Criticism of Islam.

[ecco]

With the same yardstick, why not hate hard atheism as well because it tells you not to believe in God whatsoever?

If there is a policy among atheists to kill religious people for believing in a god, then I haven't heard of it.
If there is a policy among atheists to kill ex-atheists when they turn to religion, then I haven't heard of it.
If there is a policy among atheists to kill people whose morals are different, then I haven't heard of it.
I could go on, but you should get the picture.

 

[firedragon]

If there is a policy among atheists to kill religious people for believing in a god, then I haven't heard of it.
If there is a policy among atheists to kill ex-atheists when they turn to religion, then I haven't heard of it.
If there is a policy among atheists to kill people whose morals are different, then I haven't heard of it.
I could go on, but you should get the picture.

Very good attempt. Kudos.

So can you please quote who said "There is a policy among atheists to kill religious people for believe in a god etc etc"? Generally theists are not that bigoted in this forum. So please do quote who did that. It will be an interesting analysis.

Tks.

 

[ecco]

He never allows it as a means of oppressing others.

I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of young girls wanting to be educated.
I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of women wanting to choose what to wear.
I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of members of minority sects in Islamic countries.

Apparently, your Allah not only allows these things, but encourages them through the interpreted writing of his only Messenger.

 

[firedragon]

I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of young girls wanting to be educated.
I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of women wanting to choose what to wear.
I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of members of minority sects in Islamic countries.

Apparently, your Allah not only allows these things, but encourages them through the interpreted writing of his only Messenger.

Nice attempt again. Kudos.

So can ou please quote scripture that says "young girls should not be educated"?

Tks.

 

[ecco]

Nice attempt again. Kudos.

Don't ya just love it when the truth hurts.

So can ou please quote scripture that says "young girls should not be educated"?

Don't tell me to look in your book. Tell the Taliban. Tell ISIS. Tell the guys that shot Malala Yousafzai. Tell it to the guys responsible for:

Attackers on a motorbike threw acid in the faces of three teenage girls on their way to school in Afghanistan’s western Herat province on Saturday, an official told CNN.
​

Since you didn't comment on...

• I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of women wanting to choose what to wear.
• I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of members of minority sects in Islamic countries.

I'll accept your silence as an admission that your Allah not only allows these things, but encourages them through the interpreted writing of his only Messenger.

​

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Nice attempt again. Kudos.

So can ou please quote scripture that says "young girls should not be educated"?

Tks.

You should be asking this question of your fellow Muslims, the Taliban.

 

[firedragon]

Don't tell me to look in your book. Tell the Taliban. Tell ISIS.

Lol. So not scripture right?

 

[firedragon]

You should be asking this question of your fellow Muslims, the Taliban.

Ah. So you think the Taliban are my fellow muslims? I think they are just like you. THey must have learned that from you.

See how your kind of cheap tricks work? WE can go back and forth with that kind of thing if you want. No problem.

 

[firedragon]

I'll accept your silence as an admission that your Allah not only allows these things, but encourages them through the interpreted writing of his only Messenger.

Anyway you came to say that and assume things.

But quote scripture.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Ah. So you think the Taliban are my fellow muslims? I think they are just like you. THey must have learned that from you.

See how your kind of cheap tricks work? WE can go back and forth with that kind of thing if you want. No problem.

Yes, the Taliban are your fellow muslims. No, they do not follow judaism.

 

[firedragon]

Yes, the Taliban are your fellow muslims. No, they do not follow judaism.

See, you are right. They do not follow Judaism. But this is just a rhetorical accusation. Nothing fundamental, scriptural or even based on theology so that one could respond with reason. It is just an arbitrary rhetoric.

So one could just come up and say "unreasonably" that the Taliban is indeed following Judaism. Its the same thing you did.

If the theology and scripture is not fundamentally spoken form the voice of the theology of scripture, any person can make similar accusation with no validity.

The Taliban is following Judaism.

 

[ecco]

But quote scripture.

Somehow you want us to believe that if something is not in scripture, it is not part of the religion and the beliefs of its followers. That is ignorant nonsense.

"God's Word" is originally written by mortal men wanting to start a new religion. "God's Word" is then interpreted by more mortal men. It is true in Christianity and it is true in Islam.

Hitler got much of his anti-Semitism from Protestant Founder Martin Luther. This led to the holocaust.

So tell us, where do your fellow Muslims get the idea that it is right to stone to death an adulteress? Where do they get the idea that it is necessary to hide a woman's body behind heavy cloaks and masks? Where do they get the idea that girls should be deprived of an education?

And please don't cop out by responding "not from scripture".

 

[ecco]

Since you didn't comment on...

• I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of women wanting to choose what to wear.
• I guess your definition of "oppressing" is different from that of members of minority sects in Islamic countries.

I'll accept your silence as an admission that your Allah not only allows these things, but encourages them through the interpreted writing of his only Messenger.

Anyway you came to say that and assume things.

What incorrect assumptions did I make? You haven't said. Instead, in your usual manner, you post meaningless one-liners.

 

[firedragon]

What incorrect assumptions did I make? You haven't said. Instead, in your usual manner, you post meaningless one-liners.

Quote scripture.

 

[firedragon]

Somehow you want us to believe that if something is not in scripture, it is not part of the religion and the beliefs of its followers.

No. I say that it is not a part of the theology if its not in scripture.

"God's Word" is originally written by mortal men wanting to start a new religion.

Please provide historical evidence to that. Thanks.

 

[stevecanuck]

Bogus. It doesnt say "Muslims have to fight to get into heaven". See, that's an outright creation of yours.

It says "those who fight in the way of God go to heaven". Doesn't say "All Muslims have to fight to get to heaven". Dont make things up. Its just dishonesty. Its like saying "those who buy train tickets to firenze will go to firenze. Does not mean "You must buy train tickets to go to firenze". You can drive.

So dont make things up. Its shameful.

What is fighting in the way of God? Fight for the oppressed. DO not be the aggressor. Fight the aggressor. Fight to save the oppressed people and children who ask for your help. But when they cease fighting safeguard them. Fighting is prescribed only when you are being oppressed. When the oppression stops, the fighting must stop.

20 years of studying the Qur'an and you don't know these basic things. And you make things up as well.

Apparently you have no idea what a bargain is. It's impossible to read the following without seeing that a quid-pro-quo is being established. Allah promises heaven for his end of the bargain, while Muslims kill to uphold their's. It simply says so.

"Lo! Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain. It is a promise which is binding on Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. Who fulfilleth His covenant better than Allah? Rejoice then in your bargain that ye have made"

 

[firedragon]

Apparently you have no idea what a bargain is. It's impossible to read the following without seeing that a quid-pro-quo is being established. Allah promises heaven for his end of the bargain, while Muslims kill to uphold their's. It simply says so.

"Lo! Allah hath bought from the believers their lives and their wealth because the Garden will be theirs: they shall fight in the way of Allah and shall slay and be slain. It is a promise which is binding on Him in the Torah and the Gospel and the Qur'an. Who fulfilleth His covenant better than Allah? Rejoice then in your bargain that ye have made"

It still does not say "Muslims have to fight to go to heaven". Read the Quran.

 

[stevecanuck]

Every true hadith is found in Quran and every true interpretation of Quran is found some form of a hadith. They are both completely references to each other. Then there are bad interpretations of Quran and there is also fake hadiths. Ilmel rijaal has failed in that regard and is not reliable.

Any god that was trying to communicate with us simply would not have allowed that to happen. The Qur'an is the product of whatever Mohamed needed it to say on any given day.

 

[firedragon]

Any god that was trying to communicate with us simply would not have allowed that to happen. The Qur'an is the product of whatever Mohamed needed it to say on any given day.

7:33 And do not kill, for God has made this forbidden, except in the course of justice. And whoever is killed innocently, then We have given his heir authority, so let him not transgress in the taking of a life, for He will be given victory. Just cause to kill is aggression, but you are not allowed to be the aggressor.

2:190 And fight in the cause of God against those who fight you, but do not transgress,

God does not like the aggressors.

2:191 And kill them wherever you overcome them, and expel them from where they expelled you, and know that persecution is worse than being killed. And do not fight them at the Sacred Temple unless they fight you in it; if they fight you then kill them, thus is the recompense of the disbelievers.

2:192 And if they cease, then God is Forgiving, Merciful.

2:193 And fight them so there is no more persecution, and so that the system is God’s. If they cease, then there will be no aggression except against the wicked.

YOU REMEMBER. VERSE 192 YOU INTENTIONALLY LEFT OUT, AND QUOTED THE ONE BEFORE, AND THE ONE AFTER?

 

[firedragon]

If there is a policy among atheists to kill religious people for believing in a god, then I haven't heard of it.

If you research it, you will hear about things you see. But you have to make an effort and be a bit truthful. Do you understand?

Anyway, aren't atheists like a no belief? So, do you expect them to have one single group like you say above? "Among atheists". as in a very small new religious group or a global level cult or something?

Please do clarify.