, is never apart from the universe, we are always one with the universe. If our body makes consciousness, and if our body is the universe, doesn't that mean the universe makes, and thus has consciousness? That our consciousness is the universe's self awareness?




I might be misinterpreting you, but how does your example represent the same thing I am trying to say? To call an internet a page would be to, in my scenario, call the universe consciousness. But I am not saying the universe IS consciousness, but that is HAS consciousness.



But we are not only in the universe, we are of the universe. If you agree that the body is built from the universe, and that our body is what produces consciousness, doesn't that mean the universe produces consciousness?

Would you not say that you can see when actually it is only the eyes that can see?



Lost me at "other levels", but hey at least I got until the last two words

There is generally two ways of thinking I guess: one is that there are material physical objects, and us, and then we die never to exist again, because that is the take home message of what you see. But if you look deeper, even science speaks of the universe as the 'matrix, mind of god, information, mind, consciousness' etc. With that in mind, we may see that consciousness is expressed in physical forms, in order that are sins are ultimately answered for and we return to the One that we came from. The One is the Consciousness that is the universe/multiverse and all existence, as the Existence itself is the One, and thus expresses itself through what we see and what we are.

That makes us part of the One, and allows us to understand why we can understand the universe to such a large degree in the first place... we are part of it, we made it, or at least, the higher part of the consciousness did. But most don't agree on that because they like physical things. They are easy to prove, and we like to bang our hand down on the table and be sure of things don't we. But life just ain't like that...

 

[Willamena]

When I knew nothing of you, did you exist?

Now relativity has entered the picture. Because we commonly equate existence with truth, and truth with world, and because we have unique data sets of information about the world (for which we've made the word, "each," to accommodate relativity in conversation), a unique picture of relativity arises composed of pictures of "your world" and "my world" that place these data sets in a fixed bigger picture and give them locality...

People complicate things so.

 

[Estro Felino]

What else can I add?
You understood everything about life and about the purpose of our existence.
Precisely...and the universal consciousness is God. Think of the self-awareness of 7 billions people, the world population: that's God.

you are living proof that Atheists can understand God better than believers

 

[Ouroboros]

I might be misinterpreting you, but how does your example represent the same thing I am trying to say? To call an internet a page would be to, in my scenario, call the universe consciousness. But I am not saying the universe IS

Then we're in agreement.

What's interesting with consciousness and how it emerges, is that it arise from a form of swarm behavior of non- (or less-) conscious parts. The complexity of information processing in our brains creates not just a mind (like the animals), but an awareness of ourselves (like higher forms of animals), and even advanced cognitive abilities and reasoning (only humans). What's so say that even higher complex co-operation of lower conscious parts might give birth to even a higher form. (Maybe Internet will?)

 

[idav]

But if consciousness comes from parts of the universe, doesn't that mean the universe itself produces a consciousness for itself?

I agree with you here. We are the consciousness of the universe however I feel there are other awarenesses as well, just not like our self awareness. We are the universe looking at itself in the mirror(requires self awareness). We are the universe observing itself all the way back to the beginning of the universe by use of telescopes. Makes me wonder why the universe would want to do that lol.

 

[Goblin]

What are your thoughts?

I'm not claiming anything about what consciousness is or where it comes from, it's not part of the topic. I am talking about the actual abstract 'consciousness'. The fact that we are part of the universe, and have consciousness around it, doesn't that mean consciousness is the universe observing itself, which is self awareness?

And if so, doesn't that necessarily mean that the universe is conscious?

i always assumed so. however if you consider consciousness to mean the "awareness of" then only brains are conscious.
but the universe i see has an intrinsic awareness

 

[The Sum of Awe]

I agree with you here. We are the consciousness of the universe however I feel there are other awarenesses as well, just not like our self awareness. We are the universe looking at itself in the mirror(requires self awareness). We are the universe observing itself all the way back to the beginning of the universe by use of telescopes. Makes me wonder why the universe would want to do that lol.

It might not be because the universe wants to, but it just naturally comes with it.

That would be like saying "Makes me wonder why a bunch of organs and bones would want to observe itself."

 

[Goblin]

con·scious·ness
noun
the state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.
"she failed to regain consciousness and died two days later"


Awareness
noun
Awareness is the state or ability to perceive, to feel, or to be conscious of events, objects, or sensory patterns. In this level of consciousness, sense data can be confirmed by an observer without necessarily implying understanding.


they are very similar but not the same thing, consciousness requires awareness first.
consciousness is awareness plus sensory function

 

[The Sum of Awe]

con·scious·ness
noun
the state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.
"she failed to regain consciousness and died two days later"


Awareness
noun
Awareness is the state or ability to perceive, to feel, or to be conscious of events, objects, or sensory patterns. In this level of consciousness, sense data can be confirmed by an observer without necessarily implying understanding.


they are very similar but not the same thing, consciousness requires awareness first.
consciousness is awareness plus sensory function

If they are only similar but not the same thing, can you give me an example for each of these two I highlighted red to show clarity on difference?


As far as it looks, awareness is just more general.

 

[Goblin]

consciousness is awareness "OF" ones surroundings
awareness is the "ABILITY" to be conscious

someone could be unconscious and still be aware like in deep sleep. when awareness becomes aware of things it turns into consciousness.

 

[Willamena]

con·scious·ness
noun
the state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.
"she failed to regain consciousness and died two days later"

I laughed at that example.

My condolences to her family.

 

[Willamena]

con·scious·ness
noun
the state of being awake and aware of one's surroundings.
"she failed to regain consciousness and died two days later"


Awareness
noun
Awareness is the state or ability to perceive, to feel, or to be conscious of events, objects, or sensory patterns. In this level of consciousness, sense data can be confirmed by an observer without necessarily implying understanding.


they are very similar but not the same thing, consciousness requires awareness first.
consciousness is awareness plus sensory function

I think that consciousness is just another way of looking at awareness. Awareness is what we do, consciousness is what we are. The only difference is a state (-ment).

 

[The Sum of Awe]

consciousness is awareness "OF" ones surroundings
awareness is the "ABILITY" to be conscious

someone could be unconscious and still be aware like in deep sleep. when awareness becomes aware of things it turns into consciousness.

Alright. But that is a very slim difference, how does it change anything that I asked in this thread?


I'll accept those definitions, but out of curiosity; you say "when awareness becomes aware of things..." But how can it be called awareness when it isn't aware?

 

[Goblin]

only brains are conscious. but the whole of existence is aware.

a rock is not conscious, but is aware, if it suddenly grows a brain it becomes conscious

 

[Goblin]

Alright. But that is a very slim difference, how does it change anything that I asked in this thread?


I'll accept those definitions, but out of curiosity; you say "when awareness becomes aware of things..." But how can it be called awareness when it isn't aware?

consciousness is "awareness OF something"
awareness is just awareness

 

[The Sum of Awe]

only brains are conscious. but the whole of existence is aware.

a rock is not conscious, but is aware, if it suddenly grows a brain it becomes conscious

consciousness is "awareness OF something"
awareness is just awareness

Okay. Like I said, I can accept those definitions. I just don't see the point in having to use the "correct" one because they are similar enough that you can understand what I mean.

Hopefully we can put this discussion of the two words behind us now and discuss the topic?

 

[`mud]

consider my post number 22....
Does that count for something ??
How about the word cognizance instead of "aware of ".
nuff stuff
~
'mud

 

[Goblin]

Okay. Like I said, I can accept those definitions. I just don't see the point in having to use the "correct" one because they are similar enough that you can understand what I mean.

Hopefully we can put this discussion of the two words behind us now and discuss the topic?

it can confuse some people thats all. they are just labels used in english to communicate to similar phenomena

 

[The Sum of Awe]

Thinking of 'consciousness' versus 'conscious', with the cognizance in effect.
Then when comparing the lack of cognizance when a person is un-conscious, wouldn't the consciousness be affected ?
Meaning, what would the difference be between the two states over longish times.
Is the un-conscious mind totally aware of it's incapacities, even though it's not cognizent.
I feel that we are comparing the states of mind on two different levels, reactive vs. subsantive.
But....I have no idea of what I am talking about here...just chipping in.
We are really, really tiny in comparison to the fractional piece of the solar system called Earth, let alone the Cosmos itself.
I guess one could say....it all in our minds....did that rock move....did I ?
~
'mud

I do not think the un-conscious mind can be aware in any way. They are near opposites.

I am unsure what you mean when you ask what the difference would be between them over time.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Sounds like another thread about semantics.