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Does Identity Politics Promote Tribalism and the Fracturing of Society?
- Thread starter Sunstone
- Start date
Heyo
Veteran Member
Yes.
I would say so - culture wars seem to be a defining feature of the 2010s and quite plausibly the 2020s as well.
Here in the UK, national surveys have demonstrated that Brexit identities are not only stronger now than the traditional party affiliations but have become such exclusive, tribal affiliations that they could even restrict one's choice of friends / social circle or marriage partner.
Now, if a fissure over identity in a society can become so deeply embedded as to influence choice of marriage partner, I think one can safely argue that it is fracturing society.
From last year:
Sky Views: Brexit isn't just a crisis, it's far more than that
New polling out this week by the country’s leading pollster Sir John Curtice found a country that is increasingly polarised by Brexit identities rather than party political ones.
Only one in 16 Britons - 6% of respondents - did not have a Brexit identity, while more than one in five polled said they didn’t have a party identity.
Meanwhile, another poll by YouGov for The Times last weekend found that more than a third of Remainers would be upset if a close relative married a strong Leave supporter.
Almost two-thirds of respondents said all or most of their friends shared their Brexit stance.
Brexit has left an indelible imprint on our identities and it has left an imprint on our politics too.
Only one in 16 Britons - 6% of respondents - did not have a Brexit identity, while more than one in five polled said they didn’t have a party identity.
Meanwhile, another poll by YouGov for The Times last weekend found that more than a third of Remainers would be upset if a close relative married a strong Leave supporter.
Almost two-thirds of respondents said all or most of their friends shared their Brexit stance.
Brexit has left an indelible imprint on our identities and it has left an imprint on our politics too.
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epronovost
Well-Known Member
No, since identity politics is a desciptive framework not a prescriptive political position or ideology.
It states that people, more specifically oppressed minorities, develop a political agenda, views, ideologies and organisation based on their particular experience.
Saying that identity politics are promoting tribalism and fracturing societies basically means that analysing society and politics based on the fact that minorities and other oppressed people like the poors or handicap people form their political identities and agenda largelly based on their experience as a member of such group is profoundly moronic. What's "facturing society" is that their lives and experiences are different than others (and from one another) not that they react to that difference by developping different ideas on politics.
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Yes, i see identity politics at work in America and Britain.
Both are not only fracturing but falling apart
I think identity politics was a contrivance to keep the lower classes divided against each other.
I’m ambivalent. I think people are just getting more specific with language maybe arguing about that. But that always happens, doesn’t it? Indeed people reacting to this sort of political talk is nothing new, either. Generations figure out their own terminology for themselves. They figure out their place in society, many try to right the wrongs they see and buck against the system. The generation previous are appalled and blame them for societal ills. Rinse and repeat.
I couldn’t care less anymore.
I couldn’t care less anymore.
Given the society in question, I certainly hope so.
Secret Chief
Very strong language
Yes. Politics has always involved identification. What one identifies with or as may certainly have changed.
As a crude example, in the UK the identity of the working class was pretty much tied up to the Labour Party, the identity of the middle class to the Conservative Party. Today, that is in the process of dissolving (for various reasons, no doubt).
Should we be making a distinction here between describing identity politics and practicing identity politics? It seems we need two terms, but only have one. When Jones analyzes politics in terms of identities, that's one thing. When Smith chooses their cabinet significantly on the basis of their political identities, that's quite another thing.
Cooky
Veteran Member
Do you think identity politics were at play in the situation that led up to the Civil War? I personally don't know enough about it, but I have "heard" that family members were divided, and actually fought on different sides... I don't know if that's true.
...If it is true, then that would cause me to look deeper into other major causes of nation-failure, such as the Persian and Roman Empire collapses, to see if there was a major "identity politics" problem that existed there.
That seems a rather bold assumption, to state that all people of a given minority group all share the same experience. That's in direct conflict with the principle of judging people as individuals, not as a members of group.
Identity politics is really nothing new. It's been practiced in the U.S. for centuries. A few decades ago, there were those who pushed against it and tried to seek out a new and different way. Martin Luther King inspired many people with his ideals of judging people by the content of their character, not by the color of their skin. It appeared that society was heading more and more in that direction until the late 80s/early 90s, when someone decided it was time to end that trend and revert back to identity politics - although it had a slightly different twist designed to dupe white liberals into thinking that it was a good thing.
Samael_Khan
Qigong / Yang Style Taijiquan / 7 Star Mantis
It depends how people use it. It is one thing to recognise facts, it is another to frame the arguments in such a way that it creates tribalism and hatred of certain identities.
Yeah. I see this “identity politics” as little more than millennial hippies. Kids are gonna kid. Let them figure it out and live life
exchemist
Veteran Member
Yes.
I don't know about the Persian empire but the Roman empire was a hodbed of identity politics in which many prominent% people died, Pompey is one example.
*And probably even more plebeians)
Secret Chief
Very strong language
I should think so. The Wars of the Three Kingdoms (including the English Civil War) sometimes set family member against family member, causing splits and of course bloodshed.
The issue of the EU referendum has, I know from just my own personal experience, caused family ructions and longterm friendships to end. But no blood has been shed. Yet (the transition period ends on the 31st of this month).
Cooky
Veteran Member
That's an interesting parallel, according to what my wife tells me about what she sees on facebook, where family members and old friends often break paths over politics.
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Father Heathen
Veteran Member
One of the things that lead to the Roman Empire's fall was the adoption of Christianity, and when the church split into two (Catholic vs. Orthodox) so too did the empire (Western vs. Eastern) and continued to go downhill from there.