Do Willful Bums Deserve Charity?

[Stanyon]

He asked you how many there are, how you determine it, and whether you believe it is a serious problem.

The parameteres of the question were fallacious and you seem far more worried about me answering sunstone's questions than he seems to be.
The question I asked of of you still remains which is a real life scenario- what would you do and please explain your answer.

 

[DavidFirth]

I don't think they deserve respect but I don't think they deserve to dry up and die, either.

 

[Skwim]

Do those who willfully go into dangerous occupations such as firefighter and police officer deserve to be honored when they die doing their job?

.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

The parameteres of the question were fallacious

How, exactly?

and you seem far more worried about me answering sunstone's questions than he seems to be.

Probably because he doesn't expect you to be able to. I'm perhaps slightly less cynical and tend to believe people wouldn't make statements without being able to answer basic questions.

Apparently I was naive.

The question I asked of of you still remains which is a real life scenario- what would you do and please explain your answer.

Your question is irrelevant. Answer sunstone's questions.

 

[Little Lunch]

Whether through religious teachings or just plain laziness how do people justify being willful parasites on society and do you think they deserve any charity/help or should they just get a job and earn their daily bread just like the rest of us? I have no problem helping those in actual need, most everyone hits hard times at some point and as long as a person is actually taking steps to fix their situation I don't mind giving a hand up once in a while, now on the other hand a willful bum whose life plan is to leach off the fruits of others labour I have no sympathy for and they can die in the gutter for all I care if that is what it comes to, so it is a no for me.

Wilful parasites on society, like judges and lawyers?
I think you'll find that the wilful bum takes far less to keep alive then those in the upper echelon of society who drain the wealth of the rest of us.
If you would let anyone die in the gutter without a care, then it is you, the black hearted, who are the biggest drain on society.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Sure but they don't deserve cell phones paid for and things like that. Food, clothing, shelter

Have you tried looking for a job in the past decade without a phone?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

now on the other hand a willful bum whose life plan is to leach off the fruits of others labour I have no sympathy for and they can die in the gutter for all I care if that is what it comes to, so it is a no for me.

Is it weird that when you said "whose life plan is to leach off the fruits of others labour," I thought "oh - I started thinking that this post was about the homeless, but I guess it's actually about the clergy"?

 

[DavidFirth]

Do those who willfully go into dangerous occupations such as firefighter and police officer deserve to be honored when they die doing their job?

.

I think they do.

 

[Kemosloby]

Have you tried looking for a job in the past decade without a phone?

They dont want to work, they chose to be bums. Street people, but if they can write a good song people will flock to them with money.

 

[Altfish]

Whether through religious teachings or just plain laziness how do people justify being willful parasites on society and do you think they deserve any charity/help or should they just get a job and earn their daily bread just like the rest of us? I have no problem helping those in actual need, most everyone hits hard times at some point and as long as a person is actually taking steps to fix their situation I don't mind giving a hand up once in a while, now on the other hand a willful bum whose life plan is to leach off the fruits of others labour I have no sympathy for and they can die in the gutter for all I care if that is what it comes to, so it is a no for me.

Would you support the innocent children of these "Wilful Bums"?

 

[Stanyon]

Your question is irrelevant.

My question was very straightforward and is completely relevant to this thread, far more useful in illustrating my point than dodgey statistics compiled by who knows what group with who knows what agenda, the question I am asking is on a very personal and real level.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

My question was very straightforward and is completely relevant to this thread, far more useful in illustrating my point than dodgey statistics compiled by who knows what group with who knows what agenda, the question I am asking is on a very personal and real level.

But it's not relevant to what was asked of you. It's also irrelevant to the issue, because personal anecdotes mean nothing in terms of actual reality.

 

[Stanyon]

It's also irrelevant to the issue, because personal anecdotes mean nothing in terms of actual reality.

Saying that making a personal judgement call based on experience somehow means nothing in actual reality defies any type of logic, people do it everyday in their personal and professional lives.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Saying that making a personal judgement call based on experience somehow means nothing in actual reality defies any type of logic, people do it everyday in their personal and professional lives.

Except personal judgement is based on more than just personal, anecdotal accounts. Just because a person experiences an attack by a knife-wielding monkey doesn't imply that there is an epidemic of knife-wielding monkeys or that knife-wielding monkeys are likely to pose a significant threat to the average member of the general public.

Using this analogy, the idea of "willful homeless" is absurd, unless you can objectively assert just how many willfully homeless people there are and why it constitutes a significant problem.

 

[Stanyon]

Except personal judgement is based on more than just personal, anecdotal accounts.[snip]
Using this analogy, the idea of "willful homeless" is absurd, unless you can objectively assert just how many willfully homeless people there are and why it constitutes a significant problem.

Willful bums is the term I used and I did not say it was a significant problem, it seems you are attempting to alter the facts of what I said to fit your views and analogies and attempting to frame the discussion within your accepted parametres because you see it as more beneficial to you.

And the question still remains- "what would you do?"

 

[YmirGF]

Most bums I meet don't depend on much of anything except some money for alcohol. They aren't leaching the system in any way, because they're still sleeping in the streets rather than going to homeless shelters.

That reminds me, one night, years ago I was waiting for a bus on a major downtown street. A first nations individual, clearly intoxicated, came up to me and said, "Hey, buddy. Can you spare a buck for a beer?" I replied, "I appreciate your honesty." and fished into my pocket and pulled out a Loony. He thanked me profusely and stumbled on his way. I stood there smiling over the incident.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Willful bums is the term I used and I did not say it was a significant problem, it seems you are attempting to alter the facts of what I said to fit your views and analogies and attempting to frame the discussion within your accepted parametres because you see it as more beneficial to you.

Actually, whether or not it was a significant problem was the very question posed to you that you avoided answering. I take it from your inability to answer, and your statement here, that don't feel it's a significant problem. Is that the case?

And the question still remains- "what would you do?"

I would judge it on a case by case basis.

 

[oldbadger]

Whether through religious teachings or just plain laziness how do people justify being willful parasites on society and do you think they deserve any charity/help or should they just get a job and earn their daily bread just like the rest of us? I have no problem helping those in actual need, most everyone hits hard times at some point and as long as a person is actually taking steps to fix their situation I don't mind giving a hand up once in a while, now on the other hand a willful bum whose life plan is to leach off the fruits of others labour I have no sympathy for and they can die in the gutter for all I care if that is what it comes to, so it is a no for me.

So you were born with loads of abilities which help you to earn plenty and cope well, and it's so easy to slip into a careless ignorant pov that assumes that all those on benefits were as lucky as you.
You didn't earn any of your abilities, you were lucky enough to get born with them.
Wise up to what physical, mental and IQ disability really is, and pay up to help those who need help, is my suggestion.

The biggest parasites are those who evade and avoid paying just and due taxes..... those misers cost billions.

 

[Stanyon]

I would judge it on a case by case basis.

In the scenario I posted what would you do in that case and please explain your answer as to how you came to your judgement, it was simple and straightforward.

 

[Stanyon]

So you were born with loads of abilities which help you to earn plenty and cope well, and it's so easy to slip into a careless ignorant pov that assumes that all those on benefits were as lucky as you.
You didn't earn any of your abilities, you were lucky enough to get born with them.

That seems like a pretty sweeping generalization