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Does God have Free Will?
- Thread starter Sunstone
- Start date
God has choices, but not fully free will nor determinism. Since we are god, the question in my mind is the same. Compatiblism is my best answer.
However, a realized self surely has the most freedom of choice and exertion of will, since now it has maximal power and is freed from karma. Some might argue that all natural restrictions are gone when one becomes Shiva, but I would say it's possible that one is still limited by part of it's nature that are inherent to existence/itself, even as an unlimited consciousness..
However, a realized self surely has the most freedom of choice and exertion of will, since now it has maximal power and is freed from karma. Some might argue that all natural restrictions are gone when one becomes Shiva, but I would say it's possible that one is still limited by part of it's nature that are inherent to existence/itself, even as an unlimited consciousness..
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
It sounds like an oxymoron. God has the ability to do anything and everything but at the same time limited from free will. Ideally, he does have free will when believers dont limit him in the way they experienced and understoood by them.
Burt I dont know how the bible is supposed to be interpreted. I dont know greek and roman history. The idea of the hebrew god no explains that. But, in concept, he does. If he didnt, how would he be god.
Shadow Link
Active Member
I wonder, how does freedom belong to the will? Seems(statistically speaking) that "preservation" isn't necessarily at an issue for God.
"The will is well known by all to be directed by the understanding, to be moved by motives, to be guided by other parts of the soul, and to be a secondary thing. Philosophy and religion both discard at once the very thought of free-will." ~ C.H. Spurgeon
74x12
Well-Known Member
His nature is fixed. Just like fire is always fire.
IsaiahX
Ape That Loves
If you define free will as your choices not being limited by an external force, than yes. If you define it as being not limited by even your own being and convictions, than no. God, being good, cannot do anything evil, and being intelligent, he cannot do anything foolish. He is not limited by any thing other than himself, but is limited by his own nature. Then again, I would not call being unable to do anything evil or foolish a true limitation.
whirlingmerc
Well-Known Member
God can freely choose and accomplish whatever he wishes. So yes He does.
"My purpose shall stand" God speaking through Isaiah
God does not need Free Will. The question of the degree of Free Will and determinism are qualities of our physical existence and fallible humanity, though by the evidence determinism dominates our natural world, and only a degree of possible Free Will in humans.
Audie
Veteran Member
Too anthropomorphic a notion of God.
Skwim
Veteran Member
Skwim
Veteran Member
Don't know how you define evil, but being honest I would think you'd go along with it's accepted definition and apply it as such
e·vil
/ˈēvəl/
adjective: evil
1. profoundly immoral and malevolent.
noun: evil
1. profound immorality, wickedness, and depravity, especially when regarded as a supernatural force.
/ˈēvəl/
adjective: evil
1. profoundly immoral and malevolent.
noun: evil
1. profound immorality, wickedness, and depravity, especially when regarded as a supernatural force.
I assume you'd characterize making mistakes as committing foolish acts, so it would have to be the case that when god made mistakes he acted foolishly. Would he not?
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IsaiahX
Ape That Loves
If God were to take the life that he gave to a human being, I'm sure he would do it for the greater good of that soul and all humanity. For more on how salvation can be found even after death I would check my thread on Universalism, the Bible, and Christianity.
For the latter point, I do not know what mistake you are speaking of, unless you mean the killing of that human being, in which case the same answer applies.
The point of the response was not about those two attributes specifically, anyway. They were just examples. What I meant was that God cannot do anything against his own identity and will.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
If He doesn't, whose will is being forced upon Him?
Skwim
Veteran Member
Genesis 6:6–7
6 And the Lord regretted that he had made man on the earth, and it egrieved him to his heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.”
1 Samuel 15:11
11 “I regret that I have made Saul king, for he has turned back from following me and has not performed my commandments.” And Samuel was angry, and he cried to the Lord all night.
Exodus 32:12–14
12 Why should the Egyptians say, ‘With evil intent did he bring them out, to kill them in the mountains and to consume them from the face of the earth’? Turn from your burning anger and relent from this disaster against your people. 13 Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, your servants, to whom you swore by your own self, and said to them, ‘I will multiply your offspring as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have promised I will give to your offspring, and they shall inherit it forever.’ ” 14 And the Lord relented from the disaster that he had spoken of bringing on his people.
Jeremiah 42:10
10 If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull you down, and I will plant you, and not pluck you up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you.
Amos 7:3
Then the Lord changed his mind about this. The Lord said, “It will not happen.”
6 And the Lord regretted that he had made man on the earth, and it egrieved him to his heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, man and animals and creeping things and birds of the heavens, for I am sorry that I have made them.”
1 Samuel 15:11
11 “I regret that I have made Saul king, for he has turned back from following me and has not performed my commandments.” And Samuel was angry, and he cried to the Lord all night.
Exodus 32:12–14
12 Why should the Egyptians say, ‘With evil intent did he bring them out, to kill them in the mountains and to consume them from the face of the earth’? Turn from your burning anger and relent from this disaster against your people. 13 Remember Abraham, Isaac, and Israel, your servants, to whom you swore by your own self, and said to them, ‘I will multiply your offspring as the stars of heaven, and all this land that I have promised I will give to your offspring, and they shall inherit it forever.’ ” 14 And the Lord relented from the disaster that he had spoken of bringing on his people.
Jeremiah 42:10
10 If ye will still abide in this land, then will I build you, and not pull you down, and I will plant you, and not pluck you up: for I repent me of the evil that I have done unto you.
Amos 7:3
Then the Lord changed his mind about this. The Lord said, “It will not happen.”
Yet per the examples above, he did do something against his "own identity and will." He regretted, relented, repented, and changed his mind about things he had done. Mistakes he made. IOW: Foolish acts and decisions.
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74x12
Well-Known Member
God has all power that exists. There is no more power than the power which actually exists.
Audie
Veteran Member
IsaiahX
Ape That Loves
"If I spank my son for blatant disobedience and he runs away from home because I spanked him, I may feel some remorse over the spanking — not in the sense that I disapprove of what I did, but in the sense that I feel some sorrow that the spanking was necessary and part of a wise way of dealing with my son in this situation, and great sorrow that he ran away. If I had to do it over again, I would still spank him. It was the right thing to do, even knowing that one consequence would be alienation for a season. I approve the spanking from one angle, and at the same time I regret the spanking from another angle. If such a combination of emotions is possible for me in my finite decisions, it is not hard for me to imagine that God’s infinite mind — the infinite complexity of God’s emotional life — would be capable of something similar or even more complex."
- John Piper
The point is that God, as an infinite and transcendant being, does not always expirience emotions in the same way we do. In addition, it claims that the passages were not saying God regretted a mistake, but rather felt sorrow for his children's suffering.
Skwim
Veteran Member
So what chapter and verse does is this little bit of information gleaned from?
Is that what god was talking about when he said:
“I regret that I have made Saul king, for he has turned back from following me and has not performed my commandments.” And Samuel was angry, and he cried to the Lord all night.
Really? REALLY?
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