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Could you be wrong?

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

I believe human knowledge to be finite and prone to error but the knowledge of the Manifestations of God to be true knowledge, infallible and never wrong.

So while I admit I have shortcomings and failures, my complete trust in the Manifestations of God, and in Their laws and teachings for each age, is unquestionable.
 
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Milton Platt

Well-Known Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

Generally speaking there is no absolute knowledge (yes, there are logical absolutes and such, but that's a different thing). I do not believe any gods exist because what little evidence has been provided in support of them has been hearsay, personal "experiences" (which are also hearsay to everyone except the person who allegedly had the experience), and arguments from ignorance.
I so, can a god of some type exist? Possibly. Is it any one of the ones proposed to me so far? No. Because they are internally inconsistent or logically flawed concepts. Many appear to have lower morals than the average person today. Besides, any being worthy of worship probably wouldn't want it.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

how would you be tormented in hell; if you had no physical senses with which to feel something?
 

sealchan

Well-Known Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

I freely admit my beliefs are literally wrong, but metaphorically they are deeply insightful.
 

Saint Frankenstein

Here for the ride
Premium Member
Yes, I could be wrong but I don't really care as everyone else could be wrong, too. I'm not afraid of any eternal damnation because the whole concept is entirely too stupid and silly for me to take seriously. So I may be wrong but not as wrong as that.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

I am convinced that i am correct given the current evidence. However that evidence could change, in which case i would need to re-evaluate my position.

The main evidence (or 100% lack if it has not changed in the history or the universe so i wont be holding my breath while waiting.

As for the wearing asbestos fashion accessories, i would think a bit of chaffing would be preferable to the alternative crowded with smug religious types gloating and informing you in supercilious tones "i told you so, didnt i tell you..."
 

MJ Bailey

Member
Being a person in whom has not ever believed in any aspect of afterlife but has been shown more than once that it does exist, yeah it's there. You can try as hard as you would like to dismiss it, yet your own existence has a particulate Energy does not stop existing regardless to the form in which it's created; it transforms and continuants. Inarguable
 

Lee Hays

Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

Believers - believe
Non believers - don’t believe

Are you asking if anyone is ready to change?
 

Jos

Well-Known Member
Being a person in whom has not ever believed in any aspect of afterlife but has been shown more than once that it does exist, yeah it's there. You can try as hard as you would like to dismiss it, yet your own existence has a particulate Energy does not stop existing regardless to the form in which it's created; it transforms and continuants. Inarguable
What makes you think there's an afterlife? What's the proof?
 

Baroodi

Active Member
This is a tricky question in some sense.

There are two points to address in that context, imo:
1. the theistic claims I explicitly reject as being false / wrong
2. the theistic claims concerning which I "technically" reserve judgement

First of all, in scientific context, we could technically be wrong about every model we came up with to describe / explain reality. There is nothing inherent in the universe which, for example, makes it impossible that the universe and everything it contains, including our memories of having lived our entire lives, was created just 5 seconds ago. The thing is that there is no reason to believe that.

Next, there is this idea in science that science is incapable of proving things (models in particular). "proving" as in: resulting in certainty. However, what science CAN do, is DISprove things (models in particular). Science can show how a model of reality is false, by taking testable predictions of that model, testing them and then observing that it doesn't work. This means the model is false or at least incomplete. If the test is succesfull however, then we did not just "prove" the model. Instead, we merely have shown that the data is consistent with it.

So, having said that and with that in mind, I can address the question concerning the two points.

1. Here, my answer is no. I can not be wrong about those things that have been shown to be false, since they have already been shown. Take the (literal) biblical flood story and the mega massive extinction wave that must have necessarily taken place at that time. This predicts MASSIVE genetic bottlenecks in ALL species. If these bottlenecks aren't there, then the model is false or at best incomplete (which in this context would be the same as "false" - since it doesn't work / can't account for the evidence as presented).

2. To be honest, since I'm technically reservering judgement until evidence comes up one way or the other, there is also no way I am "wrong" here, since there is nothing to be "wrong" about..... I don't believe that a God exists. I also don't believe that a God does not exist. "To believe" = to accept as true / accurate. I have the exact same data at my disposal for each claim ("god exists" and "god does not exist") and in both cases it is hilariously lacking to be able to make any kind of assessment of these claims in terms of truth value.

However, considering the mega outlandishness of these claims, the extra ordinary nature thereof, the unfalsifiability of it all, the complete lack of even only a hint one way or the other.... It seems to me that the world is a LOT more consistent with the model that says that there are no gods, then it is with the models that say there are....

So for all practical intents and purposes, I will live my life as if no such gods exists.


Could I be "wrong" to not believe the claims of theism?

Sure. I could also be wrong about the Great JuJu at the bottom of the sea, about bigfoot, about alien abduction, about whalhalla, about scientology,..... I could be wrong about ANY unfalsifiable, undemonstrated, unevidenced and baseless claim.

I could even be wrong about sensible non-supernatural models of reality that HAVE supportive evidence and which have NO contradicting evidence at present.... so obviously I could be wrong about unfalsifiable religious models as well.

However, it doesn't look like I am. There certainly is no data at all to even only suggest such.

My dear what is this contradictory rhetoric? I got confused between this is water and no it is not. 1+1 = 2 do you think some one will come to proof something different? (We will show them our signs in the horizons and in themselves until they discern the truth) translated Quran.
 

Lee Hays

Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.

Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?


Hmm are you asking
If any believers are willing to question
And if any non believers are willing to question?

The answer is No - there is a reason we believe - or don’t. If there a question - your already on the other side.
 

Lee Hays

Member
What makes you think there's an afterlife? What's the proof?

If you require more prof - then stop asking people - we believe - that’s our belief if you don’t believe - what’s prof gonna do?

I think your trying to post a trick question
 

Jos

Well-Known Member
If you require more prof - then stop asking people - we believe - that’s our belief if you don’t believe - what’s prof gonna do?

I think your trying to post a trick question
No I'm not. I just wanna know why the person believes there's an afterlife... that's it, I'm not trying to trick anyone.
 

Lee Hays

Member
No I'm not. I just wanna know why the person believes there's an afterlife... that's it, I'm not trying to trick anyone.
Oh - ok
So your not asking if a non believer may be wrong...

I believe in the afterlife - but I can’t explain the science of belief to you (not You personally)
Do you believe your family loves you?

Why do you believe your family loves you?
I know you have examples, but I wanna know why you believe it - if it’s just the examples of Love - that’s good enough for me - but I think that answer is not good enough for you..
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
I am of the opinion that no god or afterlife exists, and that much of what is attributed to Jesus is exaggerated or untrue. However, I could be wrong in which case, I must ensure I take my suitcase of asbestos clothing with me to hell.
Are others, whether believers or unbelievers, ready to admit that it is possible their stance on matters of faith could be wrong?

I found that my stance on matters of faith was wrong because of false clergy teachings.
Later, I found that my stance on matters of faith is Not wrong as found in Scripture.
'Afterlife' is Not a Bible teaching but Resurrection is - Revelation 1:18; Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
( Afterlife implies being more alive 'after' death than before death )
Scripture teaches the dead know nothing -> Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
This is why Jesus also taught the dead are in a sleep like state at John 11:11-14.
No asbestos clothing needed for biblical hell because the Bible's hell is mankind's temporary stone-cold grave.
So, the day Jesus died he went to biblical hell (Acts of the Apostles 2:27) until his God resurrected Jesus out of hell.
Also, biblical hell comes to a 'final end' according to Revelation 20:13-14.
Everyone in biblical hell (aka grave) will be ' delivered up' (that means resurrected out of hell/grave) then, emptied-out hell is cast empty into that symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell/grave.
 

Lee Hays

Member
I found that my stance on matters of faith was wrong because of false clergy teachings.
Later, I found that my stance on matters of faith is Not wrong as found in Scripture.
'Afterlife' is Not a Bible teaching but Resurrection is - Revelation 1:18; Acts of the Apostles 24:15.
( Afterlife implies being more alive 'after' death than before death )
Scripture teaches the dead know nothing -> Psalms 6:5; Psalms 13:3; Psalms 115:17; Isaiah 38:18; Ecclesiastes 9:5
This is why Jesus also taught the dead are in a sleep like state at John 11:11-14.
No asbestos clothing needed for biblical hell because the Bible's hell is mankind's temporary stone-cold grave.
So, the day Jesus died he went to biblical hell (Acts of the Apostles 2:27) until his God resurrected Jesus out of hell.
Also, biblical hell comes to a 'final end' according to Revelation 20:13-14.
Everyone in biblical hell (aka grave) will be ' delivered up' (that means resurrected out of hell/grave) then, emptied-out hell is cast empty into that symbolic ' second death ' for vacated hell/grave.

How did you find yourself back in the faith after the teachings? Or did you find out the teaching were wrong through faith?
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
No I'm not. I just wanna know why the person believes there's an afterlife... that's it, I'm not trying to trick anyone.
Good question ^ above ^ , an inquiring mind wants to know.
I too would like to know why anyone believes in an afterlife because there is a BIG difference between the afterlife teaching and the Bible's teaching about a coming Resurrection.
Afterlife implies a person is immortal and even more alive after death than before death.
Whereas, Resurrection is future, as found at Acts of the Apostles 24:15 that there ' is going to be ' a resurrection.....
Biblically speaking a person is 'Not death proof' because the wages sin pays is: death, Not being alive after death.
 

Lee Hays

Member
Is the word Hell - come from Greek word ... Buried -
Is that right - I think that’s what your talking about...
Does the Bible say - for 3 days? Or is that the time Jesus spent buried?
 

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
How did you find yourself back in the faith after the teachings? Or did you find out the teaching were wrong through faith?
Thank you for asking.
One day an older gentlemen said to me I have good news for you and he read me Ecclesiastes 1:4 B.
Both in school and in church taught me the Earth was going to be destroyed.
But there in the Bible it was informing me the Earth abides forever, so I wanted to know more.
Instead of 2 Timothy 3:1-5,13 talking about the end of Earth, it is talking about the last days of badness on Earth.
The last days here before Jesus, as Prince of Peace, will usher in global Peace on Earth among people of goodwill.
Instead of just a heavenly hope there is an earthly hope held out for us - Psalms 37:9-11; Matthew 5:5.
I had a King James and bought a cross-reference Douay study Bible and the more I read the more I saw there is a BIG difference between the teachings of ' Christendom ' and what we can really learn from the Bible.
Christendom's clergy basically teaches church traditions or church customs as if they are Scripture.- Matthew 15:9
So, through prayer, reading and studying the Bible by subject or topic arrangement is how I found out biblical truth.
It is the Bible that sets us free. Free from what is biblically false.
 
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