Debate on Abortion.

[Storm]

If you bothered to look at the picture, you would know they are babies.

Looks are deceiving. If you bothered to look at the dictionary, you'd know they're not.

 

[idea]

posted this earlier, I'll post it agian. 98% is accurate.

Reasons given for having abortions in the United States

by Wm. Robert Johnston
last updated 9 October 2008

Summary: This report reviews available statistics regarding reasons given for obtaining abortions in the United States, including surveys by the Alan Guttmacher Institute and data from seven state health/statistics agencies that report relevant statistics (Arizona, Florida, Louisiana, Minnesota, Nebraska, South Dakota, and Utah). The official data imply that AGI claims regarding "hard case" abortions are inflated by roughly a factor of three. Actual percentage of U.S. abortions in "hard cases" are estimated as follows: in cases of rape or incest, 0.3%; in cases of risk to maternal health or life, 1%; and in cases of fetal abnormality, 0.5%. About 98% of abortions in the United States are elective, including socio-economic reasons or for birth control. This includes perhaps 30% for primarily economic reasons.
​

As only 0.3% of abortions are performed to protect the health of the mother, I think that kind of a vid would be missing the majority of the cause.


All of the pro-choice reasons - rape, maternal health, fetal problems, etc. etc. - and I agree, those are valid reasons, but this is not why 98% are having abortions.

IMO I would rather see laws that might lead to the deaths of 2% women then laws that kill 98% babies.

 

[idea]

watch this 4D ultrasound. They are alive and well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1uKCchuIjM

 

[gnomon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7PPamlX4HQ0&feature=related

Those who understand what abortion is are pro-life.

I understand what abortion is.

It is the termination of the progression of life within human development of those individuals prior to birth.

So? I'm as pro-choice as it gets. Heck, I think a law should be passed requiring pro-life people to have to drive pregnant teenagers to abortion clinics, never being able to mention anything to the teen, and they'll have to like it.

 

[idea]

I understand what abortion is.

It is the termination of life of individuals.

So, you don't have a problem with killing individuals... and

So? I'm as pro-choice as it gets. Heck, I think a law should be passed requiring pro-life people to have to drive pregnant teenagers to abortion clinics, never being able to mention anything to the teen, and they'll have to like it.

you don't believe in freedom of speech.

you are now on my ignore list

 

[gnomon]

So, you don't have a problem with killing individuals... and



you don't believe in freedom of speech.

you are now on my ignore list

What, no pictures of McHumans to change my mind?

 

[Storm]

posted this earlier, I'll post it agian. 98% is accurate.

That may be the first time you've posted a source that wasn't blatant BS. Too bad you didn't read it first:
reason% of abortions
rape or incest: 1% (0.4-1.3)
mother has health problems: 3% (2.8)
possible fetal health problems: 3% (3.3)
unready for responsibility: 21%
is too immature or young to have child: 11% (12.2)
woman's parents want her to have abortion: <0.5 %
has problems with relationship or wants to avoid single parenthood: 12% (14.1)
husband or partner wants her to have abortion: 1 %
has all the children she wanted or all children are grown: 8% (7.9)
can't afford baby now: 21% (21.3)
concerned about how having baby would change her life: 16 %
doesn't want others to know she had relations or is pregnant: 1%
other: 3%

So, a little simple addition reveals that, according to self-reporting, which may or may not be accurate, abortions due to rape or medical issues total 7%, not the 2 you insist on. And that's with your own standards of "necessity," which I and many others do not accept.

 

[Storm]

you don't believe in freedom of speech.

you are now on my ignore list

Wow. Is there an aware for Most Random, Unsubstatiated Excuse To Put Someone On Ignore?

 

[idea]

That may be the first time you've posted a source that wasn't blatant BS. Too bad you didn't read it first:
reason% of abortions
rape or incest: 1% (0.4-1.3)
mother has health problems: 3% (2.8)
possible fetal health problems: 3% (3.3)
unready for responsibility: 21%
is too immature or young to have child: 11% (12.2)
woman's parents want her to have abortion: <0.5 %
has problems with relationship or wants to avoid single parenthood: 12% (14.1)
husband or partner wants her to have abortion: 1 %
has all the children she wanted or all children are grown: 8% (7.9)
can't afford baby now: 21% (21.3)
concerned about how having baby would change her life: 16 %
doesn't want others to know she had relations or is pregnant: 1%
other: 3%

So, a little simple addition reveals that, according to self-reporting, which may or may not be accurate, abortions due to rape or medical issues total 7%, not the 2 you insist on. And that's with your own standards of "necessity," which I and many others do not accept.

keep scrolling down:


REASONS FOR ABORTIONS: COMPILED ESTIMATES
rape 0.3 %
incest 0.03 %
physical life of mother 0.2 % (0.1-0.3 %)
physical health of mother 1.0 % (0.1-3 %)
fetal health 0.5 % (0.1-1.0 %)
"personal choice" = 98%

 

[Storm]

keep scrolling down:

reason19992000200120022003200420052006total
1985-2006% of abortions% of abortions,
known reasonsmedical 19151021432077885370.200.21elective10,3909,6148,2109,9109,60210,7709,98710,436258,29796.7999.79unknown 247264664491,324381628,0323.01N/Atotal 10,6569,6318,22610,39710,09412,30110,44610,506266,866100.00100.00


elective 99.79

So, your only defense is that your source contradicts itself?

What are their standards for "elective," and why don't the numbers match up? DO you understand the problems with self-reporting?

 

[DallasApple]

Babies in the womb are sentient. they can see, hear, feel, think - you can measure their brain waves

First of all are you actually going to call an egg and sperm that meet after say 5 weeks a "baby"?


What in the hell are you talking about?What woudl say a 7eek old fetus is "thinking"...

Nevermind..an egg and a sperm that meet suddenly and intantanioulsy is a thinking feeling human being with feelings.Just like you.You are a zygote.You are abouy same as a cell that has to be detected under a microscope.

Love

Dallas

 

[idea]

So, your only defense is that your source contradicts itself?

What are their standards for "elective," and why don't the numbers match up? DO you understand the problems with self-reporting?

it does not contradict itself. It shows data for different states, different populations, then at the end adds up all of the averages.

REASONS FOR ABORTIONS: COMPILED ESTIMATES
rape 0.3 %
incest 0.03 %
physical life of mother 0.2 % (0.1-0.3 %)
physical health of mother 1.0 % (0.1-3 %)
fetal health 0.5 % (0.1-1.0 %)
"personal choice" = 98%

 

[idea]

What woudl say a 7eek old fetus be "thinking"...

Your Pregnancy: Week 7
This week your baby's brain is growing at a mind-boggling 100 cells per minute within a see-through skull. If you could peer inside, you'd see those tiny brain cells growing and growing and growing (about as quickly as you feel like yours are shrinking and shrinking and shrinking with your "pregnancy brain"!). More high points include:

Your baby's face is becoming more defined this week. A tiny mouth hole (which will be ready to wail before you know it!), tongue, nostrils and ear indentations are visible. His or her eyes are wide open, but he doesn't have irises (the colored part) yet.

7 Weeks Pregnant - 3D Pregnancy Calendar

 

[DallasApple]

Your Pregnancy: Week 7
This week your baby's brain is growing at a mind-boggling 100 cells per minute within a see-through skull. If you could peer inside, you'd see those tiny brain cells growing and growing and growing (about as quickly as you feel like yours are shrinking and shrinking and shrinking with your "pregnancy brain"!). More high points include:

Your baby's face is becoming more defined this week. A tiny mouth hole (which will be ready to wail before you know it!), tongue, nostrils and ear indentations are visible. His or her eyes are wide open, but he doesn't have irises (the colored part) yet.

7 Weeks Pregnant - 3D Pregnancy Calendar

I didnt ask what was growing and at what rate..I asked WHAT is a 7 week old fetus is THINKING?

Love

Dallas

 

[idea]

I didnt ask what was growing and at what rate..I asked WHAT is a 7 week old fetus is THINKING?

Love

Dallas

I believe that when a spirit first enters a body, there is a lot of learning to do - have you seen a newborn learn how to eat, hold their head up, kick, stretch, trying to figure out how their bodies work? It's a big learning curve.

I think it would be like learning how to drive a car - only a body instead of a car. They are thinking about their body, what it is, and how it works. They learn some of this while in the womb, as they don't start out at birth completely ignorant of everything.

I have three kids. My third kid recognized her siblings in the delivery room (from all of the noise / poking going on from them before birth)

My first baby - when I first held her, I recognized her motions. Her first movements outside were the same as they were inside.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Over 400 posts. Hmmm, seems to me deciding whether or not life begins at birth shouldn't take so many posts. But go figure

 

[Storm]

Over 400 posts. Hmmm, seems to me deciding whether or not life begins at birth shouldn't take so many posts. But go figure

That's not the topic.

 

[DallasApple]

[QUOTEBabies in the womb are sentient. they can see, hear, feel, think - you can measure their brain waves, they respond to shining a flashlight on your tummy, they respond to loud noises, they respond to being pushed and prodded.
__________________
][/QUOTE]

And besides that its not my "tummy"...Its my abdomen and my uterus.And my bladder beneath and my kidneys to the side and my SPINE beign warped..Not my "tummy" that supposedly has a "thinking" "baby" in there at 8 weeks pregnant.(ROLL EYES)

Love

Dallas

 

[Just_me_Mike]

That's not the topic.

From the OP

When a sperm and egg cell combine, it becomes something fundamentally different. It becomes a human being in its early stages.

 

[Storm]

From the title:

Debate on Abortion.