Could Nothingness Be Another Dimension In And Of Itself?

[outhouse]

What you call initial awareness I call initial reaction.

But your definition really means consciousness. Sounds like you don't like the word.

We have to be aware to survive. Its not the same kind of awareness as a plant and how it reacts to the sun.

We have to make conscious decisions based on awareness to survive.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Say if you were to be walking outside and all of a sudden someone fired a gun. You were not actually aware of the gun firing until the sound vibration hit your eardrums and sent that signal to your brain. The physical interaction came first and the awareness of the gun came after.

I still think it's odd to describe the sound vibration hitting the eardrums as an "interaction". I would describe it as a sensory input which is processed by the brain and interpreted as a gunshot.

 

[Runewolf1973]

Rather than someone becoming more aware, they become more complexly interactive?

I really see no difference between a human becoming:
More complexly interactive.
More aware.
More consciously heightened.

I can't speak for a plant. I am not a plant nor have I experienced a day in their stems.

I think it's just semantics of words all talking about the same thing. I'm not a respector of words, I just think the confusion comes in when one is a respector of words and has not yet become more "complexly interactive" enough to see such.

There really is no difference because awareness IS a form of interaction...it is all action/reaction


No need to rid the terminology, just don't make something out to be more than what it is. Consciousness is the ability to percieve or sense things. Since that doesn't really tell us how that perceiving or sensing occurs or comes about in the first place, I am simply explaining it from my own viewpoint. Not trying to be dogmatic, just trying be clear.

 

[outhouse]

The physical interaction came first and the awareness of the gun came after.

They developed together.

Animals had to make conscious decisions from their most primitive forms.

 

[Runewolf1973]

But your definition really means consciousness. Sounds like you don't like the word.

Yes, they really are the same thing. Consciousness is really just a more complex form of the same thing...interaction.

I dislike how people throw the term consciousness around when they themselves cannot seem to provide a logical explanation as to what actually causes it. I have given an explanation as to what causes it...complex interactions.

 

[Unification]

There really is no difference because awareness IS a form of interaction...it is all action/reaction


No need to rid the terminology, just don't make something out to be more than what it is. Consciousness is the ability to percieve or sense things. Since that doesn't really tell us how that perceiving or sensing occurs or comes about in the first place, I am simply explaining it from my own viewpoint. Not trying to be dogmatic, just trying be clear.

I would personally say the most primitive and instinctive and emotional part of the human is their brain stem region as well as their gut/belly region.

The humans power and certain energy coming predominantly from this region along with the "gut/belly" region due to very imbalanced alchemy and poorly bonded atoms/cells with less complex energy going from the brain stem region through the vagus nerve and into the gut/belly region where there are plethora's of this energy in both.

Decisions are more reaction based, emotionally based, instinctive based, selfish based, etc.

 

[Runewolf1973]

They developed together.

Animals had to make conscious decisions from their most primitive forms.

The first thing which happened? Chemicals interacted with other chemicals. Certain chemicals, proteins, molecules, etc...began to interact in a more complex manner leading to the formation of structures such as plants. Plants, because they are complex chemical arrangements themselves began to interact in even more complex ways than before. At what point does awareness come into the picture? Did complex chemical formations or structures really become "conscious", or did they just start interacting in a more complex manner?

 

[Runewolf1973]

Look at it from the perspective and mind of the human pulling the trigger. It all happened in the inner environment first which set off an external environment reaction.

Inner environment(human firing gun) to external environment to inner environment(other human hearing gun fire.)

Explain what awareness is if you think it comes before interaction.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I dislike how people throw the term consciousness around when they themselves cannot seem to provide a logical explanation as to what actually causes it.

At the basic level consciousness is just an organism being aware of it's environment. I don't see why you have a problem with that.

 

[Runewolf1973]

I still think it's odd to describe the sound vibration hitting the eardrums as an "interaction". I would describe it as a sensory input which is processed by the brain and interpreted as a gunshot.

So would you describe sound vibration hitting a microphone as consciousness? Was the microphone necessarily "aware" of the sound vibration in order for it to react to it physically?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Explain what awareness is if you think it comes before interaction.

Sound waves hit ear drum, signals go to brain, awareness of gun shot.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

So would you describe sound vibration hitting a microphone as consciousness? Was the microphone necessarily "aware" of the sound vibration in order for it to react to it physically?

In that case the sound waves hit the microphone which creates an electrical signal, much like an ear does. I wouldn't describe a mechanical device as having consciousness, though there is still the process of input and output. A human observer could be conscious of the output from the microphone of course.

 

[Runewolf1973]

At the basic level consciousness is just an organism being aware of it's environment. I don't see why you have a problem with that.

I disagree with people who try to claim that consciousness is a fundamental force, reality, or constituent of the universe. Consciousness is exactly what you say...an organism being aware of it's surroundings. The key question I am trying to answer is what specifically causes that awareness.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I disagree with people who try to claim that consciousness is a fundamental force, reality, or constituent of the universe. Consciousness is exactly what you say...an organism being aware of it's surroundings. The key question I am trying to answer is what specifically causes that awareness.

I also disagree with the idea that consciousness is a fundamental force, because it looks more like an emergent property of biological life.

 

[Runewolf1973]

In that case the sound waves hit the microphone which creates an electrical signal, much like an ear does.

In what way is that so different? The microphone is a man-made device. The human brain and body can be said to be a nature-made device. Both are just interacting with external stimuli.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

In what way is that so different? The microphone is a man-made device. The human brain and body can be said to be a nature-made device. Both are just interacting with external stimuli.

Both a microphone and a person can sense sound waves. The difference is that the microphone can't react.

 

[Runewolf1973]

I also disagree with the idea that consciousness is a fundamental force, because it looks more like an emergent property of biological life.

It looks to me to be an emergent property of complex chemical interactions...in the same way that's what "life" is.

 

[Runewolf1973]

Both a microphone and a person can sense sound waves. The difference is that the microphone can't react.

How so? The microphone reacts by changing the frequency of that sound.

 

[Runewolf1973]

Sound waves hit ear drum, signals go to brain, awareness of gun shot.

Exactly. So what came first? The sound waves.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

How so? The microphone reacts by changing the frequency of that sound.

The microphone just converts mechanical vibration into electrical signals, in much the same way an eardrum does.