Demons, is there any evidence they even exist?

[Dan From Smithville]

Jesus told us to judge and test spirits that people are operating in, we aren’t supposed to be gullible and naive. Show me the Scriptures that back up your view brother. The Scriptures are the authority and the Holy Spirit confirms them.

Once again, the point of this thread was for someone to provide evidence to show others that demons exist and operate. So far, all I have heard is that some of you believe real hard that they are out there and even on this thread, but not one of you has provided evidence that cannot be explained by some other well-recognized reason. If I told you I had evidence for Bigfoot, I wouldn't just keep pointing to videos of people that are just repeating a belief in Bigfoot. I'd show you his carcass. You haven't done anything like that.

That is the point of this thread. Not whether anyone believes in demons, but what they can share as independent, repeatable, objective evidence to demonstrate demons. You and others have failed. The best you can do is attack other Christians that don't share your interpretation of the Bible. Who is the demon then that is attacking Christians?

What I see is a fixation on demons used to attack other people that disagree with any empty claim that some believers hurl.

Since there has been no evidence provided and I don't see any forthcoming, my test is done. I may post again if someone comes up with something interesting. But I've no interest in being persecuted for my Christianity or having unqualified individuals judge it.

 

[ElishaElijah]

What makes you think that every post I have made has not been a test. Gullible. LOL! I love that one.

Well, yeah because you failed the test according to the Scriptures, in them demons manifested themselves in people, how they were cast out of people and the freedom people had after. You couldn’t see the demons themselves only what they did to people, this has been clearly shown on this thread.
The name of the demon is the way it manifests itself and this is shown in Scripture:
Fear - spirit of fear
Infirmity - spirit of infirmity
Unclean - unclean spirit
Deaf and dumb - deaf and dumb spirit
Mediums and spiritist - spirit of divination
Lying - lying spirit

So if you are saying you’re a Christian and saying you don’t believe demons and satan exist and are just metaphors I don’t believe you. You don’t believe most of the Bible so how can you be? Why would you want to claim you are?

More Scripture:

“But if you have bitter envy and self-seeking in your hearts, do not boast and lie against the truth. This wisdom does not descend from above, but is earthly, sensual, demonic. For where envy and self-seeking exist, confusion and every evil thing are there. But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, willing to yield, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy. Now the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.”
‭‭James‬ ‭3‬:‭14‬-‭18‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

I only see 2 options:
Holy Spirit and His manifestations and gifts
Demonic spirit - his manifestations and gifts that are counterfeits to the Holy Spirit.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

You know I believe your mediumship is real. That seems unusual to me that three other therapists and one psychologist over the years who have all agreed that your mediumship is genuinely real, and you are fortunate for that. I would not tell my counselor about what happened with Lewis and the TV or that I plan to communicate to him because I am almost sure she would think there is something wrong with me and I don't need that right now. You and @Truthseeker are the only ones who know I plan to communicate with him because I trust both of you implicitly.

I met with two of the therapists because I was looking for one who could help me cope with my anxiety and depression without advocating prescription medication, but both of them were adamant about taking mood-stabilizing medication, so I opted not to see them anymore. I agreed to meet with the third therapist and the psychologist in an effort to support my daughter and demonstrate to her that there was nothing wrong with her mind and that our mediumship is real. If you recall, I mentioned that she is also a psychic medium whose mediumship is almost on par with mine. She began to exhibit her abilities when she was four. She inherited my mediumship, and her siblings inherited varying degrees of Clair abilities. My youngest son is an empath like me and can see people's auras as well. I've spent the last fifteen years cultivating not only my psychic abilities but also theirs. I've made it a priority to help my children develop their abilities. I don't want them to ever feel the depth of loneliness and isolation I felt years ago when no one else knew about me.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

This could be said in this situation for the observer that it’s CB, but what about the person who looks to be demonized with superhuman strength if someone were to deliver that person by the power of God? The person that gets delivered tells you what happened to them, that they are now delivered and it was by the power of God and are now free. That would not be Confirmation Bias and that’s what you keep saying about the freedom I have in Christ now. God delivered me, that’s what happened 35 years ago. Actually it seems you are playing into confirmation bias according to this definition.

It's still just an anecdote with extra-ordinary claims.
I can accept such as true on the basis of just an anecdote.

You are asking me to accept extra ordinary claim for no reason other then you making the claim.
You are expecting me to "just believe you".

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

To be fair, our baseline is scripture. It just happens that our "anecdotal evidence" matches with no issues on our side.

Yes, it's called confirmation bias.
You'll happily accept any anecdotes that you can match with your belief and reject those that you can't.
And you'll do it on the very basis of it matching or not. Not on any actual evidential merit itself.

 

[ElishaElijah]

It's still just an anecdote with extra-ordinary claims.
I can accept such as true on the basis of just an anecdote.

You are asking me to accept extra ordinary claim for no reason other then you making the claim.
You are expecting me to "just believe you".

I’m not expecting you to believe anything, but you’re using the wrong terms, my testimony is not confirmation bias. What God did for me and still does is miraculous whether you believe it or not doesn’t change that.
On the other hand by you continuing to look only through your view and reject the supernatural isn’t that confirmation bias on your part?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Yes, it's called confirmation bias.
You'll happily accept any anecdotes that you can match with your belief and reject those that you can't.
And you'll do it on the very basis of it matching or not. Not on any actual evidential merit itself.

To be more specific, which Bible version do they read? Is it the Catholic Bible, with a 73-book canon; the Greek Orthodox Bible, with a 79-book canon; or the Protestant Bible, with a 66-book canon? Which version of the Protestant Bible do they believe is more accurate? Is it the King James Version or another English Bible translation (see here), or do they read the Bible in its original Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic to ensure its authenticity? If I were you, I wouldn't bother asking more than one Christian which version of the Bible to read because Christians cannot even agree on which version of the Bible is the most accurate, let alone what the Bible teaches. The truth is that Christianity is a fragmented religion. In fact, we've seen the schism between Christians in this thread and others on this forum. Why should Christians expect non-Christians to believe anything they say about the Bible, God, or anything else related to their Christian faith if they can't even agree on what the Bible says? The truth is that if you ask a diverse group of Christians the same theological question, you will get different answers, and all of these Christians will use the Bible to justify their answers, even if they are all different and even contradictory. You could ask the Catholics, Orthodox Christians, Anglicans, or Protestants. If you choose Protestant Christians, then you could ask the Baptists, the Methodists, or the Presbyterians, or you can choose from the hundreds of Christian churches listed here. Or is it simply a hopeless case that isn't worth the effort?

 

[syo]

Demons, is there any evidence they even exist?

If so what is the evidence?

Christianity. Modern Abrahamics in general.

 

[Kenny]

Yes, it's called confirmation bias.
You'll happily accept any anecdotes that you can match with your belief and reject those that you can't.Th
And you'll do it on the very basis of it matching or not. Not on any actual evidential merit itself.

Then again, when do we accept reality as reality?

 

[ElishaElijah]

Then again, when do we accept reality as reality?

I would say this isn’t going to happen until the Judgement, that’s when the debates and arguments will be no more because everything will come out in the open and nothing hidden anymore.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

The truth is that Christianity is a fragmented religion.

Yes, the most fragmented, by a huge margin!
But why?
Could it be that it was a target for attack, at its inception?
“The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one” —1 John 5:19

“The one called the Devil and Satan … is misleading the entire inhabited earth. He was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him.” —Revelation 12:9-12.
(And yes, I recognize that would include me also, to some degree. “The entire inhabited earth” is everyone, which would include me.)

It stands to reason then, that anything that originates from God, would be a target for attack. (Even things like the Divinely-given institution of marriage, is under attack today.)
And Jesus’ sacrifice, the basis of Christianity… Jesus’ perfect life paid for what Adam lost when he sinned: his perfect life.
Can you see how the theory of evolution, taken too far by being credited with creative power, has negated that purpose? (“Adam was never created perfect, he just descended from apes.”)

I could go on and on, providing examples of how what the Bible’s context teaches, ie., accurate knowledge, has been either twisted, diluted, or corrupted….

Or is it simply a hopeless case that isn't worth the effort?

No, although it may seem so (which is, as I’ve just tried to show, by design), it is certainly not hopeless!
Jesus himself cut through all that effort, when he said to look for one thing: love. (John 13:34,35) “By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves.”

Christendom displays love, even great love, providing for needs — in peace time. But let borders change, or governments engage in warfare… what happens? Love “goes out the window”.

Genuine love, knows no man-made boundaries.

So if one is searching, they must look for a united religion with a worldwide loving brotherhood that transcends all racial, national, ethnic, political, etc., barriers.

Of course, as Jesus said, genuine love for God, his Father, comes first; but you know what results from that? A love for people!

It’s a result of having His spirit and blessing (Galatians 5:22,23); and according to Luke 10:21, its only from Him (Jehovah God, not Jesus), that people can gain an accurate understanding of His Word.

(I could mention a few more related points to reason on…. another time, maybe.)


IMO

Great post, by the way.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

To be more specific, which Bible version do they read? Is it the Catholic Bible, with a 73-book canon; the Greek Orthodox Bible, with a 79-book canon; or the Protestant Bible, with a 66-book canon? Which version of the Protestant Bible do they believe is more accurate? Is it the King James Version or another English Bible translation (see here), or do they read the Bible in its original Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic to ensure its authenticity? If I were you, I wouldn't bother asking more than one Christian which version of the Bible to read because Christians cannot even agree on which version of the Bible is the most accurate, let alone what the Bible teaches. The truth is that Christianity is a fragmented religion. In fact, we've seen the schism between Christians in this thread and others on this forum. Why should Christians expect non-Christians to believe anything they say about the Bible, God, or anything else related to their Christian faith if they can't even agree on what the Bible says? The truth is that if you ask a diverse group of Christians the same theological question, you will get different answers, and all of these Christians will use the Bible to justify their answers, even if they are all different and even contradictory. You could ask the Catholics, Orthodox Christians, Anglicans, or Protestants. If you choose Protestant Christians, then you could ask the Baptists, the Methodists, or the Presbyterians, or you can choose from the hundreds of Christian churches listed here. Or is it simply a hopeless case that isn't worth the effort?

Winner Frube!

 

[ElishaElijah]

Yes, the most fragmented, by a huge margin!
But why?
Could it be that it was a target for attack, at its inception?
“The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one” —1 John 5:19

“The one called the Devil and Satan … is misleading the entire inhabited earth. He was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him.” —Revelation 12:9-12.

It stands to reason, that anything that originates from God, would be a target for attack. (Even things like the Divinely-given institution of marriage, is under attack today.)
And Jesus’ sacrifice, the basis of Christianity… Jesus’ perfect life paid for what Adam lost when he sinned: his perfect life.
Can you see how the theory of evolution, taken too far by being given creative power, has negated that purpose? (“Adam was never created perfect, he just descended from apes.”)

I could go on and on, providing examples of how truth, ie., accurate knowledge, has been either twisted, diluted, or corrupted….


No, although it may seem so (by design), it is certainly not hopeless!
Jesus himself cut through all that effort, when he said to look for one thing: love. (John 13:34,35) “By this all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love among yourselves.”

Christendom displays love, even great love, providing for needs — in peace time. But let borders change, or governments engage in warfare… what happens? Love “goes out the window”.

Genuine love, knows no man-made boundaries.

So if one is searching, they must look for a united religion with a worldwide brotherhood that transcends all racial, national, ethnic, political, etc., barriers.

Of course, as Jesus said, genuine love for God, his Father, comes first; but you know what results from that? A love for people!

It’s a result of having His spirit and blessing - Galatians 5:22,23


IMO

Great post, by the way.

Well, I thought I was a “Christian”, was smoking pot, drinking, immoral sex life and everything that goes along with that. I “believed” I was a good person and right with God and would’ve argued that too! Then I was born again and realized how deceived I was, I wasn’t a Christian at all.
I think this is alot of the division…Satan is in the camp causing the division and then pointing out saying “look at all the division”. Why? Because Satan is a liar, thief and murderer disguises himself as an angel of light just like the Bible says. Thats what I found to be the case.
Can tell there won’t be any division in Heaven, when there was they got kicked out, now they’re causing havoc on the Earth and that’s obvious, just look at the news.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Can tell there won’t be any division in Heaven,

….and, eventually, on this planet earth, also. Remember the model prayer Jesus gave at Matthew 6:9,10? Part of it says, “Thy Will be done on earth, as it is in Heaven.”

And in the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus stated, “Happy are the meek, since they will inherit the earth.” Evidently he was quoting from Psalm 37:10,11.

Take care.

 

[SkepticThinker]

28 Schoolgirls Hospitalized After Messing with Ouija Board: Report

After the girls showed symptoms of anxiety, they were taken to a nearby hospital. Some were accompanied by their parents.

www.westernjournal.com

Yeah, that's called an anxiety attack. No demons required.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Tedious and boring??! I find it extremely fascinating. How we come to believe what we believe, how our beliefs change over time, how and why we lie about our belief to others and even ourselves -myself included of course- I find worth my consideration.
I've made my reasoned argument. If you no longer wish to engage in its discussion then so be it. Just know that finding something tedious and boring is not a reasoned argument. Its an emotional deterrent.

Yep, it's a bit to tedious for me. Sorry. I don't have a belief in god, and no amount of mental gymnastics is going to turn that into a belief or a claim.

Yes, information theory applied to observed phenomena such as that found in DNA and the fine tuning of the universal constants for instance. Keep in mind these are evidences of an unknown cause, but one that may be explicable by a hypothesis which describes a Godlike sentient being.

What "observed phenomena such as that found in DNA" are you referring to that makes you think god(s) is involved?
The "universal constants" are just the way we observe and describe the workings of the universe.

A little advice though. I don't think any amount of evidence on its own will convince you or any so called "non-believer" that God exists because the cause of that evidence will always remain hypothetical until that cause makes itself known.
As for me, something causes me to feel as if God exists. Perhaps that something is an existent God? And no that's not an argument for Gods existence.

I really don't like when people try to tell me the that actual demonstrable evidence wouldn't convince me of something.
If the evidence isn't good enough to conclude that some god exists, then the evidence isn't good enough to draw a conclusion.

 

[SkepticThinker]

This seems to me to be a pretty biased and ignorant point of view driven by emotion rather than rationality. Some Christians may be terrible in crises but so are some non-Christians. The last crisis I was in was when I almost lost my hand. The doctor that saved it is a Christian and it was saved in a Catholic hospital. Chesley Sullenberger of "miracle on the hudson" fame is a Christian. Generals MacArthur and Paton were Christians. Almost all elected U.S. presidents were Christian...just to name a few who handled crises. There's plenty of Christians who handled and are handling crises quite well.

If your understanding of Christianity is such that you demand that God answer you the way you want to be answered or even expectantly demand to be answered then it is sadly misplaced. No one on earth is immune to suffering, to misfortune, to pains and anguishes, and even death. Including Christians. That is the reality scripture presents and it coincides with the reality we know.
God is not obligated to save you, your child, or anyone from these things merely because of professing being a Christian and you have asked him to. "Thou shall not tempt the lord thy God". That is ignorance of how Gods goodness is defined. And it is ignorance of the tools God has provided to help ourselves.

You've missed something vital in that exchange.
You should read through @Sgt. Pepper's posts on the matter.

 

[SkepticThinker]

It does according to the Bible, what spirits are you dealing with then if not demonic? Even the liquor store advertises spirits.View attachment 73337

Well sorry, but everyone doesn't define themselves according to what the Bible claims.

 

[nPeace]

It's called mass hysteria, not demons at all.

It's your word against mine.

 

[ElishaElijah]

Well sorry, but everyone doesn't define themselves according to what the Bible claims.

They don’t? How do they define themselves then? By the dictionary? Make up terms or what? Care to explain what you mean by that?