Disgruntled former SS teacher

[Kathryn]

No, I understand it well, but the time involved in dwelling on this can be from years down to microseconds, therefore I consider it irrelevant. Some take years to sin; some sin almost immediately. Consider the husband who is licensed to carry a gun, who unexpectedly comes home, and upon finding his wife in their bed with another lover, kills them both as quickly as he can pull the gun out. The time involved cultivating the sin (murder) does not matter.

So you're saying that the initial emotion of anger or jealousy is wrong, even if one's application is not wrong, and the emotions are not allowed to "fester" and be used to fuel future wrongful actions?

 

[MaterSammichMan]

So did your anger and jealousy do any good? Did the anger and jealousy result in anything positive? While it is true that it enabled you to get divorced without committing a biblical sin so that you felt no guilt in divorcing your unfaithful spouse, but I find it difficult to view the dissolution of a marriage ordained by God as a positive thing.

 

[waitasec]

If, as you believe Kathryn (and I do not wish to debase you for your feelings), you would get angry and jealous if you found out that your spouse was being unfaithful, to what end would that anger and jealousy arrive? Would you divorce your mate, or would you forgive them?

why would jealousy have anything to do with divorcing someone who has cheated on you...if one is to divorce on the grounds of a broken commitment, jealousy has nothing to do with it...

 

[MaterSammichMan]

So you're saying that the initial emotion of anger or jealousy is wrong, even if one's application is not wrong, and the emotions are not allowed to "fester" and be used to fuel future wrongful actions?

I am saying that both anger and jealousy can be a gateway to a multitude of sins. Perhaps a Holy God can limit the evolution of His own anger and jealousy, but I find that a hard concept to accept. Biblically speaking, even God, when angered by mankind or jealous of man's worship of another "god", it often ended in man's death.

 

[MaterSammichMan]

why would jealousy have anything to do with divorcing someone who has cheated on you...if one is to divorce on the grounds of a broken commitment, jealousy has nothing to do with it...

You need to read all of the conversations between myself and Kathryn to understand our discussion.

 

[waitasec]

From: A Jealous God | Bible.org - Worlds Largest Bible Study Site

The whole article is very good, but here are the high points:

"We do not read very far in the Bible before we hear God saying, “You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God” (Exodus 20:4-5). A jealous God! How can a God who is holy, just, loving, gracious, merciful, and long-suffering possibly be jealous? We need to explore a side of jealousy that may have escaped us.

the statement that proceeded verse 5 validates the reason why we see this jealousy as something very human like.

...punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.

 

[MaterSammichMan]

Incidentally Kathryn, I want to thank you for your patience and politeness in our discussion. We obviously both have very deep convictions in our beliefs. I do not wish to argue, and appreciate your candor.

 

[MaterSammichMan]

waitasec can you provide another link to the Bible.org post? That one doesn't work.

 

[waitasec]

You need to read all of the conversations between myself and Kathryn to understand our discussion.

i've read enough to say that i agree with Kathryn when she said this:

Apparently you're just not paying attention to my statements regarding feeling an emotion and dwelling on an emotion and allowing it to impact your actions.

i would also like to add that the god in the bible dwells in this emotion as
he would punish the 3rd and forth generation....

 

[waitasec]

waitasec can you provide another link to the Bible.org post? That one doesn't work.

you know i can't. sorry.

that link was originally posted by kathryn you are going to have to ask her... or maybe go to the original post

 

[MaterSammichMan]

As I've illustrated, one need only "dwell" on a thought for milliseconds before sin can creep in.
And since you've brought it up, how can a "Just and Holy God" punish the innocent unborn for the sins of their parents? Is that your idea of "Just and Holy"? That's like saying since your Dad robbed a bank, we're sending your son, grandson, and great-grandson to jail. That is not justice in my view.

 

[MaterSammichMan]

The scripture must align to the true nature of God, which is love, patience, and forgiveness. If any scripture does not align to those concepts, it is either a translational error, or something added by man, whether intentional or not.

 

[MaterSammichMan]

Example of a biblical error which has not been edited out:
Matt 8:28 "Two demon-possessed men..."
same passage in Mark 5:2 "A (one) demon-possessed man..."
and in Luke 8:27, "A (one) demon-possessed man..."

Was it one or two men?

 

[MaterSammichMan]

Although mankind is specifically warned in Revelation NOT to add to or take from the scriptures, it does not mean that men have not done it, intentionally or otherwise.

 

[beerisit]

Although mankind is specifically warned in Revelation NOT to add to or take from the scriptures, it does not mean that men have not done it, intentionally or otherwise.

Wow, it's a good thing that Revelation got included then, isn't it?

 

[waitasec]

As I've illustrated, one need only "dwell" on a thought for milliseconds before sin can creep in.

so according to you thinking is a sin.

and since we are 100% inclined to think we 100% sinful.

And since you've brought it up, how can a "Just and Holy God" punish the innocent unborn for the sins of their parents? Is that your idea of "Just and Holy"? That's like saying since your Dad robbed a bank, we're sending your son, grandson, and great-grandson to jail. That is not justice in my view.

no it's not.

i didn't say that, the bible does.

 

[waitasec]

Although mankind is specifically warned in Revelation NOT to add to or take from the scriptures, it does not mean that men have not done it, intentionally or otherwise.

the idea of god can't fit into a box
as it limits the possibilities

 

[Kathryn]

So did your anger and jealousy do any good? Did the anger and jealousy result in anything positive? While it is true that it enabled you to get divorced without committing a biblical sin so that you felt no guilt in divorcing your unfaithful spouse, but I find it difficult to view the dissolution of a marriage ordained by God as a positive thing.

Oh come on.

First of all, it's not against the bible to divorce an unfaithful spouse.

Secondly, it wasn't my anger and jealousy (which were very short lived) that "enabled me" to get a divorce. It was the actions of my spouse that broke the covenant of our marriage. It was my common sense that "enabled" me to make one of the best decisions of my life, which was to divorce him.

What makes you think our marriage was "ordained by God" anyway?

By the way, just what did you mean when you said this about your unfaithful wife:

I CHOSE to kick her to the curb, because both I, and my children who she abandoned, deserved better.

What does "kick her to the curb" mean in your world?

 

[waitasec]

The scripture must align to the true nature of God, which is love, patience, and forgiveness. If any scripture does not align to those concepts, it is either a translational error, or something added by man, whether intentional or not.

this is circular logic


where did you get the idea of god's nature in the 1st place? the bible...
the bible is self fulfilling...

 

[F0uad]

Jealousy is a human emotion if i am right God of the old-testament is more human then i found in other scriptures.