Deny the holocaust

[Estro Felino]

With the events unfolding in France and the marches and whatnot, I thought to myself why is it a crime there to deny the holocaust but drawing pornographic depictions of a person people depict as a role model ok.

I really hope that someone writes soon an illustrated book named "Jesus' and Magdalene's hot nights", and if nobody does, I will.
so you can see that nobody will kill me for doing that.

your speech ignores the freedom of thought. Anyone can write whatever they want about historical characters or historical events.

Everyone is free to deny the Holocaust too. There are so many Holocaust deniers in the world, many of whom Neo-Nazis. They are all alive and healthy.

 

[Ultimatum]

That wasn't a wise thing to say.

No one will deny that 1+1 = 2 , but when i say God created the universe and you say it was created by accidents and chances, so which fact you want me to believe in, the chances.

1+1=2 is the same equation wherever you are in the world.
God is not the same thing wherever you are in the world.

Religion obey borders; truth doesn't.

 

[Ingledsva]

Your evidence is what you heard ?!

Why it should be a crime if one denies it ?

I'm free whether if i want to believe it or not, you can't force someone to believe what you have heard and believed.

As you have evidence from people you heard the others have also their evidences.

Here's one example
Is the Holocaust a Hoax?

You seem to have missed what Columbus said -- "The Germans kept excellent records."

In other words they told on themselves, and we have the testimony of survivors, and of solders that freed people from the camps, - and lots of photos.


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[bobhikes]

All religions exist in the Muslim world including atheism and they don't believe Muhammed as a great prophet, should they be killed.

In my opinion the only valid reason for killing a person is if that person purposely killed another.

 

[Laika]

How do you know it is a factual event ?
Is it kind of blind faith ?

Communists have a problem with the Ukrainian Famine-Genocide of the 1930's as the Soviet Union denied it took place at all. The USSR said it was a lie manufactured by "Fascist, Imperialist Counter-Revolutionaries". Many people continue to deny it, and it is as much an issue in Ukraine (the "Holomodor" as it is known) as the Holocaust in Germany. Virtually all of the atrocities committed in the USSR were denied in this way, and whilst it was public knowledge amongst anti-communists, communists themselves didn't have to accept it until 1956 when Khrushchev said "this actually" happened" because they believed the lies.

I reach a kind of understanding that knowledge is social and based on trust which can be violated from time to time. As much as I don't want it to be true, it is best to accept and recognize just how low human beings can sink when they become insensitive to one anothers suffering. History is full of evidence of that as evidence of the pitiful species we are.

I might one day go and see the killing fields in Cambodia. But I don't have the courage to swallow my pride, especially when there is an implicit sense of it was "my" people who did it. I have a daily battle between the part of me that wants to deny it and the part of me that accepts human beings really are capable of stuff like that. The truth can be really terrifying at times, but Free Thought and Speech come with a responsibility to tell the truth and to find it out.

With the events unfolding in France and the marches and whatnot, I thought to myself why is it a crime there to deny the holocaust but drawing pornographic depictions of a person people depict as a role model ok.

It's a crime because it has to be so ingrained in cultural memory so people never do it again. It's that simple.

...

You listen to me. I'll be polite a grand total of one time about this. I've been to Birkenau. I've seen Treblinka, Belzec & Sobibor. I've seen the ovens where they burnt the bodies of men, women & children whos' only crimes were being Jews, Gypsies, Homosexuals or Slavs. I've met with thirty or forty survivors, who still have numbers on their arms, some of them still even have the uniforms they wore, with the patches sewn into them to identify why they were there.

A handful showed me where they were missing gold teeth, or told me how their wedding bands were taken when their husbands were sent into the gas chambers. Or the shoes of their children they managed to scavenge from their bodies before the Nazis either burnt them or tossed them into graves holding thousands. Piled on top of each other like wood or garbage.

One individuals' hand had swollen so much from where they'd beaten him that they couldn't get his gold ring off, so they just took the whole finger. Or where people lost their wedding rings because they had fallen off due to how much weight they lost, while they were being starved & worked to death.

That was your one polite explanation. I suggest you apologize and go no further.

Good man. I'm glad someone on here can say they've seen it for themselves.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Why would anyone want to deny the Holocaust? Why would anyone want to rewrite history in this way? Hatred of the Jews is the only reason I can think of, a sordid attempt to resurrect a vile Nazi ideology. It's despicable.

 

[renaud.kingsland]

Why would anyone want to deny the Holocaust? Why would anyone want to rewrite history in this way? Hatred of the Jews is the only reason I can think of, a sordid attempt to resurrect a vile Nazi ideology. It's despicable.

Do you consider there to be a difference between denying and questioning?

Outright denying the Holocaust without evidence might be motivated by hate, but questioning and coming to a different conclusion about the details and the "place" of the Holocaust is not always motivated by hate.

That said, I don't see how either one should legally be punished by law in any country.

 

[sandandfoam]

Cartoons, printed in Iran, denying the holocaust were published in Israel. What does that tell you?

Iranian cartoons mock Holocaust | The Times of Israel

 

[FearGod]

Cartoons, printed in Iran, denying the holocaust were published in Israel. What does that tell you?

Iranian cartoons mock Holocaust | The Times of Israel

Tells that Iran did a crime and should be punished for that.

US will do the wars for the Jews and what happened to Germany will happen to the US.
Who Really Started World War II? - The Bilzerian Report

 

[Flankerl]

How do you know it is a factual event ?

Yeah uhm how come my grandparents had multiple brothers, sisters and cousins(aka people who would have lived till well into the 90s 00s), then of course their parents, aunts, nieces, nephews and grandparents and almost no one of them was alive in April 1945?

So where did they go? Kinda convenient of them to all "vanish" till 1945 huh?

Here's one example
Is the Holocaust a Hoax?

**** ***.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Do you consider there to be a difference between denying and questioning?

No, I think "questioning" is just a more devious approach.

 

[FearGod]

**** ***.

**** *** too

 

[Rick O'Shez]

So now we have an RF thread to promote anti-Semitism. Despicable and depressing.

Or is it just a cynical attempt to distract from the atrocities committed by Islamic terrorists? The timing of the thread very much suggests that it is, together with contributions from a false-flag conspiracy theorist.

 

[FearGod]

So now we have an RF thread to promote anti-Semitism. Despicable and depressing.

Or is it just a cynical attempt to distract from the atrocities committed by Islamic terrorists? The timing of the thread very much suggests that it is, together with contributions from a false-flag conspiracy theorist.

And so this thread should be deleted and the ones anti-islamic should stay.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

And so this thread should be deleted and the ones anti-islamic should stay.

I think you are just trying to distract from the horrible reality of atrocities committed by Islamic terrorists. Your false-flag approach fell flat on it's face, so now a different tack. You clearly have an agenda, and a very unsavoury one.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

You know, with all the throwing around of labels meant to discredit people instead of their arguments.

If I think people have a divisive and destructive agenda I will point it out. Like promoting anti-Semitism for example. Hate speech, stuff like that.

 

[renaud.kingsland]

'Conspiracy theorist'. Is that supposed to be an insult or something? I think it's sorta lost it's meaning. You know, with all the throwing around of labels meant to discredit people instead of their arguments.

The term "conspiracy theorist" is often used as an insult. I'll be honest and say that most, if not all, conspiracy theories are crazy (like the ones about a hollow earth or dinosaurs in UFO's), but there have always been events in modern history that look a bit suspicious, and governments do cover things up. In that context it's basically a buzzword - Newspeak for "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"

 

[Rick O'Shez]

"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"

Well, at least approach him with a healthy dose of scepticism. Sure, conspiracy theories are titillating and entertaining, we sort of want to believe them, but we know deep down they're mostly rubbish.

 

[FearGod]

I think you are just trying to distract from the horrible reality of atrocities committed by Islamic terrorists. Your false-flag approach fell flat on it's face, so now a different tack. You clearly have an agenda, and a very unsavoury one.

False flags isn't my invention, you and some others want it to be Islamic whereas me and some others think of it as a conspiracy against Islam.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck......