did we come from monkeys

[HelpMe]

Is this one of those things you 'heard', like how the nearest galaxy is only forty light years away?

1...A team of astronomers from UCLA
turned Chandra's gaze on a region approximately 100 light-years across...

2...The diameter of the entire group is about 100 light years and is at a distance of about 5000 light years from the Sun...

3...While it measured one hundred thousand light years across...

kk

 

[Mr Spinkles]

HelpMe-- I don't know what point you think you've made by posting a few links to some websites about the Milky Way and various objects inside of it.

 

[HelpMe]

is it 75 or 100 light years across?who do i trust?is this not a big difference inbetween opinions?one of which you undoubtedly acknowledge as fact.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

is it 75 or 100 light years across?who do i trust?is this not a big difference inbetween opinions?one of which you undoubtedly acknowledge as fact.

Read the three references you cite. Read all of the words. :banghead3

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I recommend taking Deut's advice.

The first two references you cited, HelpMe....when they give the number "100 light years" they are referring to a particular region within the Milky Way being studied. The Milky Way itself is about 75,000 light years in diameter.

As for your third reference...a PBS series advisor is quoted by a graphic designer as having said that the Milky Way is about 100,000 light years across. Who would I trust? I would trust astronomers and physicists, rather than some guy who works at a TV station. At any rate, let's lay to rest that 1) the nearest galaxy is a LOT farther away than 40 light years and 2) astronomers can directly observe events in the past.

For the last time, let's please get back on the topic of "did we come from monkeys?" And for the record, this will be my last response to you on this thread.

 

[HelpMe]

The first two references you cited, HelpMe....when they give the number "100 light years" they are referring to a particular region within the Milky Way being studied. The Milky Way itself is about 75,000 light years in diameter.

1) the nearest galaxy is a LOT farther away than 40 light years and 2) astronomers can directly observe events in the past.

i guess the Britannica Student Encyclopedia gets it's information from pbs.
'The Milky Way is almost 100,000 light-years in diameter'

so does this free encyclopedia.
'Our galaxy, the milky way, is about 100,000 light years across'.

1-agreed
2-i believe the question started with the supposition that we could monitor what is our past, and seeing another galaxy's past is rather far from it.and you don't have to be an astronomer to look at the stars(monitor past).

honestly though, i doubt the purpse of smilies was to be insulting.

 

[The Voice of Reason]

honestly though, i doubt the purpse of smilies was to be insulting.

Quite the contrary - that is the exact purpose of some of the smilies - to show that the poster is embarrased, canadian, sarcastic, surprised, mad, glad, etc. I'm sure that Spinkles put exactly the smilie in his post that he intended.

TVOR

 

[jasonparker]

http://www.evolutiondeceit.com/

http://www.jesuswillreturn.com/

http://www.muhammedhasenoglu.com/ing_index.htm

 

[jasonparker]

i forgot to write, i find these sites interesting, well they are sources for researching Muslims

 

[huajiro]

If you have any doubt that we came from monkeys, look at me. lol

 

[Valjean]

"There is a thought that we are evolved from monkeys." --- This is your own thought, probably derived from a misunderstanding or ignorance of evolution theory.

...You are bipedal. Is that because God intended you to be bipedal and, therefore, designed you to be bipedal?"

Good point, Deut. If God designed us to be bipedal He is a poor designer. Any 1st year engineering student could improve on our design. Evolution, though, must work with what structures already exist. The imperfect modification of existing structures to serve new ends is evidence of change through natural selection rather than intelligent design. An intelligent Creator would have designed a better spinal anatomy, for example, than the horizontal structure modified into the problem-plagued, weight-bearing spine we now live with.

 

[jasonparker]

It is not very meaningful to discuss the Power of Creator here. A beliver believes in Holy Books and know God correctly from there.
It is more useful for you the state your confusions on Evolutionary theory of Intelligent Design Theory.

 

[salaiviswam]

"There is a thought that we are evolved from monkeys." --- This is your own thought, probably derived from a misunderstanding or ignorance of evolution theory.

...You are bipedal. Is that because God intended you to be bipedal and, therefore, designed you to be bipedal?"

Good point, Deut. If God designed us to be bipedal He is a poor designer. Any 1st year engineering student could improve on our design. Evolution, though, must work with what structures already exist. The imperfect modification of existing structures to serve new ends is evidence of change through natural selection rather than intelligent design. An intelligent Creator would have designed a better spinal anatomy, for example, than the horizontal structure modified into the problem-plagued, weight-bearing spine we now live with.

Hi Seyorni,

I strongly feel that Man didnt evolve from Monkey.It is really peculiar how people related themselves with Monkey.
I feel that the God is Master Designer whose creations are Flawless & is filled with great beauty of unimaginable limits,which many humans are yet to fully comprehend.
-salaiviswam

 

[HelpMe]

*thread title*

this isn't even how evolution is supposed to work?

 

[Druidus]

I strongly feel that Man didnt evolve from Monkey.

Welcome to the boards! I'm glad that you are willing to state your views, and I hope to have many a discussion with you.

It is really peculiar how people related themselves with Monkey.

No it isn't. We merely looked at anatomy, genetics, and behavior. However, we are not direct descendants of monkeys. We are direct descendants of an earlier ape.

I feel that the God is Master Designer whose creations are Flawless & is filled with great beauty of unimaginable limits,which many humans are yet to fully comprehend.

Not trying to burst your bubble, but what about the one flaw of many that Seyorni pointed out? Have you fully comprehended her great beauty?

What is wrong with the idea that "God" created evolution? Would you presume that "God", in her omnipotence, is incapable of making a system like evolution? Or is it because you are afraid of the natural thought that if you are descended from non-humans, than non-humans can enter "heaven" just as you can?

 

[painted wolf]

salaiviswam- while I agree that Creation is filled with wonders it is far from perfect.

Creation is also filled wit almost unimaginable horrors, like parasitic wasps that lay their eggs in living catapillars. The eggs hatch and the baby wasps eat the catapillar from the inside out, they know exactly what to eat first so that the catipillar dispite the great pain doesn't die untill the wasp is almost finished with its meal.
There are terrible human parasites as well... ones that make children go blind and make people die slow agaonizing deaths.

There are also many mistakes in creation.. like the appendix, why do we have an organ that does us no good but can kill us should it get infected?
Surely when god was taking Adams rib (if you follow genesis) he could have poped out that nasty appendix.

wa:do

 

[goodjewishboy]

I think I'd change 'G-d created evolution' to 'evolution is the means in which G-d creates'. G-d created this reality with its own systems, patterns and rules. I posted the following about a month and a half ago in a different thread (can't we come up with new things to talk about?)

people get waaay too caught up in evolution/creation, religion/science debates. Is there any evidence against the two working side by side? I know extreme orthodoxy in Judiasm and extreme fundamentalism in Christianity claim that the universe is 6000 years old so nothing could possibly exist before that.

http://www.aish.com/societywork/sci...he_Universe.asp

The above article tackles the issues I think rather well. In a nutshell the article describes how, since the Big Bang, time has been decelerating as the universe expands and becomes less dense. In Genesis, G-d does not create the sun and moon until the fourth day. Only on the fourth day do we have a day that we can understand. Since they are not defined, the first three 'days' of Creation could be billions of earth years. Essentialy if you were to stand with G-d on day one with your current perception of time things would be going really, really fast. From our point of view, looking back, the universe is tens of billions of years old and that is correct. Maybe from G-d's point of view we're still sittin' in Day Seven.

That point brings me to evolution. Evolution is observeable, fossil record has traced birds back to dinosaurs. We can see the changes in species millions of years back. We can even look up at the stars and calculate how old they are based on distance and the speed of light.

G-d would not create physcial laws and natural systems if He weren't going to use them. It is my belief that evolution is the tool of creation. Perhaps we are evolved from lower primates and perhaps what we see as Evolution is Creation. We could have been guided to what we are over the course of millions of years, during that time in the Bible before Adam (humanity) was self aware.

Just something to think about.

and another post

There were two major different dinosaur types during the mesozoic age the Saropods, Therapods (spelling is probably wrong)The saropods were the four legged dinosars: triceratops, apatasaurous, etc... Those dinosaurs went completely extinct, their fossil record stops below the geologic extinction line. (The very thin layer of very dark rock that is consistantly found at the same level and on no other level all over the world)

The therapods, (raptors, T-Rex) were completely different from the saurapods. Their skeletons were built for speed, their bone structure is almost exactly like birds. If you shrink a T-Rex skeleton to the size of a chicken the bone structure is almost exactly the same. On the biological and microscopic level feathers of modern birds and reptile scales are very similar. [size=-1]Archeopterix[/size] and other large running bird species found are definately 'missing links' between Therapods and birds. These new kinds of animals exist above and below the geologic extinction line. some were more bird than reptile, like the [size=-1]Archeopterix; and the large running birds were more reptile than bird.

If we move to the present day you see animals like the [/size]ostridge and emu. they're built to run exactly like dinosaurs were. There are also some species of birds alive today that in the embryonic state they start to develop small shap teeth that do not mature. That in it self is a 'missing link' between the birds of today and the bird/reptiles of the far past.

If you want to get theological about it. it makes absolute perfect sence. Say G-d created life and His goal was to creat a being in his image. Through His will he made the conditions just right for life to occur, this process could take billions of years (in our perception of time) for all the right conditions to occur for life to happen. Once He creates life it still takes hundreds of millions of years for conditions to become such that life can change. The conditions for a single cell to become a multicell organism is probably more complex than the first spark of life. Once life had the ability to change G-d let it do so wildly. The pre-cambrian period had the most dirverse life than any other age. G-d lets the ones with the most potential develop and grow and most of the other life die off in an extinction event. There is evidance of six or seven extinction (add one if you count recent human activity) events in paeleologic record. Every time an extinction event has occured the life that has made it through has become far more complex and developed, but less diverse. Now through millions of years of directing life the first being capable of comprehending G-d arises from all this life that has developed behind him. Perhaps Adam was the first human that was self aware.

We have all this physcial evidence for evolution, it's all around us if we use our eyes we can see it. My personal proof for the existance of G-d are in the organisms that have not changed over the eons, like the fern or the Ginko tree, or even the crocodile. Why wouldn't they change like everything eles has unless they were guided there.

This is my personal revelation. G-d writes his prophesy in earth itself as well as in the minds of man. I think with more insight we have in our physcial world, into how everything works can bring us more appreciation of the divine.

I think our problem is when we try to use religion to explain how the world works when religoin's job is to help us understand why. On the flip side scientists should only be concerned with telling us how it all works without trying to explain why.

In conclusion I'll repeat my main points:
Evolution does not contradict Creation.
Science does not contradict Religion.

Just something to think about.

 

[Druidus]

There are also many mistakes in creation.. like the appendix, why do we have an organ that does us no good but can kill us should it get infected?

Actually, it does play a small factor in the immune system, however, yes, for the most part, it is a vestigial organ, which our ancestors used to digest tough plant matter, such as leaves and grass. Also, look at a few other vestigial parts of the human body. For instance, the muscles that can control ear movements. Originally, they could turn and lift your ears, much like a dog, but now, most people can't use them at all, because they aren't strong enough. The pinky toe. It's virtually useless for you foot balance, and without it, you could still balance just as easily. There are many others as well, lending credit to the idea that we evolved from non-humans.

 

[Yerda]

Creation is also filled wit almost unimaginable horrors, like parasitic wasps that lay their eggs in living catapillars. The eggs hatch and the baby wasps eat the catapillar from the inside out, they know exactly what to eat first so that the catipillar dispite the great pain doesn't die untill the wasp is almost finished with its meal.

A lucid illustration of adaptation at work I'd say.

What does wa:do mean?

 

[jasonparker]

there are some Muslims believing that there are sign of evolution in Quran. I cannot understand this.