Do you think some or most members of ISIL believe they are Muslims? Please read first post.

[Kori]

I know, I shouldn't expect the intellectual content of conversations on RF to be very high. Me bad. If only the original comment wasn't so patently absurd.

It can be high. Just Zealots and Soccer Hooligans tend to drain the IQ from this place. @Rowan is neither though. To bad we all cannot eat our Burger King brain food like you.

 

[YmirGF]

It can be high. Just Zealots and Soccer Hooligans tend to drain the IQ from this place. @Rowan is neither though. To bad we all cannot eat our Burger King brain food like you.

I really shouldn't converse with children. Good night.

 

[Kori]

I really shouldn't converse with children. Good night.

Watch out for The Shadow Man. He's mean.

 

[FearGod]

I really shouldn't converse with children. Good night.

Sleep well and don't forget to wear the diaper.

 

[LuisDantas]

I believe their personal agenda's are more significant than their religious affiliation to them. I'm not a fan of Islam but think that there are quite a few things ISIS regularly does that defies the Quran. Just because someone claims or believes they are X doesn't actually make them X. I definietly think the leaders of ISIS beleive in Allah although I just don't think they follow his teachings. Similar to modern "Christians" in America.

Doesn't that amount to knowing better than them whether they are Muslims?

It is a dangerous step for one to take.

 

[LuisDantas]

Well, I don't think my judgement is some sort of objective judgement.
From my perspective they might not and perhaps shouldn't be considered as such.

That would be (and is) a very serious mistake IMO.

Why is it so much more socially acceptable to kill them in military actions than to point out that all signs point out towards them being true believers?

 

[YmirGF]

I believe their personal agenda's are more significant than their religious affiliation to them. I'm not a fan of Islam but think that there are quite a few things ISIS regularly does that defies the Quran. Just because someone claims or believes they are X doesn't actually make them X. I definietly think the leaders of ISIS beleive in Allah although I just don't think they follow his teachings. Similar to modern "Christians" in America.

As, so you see them as hypocrites, as no true Muslim would behave in such a way. You do understand that what you are suggesting teeters perilously close to the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. I agree with @LuisDantas on this one and it is a very serious mistake.

Ymir is a decent example of what I mentioned above, although X would be "A person who actually contributes to discussion instead of attacking the poster".

If you want to understand the minds of the leaders of the Islamic State you might want to study the life of Muhammad for a few years. After you have done that, come back and we can talk. Have you read a single biography about Muhammad? Read any books on Islam?

 

[FearGod]

As, so you see them as hypocrites, as no true Muslim would behave in such a way. You do understand that what you are suggesting teeters perilously close to the "No True Scotsman" fallacy. I agree with @LuisDantas on this one and it is a very serious mistake.

Why countries are spending a lot of money on weapons and searching for more powerful killing machines?
Do you think because they read the quran?

If you want to understand the minds of the leaders of the Islamic State you might want to study the life of Muhammad for a few years. After you have done that, come back and we can talk. Have you read a single biography about Muhammad? Read any books on Islam?

Hitler was influenced by Muhammed then.

 

[David1967]

Watch out for The Shadow Man. He's mean.

Why did you have to bring up the shadowman?I'm alone tonight. Guess I'll be sleeping with the lights on.

 

[EtuMalku]

Now I am sure there are those in ISIL that do believe they are Muslim and some do not. However I want to know what you think. I believe that those who think ISIL is Islamic in any way cherry pick words from the Koran and ignore others. Yeah Extremists do that believe it or not. And those who do not are just lunatics wanting to find some way to kill, rape, and inflict pain and "get away" with it.

By the way here is some good news.

What gives you the idea any of them are 'not' Muslim?

 

[Kori]

What gives you the idea any of them are 'not' Muslim?

Well I did say that people like to kill and so on and "get away" with it. Also to many they say: Islam, death, or sex slavery(women). Keep that in mind.

 

[Kori]

If you want to understand the minds of the leaders of the Islamic State you might want to study the life of Muhammad for a few years. After you have done that, come back and we can talk. Have you read a single biography about Muhammad? Read any books on Islam?

Just wondering...If Islam didn't exist would some other group be a plague on the world somewhere? Yes. Islam is just something they hold on to. If it wasn't Koran then it would be anything else.Some people want to kill and so on. Sometimes they need a reason sometimes they do not.

 

[YmirGF]

Just wondering...If Islam didn't exist would some other group be a plague on the world somewhere? Yes. Islam is just something they hold on to. If it wasn't Koran then it would be anything else.Some people want to kill and so on. Sometimes they need a reason sometimes they do not.

So I am taking this to mean you have not read an iota about Muhammad or Islam.

 

[Kori]

So I am taking this to mean you have not read an iota about Muhammad or Islam.

I never said or hinted anything like that. I know Islam, like other Religions, can be barbaric. But blame Muhammad or Islam and more or less that's it doesn't add to the discussion of the questions being asked. It's more than that.

 

[FearGod]

I don't get what you're getting at.

Nor I

 

[Sakeenah]

Now I am sure there are those in ISIL that do believe they are Muslim and some do not. However I want to know what you think. I believe that those who think ISIL is Islamic in any way cherry pick words from the Koran and ignore others. Yeah Extremists do that believe it or not. And those who do not are just lunatics wanting to find some way to kill, rape, and inflict pain and "get away" with it.

By the way here is some good news.

Members of ISIL belief they are muslim..they actually belief they are the only "true muslims" . They also belief that the muslims who don't support the so called Islamic Caliphate are disbelievers.
It's all based on an ideology called khawaarism (takfiriism)

 

[YmirGF]

Members of ISIL belief they are muslim..they actually belief they are the only "true muslims" . They also belief that the muslims who don't support the so called Islamic Caliphate are disbelievers.
It's all based on an ideology called khawaarism (takfiriism)

^This^

It is because of the reality of what you are explaining here that I considered the question raised in the OP to be more than a bit juvenile. Are they opportunists playing on the deep resentment and hatred festering in the minds of their followers. You bet they are. Are they trying to procure a political ambition through guerilla tactics. You bet they are, though it is hard to comprehend how barbaric such a political climate would be in such a quasi-caliphate. But to ask if they think they are Muslims? Seriously? Of course they seem themselves as the BEST of Muslims and woe betide the hide of anyone who falls short of their expectations as to what that means and entails. In their minds they follow the Caliph. This gives that individual extraordinary powers to command and it is of little consequence to the leaders or their followers if anyone disputes their vision of Islam. The answer to how to deal with such opposition is clearly written in the wars that Muhammad fought.

Further to this, they are not here to setup a conventional country that begs for a seat at the U.N. They are here to destroy the current world order and likely see themselves as anointed by God to do so.

 

[FearGod]

Members of ISIL belief they are muslim..they actually belief they are the only "true muslims" . They also belief that the muslims who don't support the so called Islamic Caliphate are disbelievers.
It's all based on an ideology called khawaarism (takfiriism)

But their acts say otherwise.

 

[YmirGF]

But their acts say otherwise.

It doesn't matter what you or I think about them, FearGod. It's about how they view themselves.

 

[Sakeenah]

But their acts say otherwise.

Their acts go against the teachings of Islam.
They interpret the Quran and ahadith in way that suits their political agenda.
ISIL don't represent Islam or Muslims.

They are terrorists who have a political agenda and they happen to be muslims.