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Do animals have souls?
- Thread starter jeffrey
- Start date
Wow, I can sure relate to your grief. There are few humans that I have loved as much as I have loved a few of my pets. Yes, there are some, but not many. I wish you believed that we (humans and animals) had souls. I can tell you that it's a very comforting thought. If you don't believe, though, my telling you it's true isn't going to change anything. On the positive side, I believe you're in for a very, very pleasant surprise someday!anders said:
I can hardly blame you for that. But I don't believe you stood in line waiting for anything. If you did, who did you think you would have been while you were waiting? Your spirit is immortal. It existed long before your body did. And it was always a human soul. There was no chance that it would have ended up in a gastrotrich (whatever that is!)robtex said:If I stood in line for years waiting for a shot at life as a soul and God made me a gastrotrich whose lifespan is a few days I would be in God's office the next day demanding a refund!
Hey, Sey!Seyorni said:How do you come to this conclusion, Katzpur? Could you explain your taxonomy of spirits further?
My post #34 on this thread pretty much explains my beliefs about as comprehensively as I can. Why don't you go back and read it. Then, if it raises any specific questions, just ask and I'll be happy to try to clarify.
Storm Moon
â Spiritual Warrior â
I believe they do. I have a cousin that had a dog that died and she told me that she saw him (well his spirit) in her bathroom one night. It kind of creeped me out but it got me thinking.
Flappycat
Well-Known Member
I don't believe in souls at all in the mystical sense. When I speak of souls, I refer to 1) a capability of being conscious that one is capable of death, 2) a capability of compassion, 3) a capability of understanding such things as right and wrong, 4) a capability of mourning for one who is dead or dying, and all of the other things that humans tend to think seperate them from most animals. All of these things are important because they are recognitions of the concept that we or another creature are something other than the flesh and bone that we are all composed of. Drawing an intellectual line between the state of being living and the state of being dead, for example, is a recognition that life is a special state of matter. As another example, compassion is a feeling that recognizes the suffering of another as something more important than how it effects that person's behavior or usefulness, something more personal.
Yes, to me, certain animals have souls. The whole reason that so many people believe in souls in the mystical sense is that we consider the life of something that we feel has a soul something beyond the condition of its body. Next time you see a horse playing in a field, watch it closely. Ask yourself if you can feel the wind whipping over your body as it runs, grass rubbing against your back as it rolls upon the ground. You can't sense that in a small rodent, an insect, or a reptile. You get the feeling that it has an awareness, a mind, a soul, even more so if you spend any amount of time in the company of one. I don't know how many of the multifarious aspects of what I would consider a "soul" a horse really has, but I'm bountifully certain that it has enough of them to seperate them from most other creatures, enough of them that, if I were personally attatched to one, I would mourn it if it were to die.
It's really too complex to be reduced to a black and white distinction. The mind and body are a gestalt of many parts of a greater whole. Functioning alone, the hippocampus, neocortex, and all the other parts of our brain would not be equivalent to a mind or, if you will, soul. In functioning together, they spawn something that is an existence unto itself, something that is no more mere flesh and bone than a car is a haphazard pile of engine parts or a beautiful song is mere noise. We are the product, the composition. We could, over time, replace every single part of ourselves with a clever machine that does the same thing and is subject to the same faults, and we would be every bit the same person as we will be after the seven to ten years it takes to replace every single cell in our body. This would make us wholly artificial, though, androids. To you believers in mystical notions of a soul, would we still have a soul then?
My point is that I don't think that a somewhat higher rate of encephalization in the neocortex distinguishes us so much from similar animals that we should consider ourselves entirely apart from them. We have a special sort of kinship with them, and they should have at least so much respect that we would welcome their company in an afterlife.
Yes, to me, certain animals have souls. The whole reason that so many people believe in souls in the mystical sense is that we consider the life of something that we feel has a soul something beyond the condition of its body. Next time you see a horse playing in a field, watch it closely. Ask yourself if you can feel the wind whipping over your body as it runs, grass rubbing against your back as it rolls upon the ground. You can't sense that in a small rodent, an insect, or a reptile. You get the feeling that it has an awareness, a mind, a soul, even more so if you spend any amount of time in the company of one. I don't know how many of the multifarious aspects of what I would consider a "soul" a horse really has, but I'm bountifully certain that it has enough of them to seperate them from most other creatures, enough of them that, if I were personally attatched to one, I would mourn it if it were to die.
It's really too complex to be reduced to a black and white distinction. The mind and body are a gestalt of many parts of a greater whole. Functioning alone, the hippocampus, neocortex, and all the other parts of our brain would not be equivalent to a mind or, if you will, soul. In functioning together, they spawn something that is an existence unto itself, something that is no more mere flesh and bone than a car is a haphazard pile of engine parts or a beautiful song is mere noise. We are the product, the composition. We could, over time, replace every single part of ourselves with a clever machine that does the same thing and is subject to the same faults, and we would be every bit the same person as we will be after the seven to ten years it takes to replace every single cell in our body. This would make us wholly artificial, though, androids. To you believers in mystical notions of a soul, would we still have a soul then?
My point is that I don't think that a somewhat higher rate of encephalization in the neocortex distinguishes us so much from similar animals that we should consider ourselves entirely apart from them. We have a special sort of kinship with them, and they should have at least so much respect that we would welcome their company in an afterlife.
Sikhism
Member
to those that believe in reincarnation, what are you thoughts on this hym?
gUjrI ]
goojaree ||
Goojaree:
AMiq kwil jo lCmI ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo lashhamee simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of wealth, and dies in such thoughts,
srp join vil vil AauqrY ]1]
sarap jon val val aoutharai ||1||
shall be reincarnated over and over again, in the form of serpents. ||1||
ArI bweI goibd nwmu miq bIsrY ] rhwau ]
aree baaee gobidh naam math beesarai || rehaao ||
O sister, do not forget the Name of the Lord of the Universe. ||Pause||
AMiq kwil jo iesqRI ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo eisathree simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, he who thinks of women, and dies in such thoughts,
bysvw join vil vil AauqrY ]2]
baesavaa jon val val aoutharai ||2||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a prostitute. ||2||
AMiq kwil jo liVky ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo larrikae simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of his children, and dies in such thoughts,
sUkr join vil vil AauqrY ]3]
sookar jon val val aoutharai ||3||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a pig. ||3||
AMiq kwil jo mMdr ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo ma(n)dhar simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of mansions, and dies in such thoughts,
pRyq join vil vil AauqrY ]4]
praeth jon val val aoutharai ||4||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a goblin. ||4||
AMiq kwil nwrwiexu ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal naaraaein simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of the Lord, and dies in such thoughts,
bdiq iqlocnu qy nr mukqw pIqMbru vw ky irdY bsY ]5]2]
badhath thilochan thae nar mukathaa peetha(n)bar vaa kae ridhai basai ||5||2||
says Trilochan, that man shall be liberated; the Lord shall abide in his heart. ||5||2||
gUjrI ]
goojaree ||
Goojaree:
AMiq kwil jo lCmI ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo lashhamee simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of wealth, and dies in such thoughts,
srp join vil vil AauqrY ]1]
sarap jon val val aoutharai ||1||
shall be reincarnated over and over again, in the form of serpents. ||1||
ArI bweI goibd nwmu miq bIsrY ] rhwau ]
aree baaee gobidh naam math beesarai || rehaao ||
O sister, do not forget the Name of the Lord of the Universe. ||Pause||
AMiq kwil jo iesqRI ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo eisathree simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, he who thinks of women, and dies in such thoughts,
bysvw join vil vil AauqrY ]2]
baesavaa jon val val aoutharai ||2||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a prostitute. ||2||
AMiq kwil jo liVky ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo larrikae simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of his children, and dies in such thoughts,
sUkr join vil vil AauqrY ]3]
sookar jon val val aoutharai ||3||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a pig. ||3||
AMiq kwil jo mMdr ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal jo ma(n)dhar simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of mansions, and dies in such thoughts,
pRyq join vil vil AauqrY ]4]
praeth jon val val aoutharai ||4||
shall be reincarnated over and over again as a goblin. ||4||
AMiq kwil nwrwiexu ismrY AYsI icMqw mih jy mrY ]
a(n)th kaal naaraaein simarai aisee chi(n)thaa mehi jae marai ||
At the very last moment, one who thinks of the Lord, and dies in such thoughts,
bdiq iqlocnu qy nr mukqw pIqMbru vw ky irdY bsY ]5]2]
badhath thilochan thae nar mukathaa peetha(n)bar vaa kae ridhai basai ||5||2||
says Trilochan, that man shall be liberated; the Lord shall abide in his heart. ||5||2||