Does the universe need intelligence to order it?

[Rick O'Shez]

In either case, there is only one light, but several sources of light, those sources being lanterns. Whether there are 1 or100 lighted lanterns makes no difference. There is still just one light. However, the intensity of the one light will vary.

It's still just a poor analogy. Try another one.

 

[savagewind]

Not sure, but I would say 'yes', which would account for the increase in light intensity. However, still only one light would be the case.

Only if the room was boxed in with no light at all to begin with. I am not being feminine , am I?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Tell 'ya what, Thiefie, old chap: I'll confess if you let me toss some nice fluffy word salad into your coffin so you can have a little variety when screaming bloody murder, Okee Dokee?

Oh dear.

 

[godnotgod]

I think I don't agree. One weak light would make the room slighty lit. Ten strong lights would make the room bright. Slightly lit is one kind of light but bright is another. That's two.

Think of an electric lantern with a rheostat. You can adjust the amount of light from low to high, but you still have just one light. That would still be the case if you had ten electric lanterns with rheostats, all being adjusted simultaneously but at different rates. One light at all times.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

But still only one light,..haha.

No there are 10 light sources. But like I said it was a poor analogy to begin with.

 

[godnotgod]

Only if the room was boxed in with no light at all to begin with. I am not being feminine , am I?

LOL. No matter. Even if the room were partially lit when the lanterns were brought in, there is just one light, because all the light would blend into one.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

That would still be the case if you had ten electric lanterns with rheostats, all being adjusted simultaneously but at different rates. One light at all times.

I used to do theatre stage lighting and this analogy is just horribly confused. Please give it up!

What might work here is the idea of electricity as the power source for the electric lamps. So it's the electricity which is universal, not the light from the lamps. But anyway.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

there is just one light, because all the light would blend into one.

No there are 10 light sources.

If you fancy a career as a guru, please find some decent similes and analogies to work with.

I could let you have some Buddhist ones for a small fee.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Do we walk out of each dimension into the next?

I feel like I've walked into a different dimension in this thread. Surreal or what?

 

[Midnight Rain]

Assuming no obstructions between lanterns, the light from each would negate those parameters, merging into one light.

I am a wood finisher. Colors under warm fluorescent lamps compared to cool white lamps yields a different color from the same sample due to what is called the color temperature. But when you combine the two light types in the same room, they merge and create a blended color temperature different than the individual lamps do. The result is one light.

No. "light" itself is a category. And then you have individual rays of light. The way those rays of light behave all depend on the source and medium in which they travel. It has the "appearance" of being one without actually being one.

 

[Thief]

Tell 'ya what, Thiefie, old chap: I'll confess if you let me toss some nice fluffy word salad into your coffin so you can have a little variety when screaming bloody murder, Okee Dokee?

A misconception on your part.....so no wonder you post as you do.

I believe we must renounce the flesh....and I will.

"YOU" on the other hand.....don't even believe in your 'self'.
Not likely to make the stand up with an attitude like yours.

(how's that for 'stand up' comedy?)

 

[Midnight Rain]

No there's one!

Except there are 10. You will have to find a logical justification for your claim that there is but one light. There are 10 sources of light that will interact in the room but they are not the same light. In fact I shouldn't have even said "10" lights as those are just sources of light. I should have told him it was a near infinite number of light rays all coming from different directions from 10 different sources.

 

[godnotgod]

A misconception on your part.....so no wonder you post as you do.

I believe we must renounce the flesh....and I will.

"YOU" on the other hand.....don't even believe in your 'self'.
Not likely to make the stand up with an attitude like yours.

(how's that for 'stand up' comedy?)

I still say the funniest stand up comedy is the image of you screaming your bloody head off in some forgotten grave, and spouting word salad, while God laughs his *** off.

Renounce the flesh? I thought you were all about standing up from the dust and going to heaven, body and spirit together. Me? I am all fleshy. Love it as long as you don't corrupt it.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

No. "light" itself is a category. And then you have individual rays of light. The way those rays of light behave all depend on the source and medium in which they travel. It has the "appearance" of being one without actually being one.

I think it's just a poor analogy for what we're trying to discuss. What might work better is the idea of the electricity powering the lamps as the "universal" quality, or the idea I mentioned earlier of beams of light coming through holes in the roof.

These ideas are really from Hinduism, particularly Advaita. What's adding a lot of confusion is the way they are being mixed up with ideas from Buddhism, quantum mechanics and ancient sages. Like I said, a typical new-age muddle.

 

[Midnight Rain]

I just think it's a very poor analogy for what we're trying to discuss.

That too. I liked your idea about the holes in the ceiling but then at the same time its still poor because that would mean that we ourselves are simply "holes" that consciousness can get out of rather than the source of the consciousness.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I liked your idea about the holes in the ceiling but then at the same time its still poor because that would mean that we ourselves are simply "holes" that consciousness can get out of rather than the source of the consciousness.

Yes, that one isn't ideal either, though it captures the sense of individual expressions of the same quality, ( light as an analogy for consciousness ).

What about the electricity powering the lamps version? You could even have different coloured lamps to represent different characters.

I'm struggling a little because we are trying to illustrate a speculative idea.

 

[godnotgod]

Except there are 10. You will have to find a logical justification for your claim that there is but one light. There are 10 sources of light that will interact in the room but they are not the same light. In fact I shouldn't have even said "10" lights as those are just sources of light. I should have told him it was a near infinite number of light rays all coming from different directions from 10 different sources.

'Interact' is the key word here. They interact to create one light.

If you were in a darkened room with your back turned to the door, and x number of people walked in with lighted lanterns, how many lights do you see?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Please give it up, GNG, your lamp idea just isn't going to work, however much you play around with it.

Instead of trying to think up analogies, why don't you tell us about your first-hand experience of cosmic consciousness?

 

[Robert.Evans]

Please give it up, GNG, your lamp idea just isn't going to work, however much you play around with it.

Instead of trying to think up analogies, why don't you tell us about your first-hand experience of cosmic consciousness?

I think he has you on ignore. That is what you wanted was it not? Do you not think it is time to kiss and make up? Hmm

By the way, if you link to another page through copying the address bar, how does one link to a specific post? any ideas o wise one?

 

[Robert.Evans]

I don't know why I am even going to argue this, but if it was a big room, and the light were spots, it could be seen as ten separate lights I'm sure. But I don't think that is the analogy It is seen as a small room with lights that fill all the room and therefore become one. It is like the waves on the ocean which are part of the one ocean. I think it is a good analogy showing One Consciousness.