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Does your religion have end-time prophesies?

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Salam

You've guys heard of how I explained conditional Prophecies. I don't know if humanity will react well with return of the Mahdi (a) and Jesus (a) and others, if they will submit to them or accuse them of sorcery. And I don't know if believers will remain grateful after or will turn ungrateful like many times when believers were saved, they turn ungrateful.

This world is a test, and so far humanity has failed most tests.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
How big a part of the Messianic Age is worldwide peace? Because, if that is something the Messiah will establish during his lifetime, then no one, Jesus, the Baha'i prophet, or anyone is the true Messiah.
Exactly. You hit the nail on the head.
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Unless the teacher did everything it possibly can.
Give another teacher a chance.
Vishnu Sharma was asked to teach three princes who knew nothing. He taught them with twenty five days with animal stories.

Panchatantra - Panchatantra - Wikipedia
The Panchatantra is an ancient Indian collection of interrelated animal fables in Sanskrit verse and prose, arranged within a frame story. The surviving work is dated to about 200 BCE, but the fables are likely much more ancient. The text's author is unknown, but it has been attributed to Vishnu Sharma in some recensions and Vasubhaga in others, both of which may be fictitious pen names.
 

mangalavara

नमस्कार
Premium Member
Unless the teacher did everything it possibly can.

I agree. In my experience, there are some students who do very little on their part. Most students in a classroom can pass a test. About 20% of them make the highest scores. One of them will fail.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I agree. In my experience, there are some students who do very little on their part. Most students in a classroom can pass a test. About 20% of them make the highest scores. One of them will fail.
Yes, sadly, despite good teaching, there always seem to be those students who either will not, or cannot, learn the lesson. So many factors can be in play. Maybe the student is too hungry to pay attention. Maybe the subject matter is simply too advanced for their level. Maybe they are distracted by a social problem. Maybe their family simply doesn't value education, and so their mind simply doesn't encode it as something important. I could go on and on. I just know that even very good teachers who have classrooms that test above the norms can have students who do not always learn.
 

Ebionite

Well-Known Member
With all the disasters that keep happening and, as some believe, getting worse, because of climate change and whatever other reasons, does this fit with the end-time prophesies of your religion?
Yes, since Sagittarius is symbolic of long-range, powerful weapons, from hypersonic missiles to directed energy weapons.

And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.
And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.
Revelation 6:1-2

And because plagues and earthquakes and other disasters have always happened, why is it different now?
It's not really different, just increasing in intensity.

And this time, for sure, the end-times?
Yes.

But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, [even] to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
Daniel 12:4

And YHWH answered me, and said, Write the vision, and make [it] plain upon tables, that he may run that readeth it.
For the vision [is] yet for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak, and not lie: though it tarry, wait for it; because it will surely come, it will not tarry.
Behold, his soul [which] is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.
Habakkuk 2:2-4

And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.
Revelation 5:5

zodiac_cross.jpg
 

wellwisher

Well-Known Member
With all the disasters that keep happening and, as some believe, getting worse, because of climate change and whatever other reasons, does this fit with the end-time prophesies of your religion? And does your religion even have end-time prophesies? And because plagues and earthquakes and other disasters have always happened, why is it different now? And this time, for sure, the end-times?
Religion has been part of all cultures for thousands of years. Wide scale spread of Atheism is quite new to the world, maybe less than a century. If you believe in evolution and the genetic transfer of traits by natural selection, thousands of years of religion, by man made selective of religion, within culture, should be engrained in our DNA. This is part of modern human behavior due to millennia of behavior election.

We can take people out of religion; stop going to church and behaving moral, but this will not take religion out of the DNA of the people. Climate change seems to trigger this inner religion in the godless the most; repressed religion in their DNA. This touches something deep inside that feels right; in the DNA; legends of the end times. Religious people are more in touch with this DNA; religion, so it is not as big of a deal; another day at the office.

Human selection and DNA engraining, such as with religion, would be no different than a culture always preferring tall children and giving tall all the advantages; man made selection. That cultural DNA choice would shift toward tall, if we did this for 5000 years. Religion is a form of behavior, that uses the imagination and has certain myths and teachings which become engrained in the DNA, so they are easy to learn and retain.

Say the land of tall, started to reverse and pick short, since the DNA had 5000 years of tall selection, tall will still become dominant for birth. That culture could then try to persecute all the tall babies, and make them bow, short, but It may take thousands of years for the conditioning of short, to shift the balance, so short DNA is now innate.

The Liberal Idea of reparation for slavery which blames all white people, is just a religious knock off of original sin. where the sin of two; Adam and Eve, becomes attached to all future humans. The sin of a small number of white people hundreds of years ago, is the original sin knockoff of today. This makes sense to the atheist due to the repressed religion DNA, triggering lessons that goes back thousands of years. The religious people are less DNA repressed and can see this as irrational.

This is a good experimental DNA lesson. It shows how people can take advantage of a repression, that they create, by offering social parallels, that will trigger the repressed genetic based firmware, so the parallel illusion can become real, and manifest as a form of irrational religion, that is not called religion.

My belief is this cycle we see is natural to both the earth; natural, and to manmade selection. The manmade selection is connected to the religion repression within leadership. They vaguely sense the source, but are too unconscious, to put two and two together.

I tend to believe this is about a natural update in the brains operating system; uninstall process like the new Noah's world wide flood parable, due to glacier melt; religion DNA projection. But the Bible says this type flood will never happen again as a promise to Noah. It will not be as dramatic; repressed religion DNA firmware projection.

Man may have triggered the earth's repression, but nature will take over; natural course of the DNA events. The goal appear to be an uninstall and then install of a new operating system; version 4.0.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
Unless the teacher did everything it possibly can.
What is being taught keeps changing. If we just look at Christianity and Islam, we have completely different messages. Ask the Christian what is true, and most will say the Jesus is God. He died on the cross. And that through him is the only way to be saved and be forgiven of your sins. How much of that do you consider to be true according to Islam? Then add in all the other religions and what do we know that is true?

That's why I was wondering about what the different religions really believe about the "end-times". They all believe something different. So, which one is the true message?
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
What is being taught keeps changing. If we just look at Christianity and Islam, we have completely different messages. Ask the Christian what is true, and most will say the Jesus is God. He died on the cross. And that through him is the only way to be saved and be forgiven of your sins. How much of that do you consider to be true according to Islam? Then add in all the other religions and what do we know that is true?

That's why I was wondering about what the different religions really believe about the "end-times". They all believe something different. So, which one is the true message?
I think Trinity and the Christian concept of Savior cannot be derived from the Gospels nor the saint Paul's works. It's similar to me how Sunnism is mass believed even though Quran designates the family of Mohammad (s). If you contextualize everything Gospels and Paul says, it's about the same way Imams are saviors from sins in Shia Islam and there is no hint of trinity once you go back to original words and not translation.

I've shown how Imams (a) express about themselves similar words as did Jesus (a) about himself.

 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
I think Trinity and the Christian concept of Savior cannot be derived from the Gospels nor the saint Paul's works. It's similar to me how Sunnism is mass believed even though Quran designates the family of Mohammad (s). If you contextualize everything Gospels and Paul says, it's about the same way Imams are saviors from sins in Shia Islam and there is no hint of trinity once you go back to original words and not translation.

I've shown how Imams (a) express about themselves similar words as did Jesus (a) about himself.

Well, to tie in back into the "end-times", what do you believe are the signs and any other things that have to happen for the coming of the Mahdi and Jesus?
 

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Well, to tie in back into the "end-times", what do you believe are the signs and any other things that have to happen for the coming of the Mahdi and Jesus?
There are different scenarios.

To show what I mean by conditional Prophecy.

Let's look at one of the prophecies of Mohammad (s) of Imam Hussain (a) being killed. Imam Hussain (a) for example, his martyrdom being the martyrdom of all martyrdoms was a conditional prophecy. It means if the warnings of Quran are not acted upon, and people fail to heed it's warnings, then this is one of the consequences.

But you know there is a hadith that it was written Imam Hussain (a) would be victorious, but it was erased by God. This is found in Al-Kafi. So at a point, Angels (a) even didn't know the people of Kufa would betray Imam Hussain (a). God wrote it not to deceive, but that it appeared to him that Imam Hussain (a) would be victorious.

So then with Hussain (a) being killed, that means some of the warnings in Quran with respect to the past deviations, are not payed attention to.

So let's skip down to the disappearance of Imam Mahdi (a) as it was prophesized, but Imam Hassan Al-Askari (a) (his father) in fact, tried to gather an army, to overthrow the tyrants of his time. If he was successful, and it was close, than perhaps the Ghayba was avoidable.

There are prophecies that most of the Arabs for example will be against Imam Mahdi (a). Is this a destiny, or is conditional? To me it's conditional.

The scariest of all Prophecies of the Mahdi (a) arrival is the following:

مَنِ اهْتَدَىٰ فَإِنَّمَا يَهْتَدِي لِنَفْسِهِ ۖ وَمَنْ ضَلَّ فَإِنَّمَا يَضِلُّ عَلَيْهَا ۚ وَلَا تَزِرُ وَازِرَةٌ وِزْرَ أُخْرَىٰ ۗ وَمَا كُنَّا مُعَذِّبِينَ حَتَّىٰ نَبْعَثَ رَسُولًا | Whoever is guided is guided only for [the good of] his own soul, and whoever goes astray, goes astray only to its detriment. No bearer shall bear another’s burden. We do not punish until We have sent a Messenger. | Al-Israa : 15


وَإِذَا أَرَدْنَا أَنْ نُهْلِكَ قَرْيَةً أَمَرْنَا مُتْرَفِيهَا فَفَسَقُوا فِيهَا فَحَقَّ عَلَيْهَا الْقَوْلُ فَدَمَّرْنَاهَا تَدْمِيرًا | And when We desire to destroy a town We command its affluent ones [to obey Allah]. But they commit transgression in it, and so the word becomes due against it, and We destroy it utterly. | Al-Israa : 16

وَإِنْ مِنْ قَرْيَةٍ إِلَّا نَحْنُ مُهْلِكُوهَا قَبْلَ يَوْمِ الْقِيَامَةِ أَوْ مُعَذِّبُوهَا عَذَابًا شَدِيدًا ۚ كَانَ ذَٰلِكَ فِي الْكِتَابِ مَسْطُورًا | There is not a town but We will destroy it before the Day of Resurrection, or punish it with a severe punishment. That has been written in the Book. | Al-Israa : 58



So far all destructions of rejecting Messengers were local to that place. But with the arrival of the Mahdi (a), it will be universal. All cities will be under trial with the Mahdi (a) and he is a Messenger sent to all.

This prophecy might look like it must happen, but if you recite the Quran, most of the Quran is trying to wake up humanity so it's avoided. That this inevitable event if we walk all the warnings be avoided.

Some of the hadiths talk about technology that before Imam Mahdi (a) comes that people would be able to communicate to each other from far distance. That people from the other side of the world would be able to talk with people living in the opposite. Today this is possible by internet and phones and the technology. Does this mean we are soon. No that, would be example of a hadith, which says "The Mahdi won't come until....", so it means this has to happen before he comes.

There are a lot of these hadiths. One of them is about Qum (a city in Iran). The hadiths talk also about the man from Qum rising. Some people believe that was Khomeini. Some of the hadiths talk about how the wisdom and proof would be established all from Qum rising and spreading it to the world before the the Mahdi (a) comes. That when Imam Mahdi (a) comes, the wisdom has already been widely spread.

But hadiths I can't know for certain. What appears to me, Quran has different scenarios. So even the internet tech prophecy was conditional type that if it was prolonged time and people didn't prepare for the Mahdi (a) fast enough, which is one of the prophecies of Quran.

Another prophecy is that the Quran would be misinterpreted severely and abandoned by people over all. I see this today. And that people would argue with the Mahdi (a) about the interpretation when it comes, and I see people are hard wired to argue about Quran with falsehood and with influence of the dark sorcery not making them see.

But all these are conditional Prophecies. If they were hard written, then how can people be condemned for killing Imam Hussain (a) or betraying him? How can the Imams (a) have had hope of revolution which many hadiths show they did?

So I would say different prophecies contradict each other often, but they might be all true hadiths, just different scenarios.
 
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CG Didymus

Veteran Member
There are different scenarios.

To show what I mean by conditional Prophecy.

Let's look at one of the prophecies of Mohammad (s) of Imam Hussain (a) being killed. Imam Hussain (a) for example, his martyrdom being the martyrdom of all martyrdoms was a conditional prophecy. It means if the warnings of Quran are not acted upon, and people fail to heed it's warnings, then this is one of the consequences.

But you know there is a hadith that it was written Imam Hussain (a) would be victorious, but it was erased by God. This is found in Al-Kafi. So at a point, Angels (a) even didn't know the people of Kufa would betray Imam Hussain (a). God wrote it not to deceive, but that it appeared to him that Imam Hussain (a) would be victorious.

So then with Hussain (a) being killed, that means some of the warnings in Quran with respect to the past deviations, are not payed attention to.

So let's skip down to the disappearance of Imam Mahdi (a) as it was prophesized, but Imam Hassan Al-Askari (a) (his father) in fact, tried to gather an army, to overthrow the tyrants of his time. If he was successful, and it was close, than perhaps the Ghayba was avoidable.

There are prophecies that most of the Arabs for example will be against Imam Mahdi (a). Is this a destiny, or is conditional? To me it's conditional.

The scariest of all Prophecies of the Mahdi (a) arrival is the following:

مَنِ اهْتَدَىٰ فَإِنَّمَا يَهْتَدِي لِنَفْسِهِ ۖ وَمَنْ ضَلَّ فَإِنَّمَا يَضِلُّ عَلَيْهَا ۚ وَلَا تَزِرُ وَازِرَةٌ وِزْرَ أُخْرَىٰ ۗ وَمَا كُنَّا مُعَذِّبِينَ حَتَّىٰ نَبْعَثَ رَسُولًا | Whoever is guided is guided only for [the good of] his own soul, and whoever goes astray, goes astray only to its detriment. No bearer shall bear another’s burden. We do not punish until We have sent a Messenger. | Al-Israa : 15


وَإِذَا أَرَدْنَا أَنْ نُهْلِكَ قَرْيَةً أَمَرْنَا مُتْرَفِيهَا فَفَسَقُوا فِيهَا فَحَقَّ عَلَيْهَا الْقَوْلُ فَدَمَّرْنَاهَا تَدْمِيرًا | And when We desire to destroy a town We command its affluent ones [to obey Allah]. But they commit transgression in it, and so the word becomes due against it, and We destroy it utterly. | Al-Israa : 16

وَإِنْ مِنْ قَرْيَةٍ إِلَّا نَحْنُ مُهْلِكُوهَا قَبْلَ يَوْمِ الْقِيَامَةِ أَوْ مُعَذِّبُوهَا عَذَابًا شَدِيدًا ۚ كَانَ ذَٰلِكَ فِي الْكِتَابِ مَسْطُورًا | There is not a town but We will destroy it before the Day of Resurrection, or punish it with a severe punishment. That has been written in the Book. | Al-Israa : 58



So far all destructions of rejecting Messengers were local to that place. But with the arrival of the Mahdi (a), it will be universal. All cities will be under trial with the Mahdi (a) and he is a Messenger sent to all.

This prophecy might look like it must happen, but if you recite the Quran, most of the Quran is trying to wake up humanity so it's avoided. That this inevitable event if we walk all the warnings be avoided.

Some of the hadiths talk about technology that before Imam Mahdi (a) comes that people would be able to communicate to each other from far distance. That people from the other side of the world would be able to talk with people living in the opposite. Today this is possible by internet and phones and the technology. Does this mean we are soon. No that, would be example of a hadith, which says "The Mahdi won't come until....", so it means this has to happen before he comes.

There are a lot of these hadiths. One of them is about Qum (a city in Iran). The hadiths talk also about the man from Qum rising. Some people believe that was Khomeini. Some of the hadiths talk about how the wisdom and proof would be established all from Qum rising and spreading it to the world before the the Mahdi (a) comes. That when Imam Mahdi (a) comes, the wisdom has already been widely spread.

But hadiths I can't know for certain. What appears to me, Quran has different scenarios. So even the internet tech prophecy was conditional type that if it was prolonged time and people didn't prepare for the Mahdi (a) fast enough, which is one of the prophecies of Quran.

Another prophecy is that the Quran would be misinterpreted severely and abandoned by people over all. I see this today. And that people would argue with the Mahdi (a) about the interpretation when it comes, and I see people are hard wired to argue about Quran with falsehood and with influence of the dark sorcery not making them see.

But all these are conditional Prophecies. If they were hard written, then how can people be condemned for killing Imam Hussain (a) or betraying him? How can the Imams (a) have had hope of revolution which many hadiths show they did?

So I would say different prophecies contradict each other often, but they might be all true hadiths, just different scenarios.
Thanks Link.
 

TransmutingSoul

One Planet, One People, Please!
Premium Member
Hey CG, this is a great speech, it also reflects what Baha'u'llah said must eventually happen. (Must play a bit before speech starts)



".....The time must come when the imperative necessity for the holding of a vast, an all-embracing assemblage of men will be universally realized. The rulers and kings of the earth must needs attend it, and, participating in its deliberations, must consider such ways and means as will lay the foundations of the world's Great Peace amongst men. Such a peace demandeth that the Great Powers should resolve, for the sake of the tranquillity of the peoples of the earth, to be fully reconciled among themselves. Should any king take up arms against another, all should unitedly arise and prevent him. If this be done, the nations of the world will no longer require any armaments, except for the purpose of preserving the security of their realms and of maintaining internal order within their territories. This will ensure the peace and composure of every people, government and nation..." Bahá’u’lláh, Gleanings from the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 248

Regards Tony
 

Aupmanyav

Be your own guru
Yes, sadly, despite good teaching, there always seem to be those students who either will not, or cannot, learn the lesson.
Good teachings? Practical teachings? Or feet-in-clouds teachings? What kind of teaching is it?
Utopian impractical teachings are always bound to fail.
What Zelensky or the Great Peace demandeth will never be fulfilled.
"Should any king take up arms against another, all should unitedly arise and prevent him."
OK, rise unitedly against Russia, China and North Korea. Leave out India. We are not interested in such hare-brained schemes.

"Hume found that there seems to be a significant difference between descriptive or positive statements (about what is) and prescriptive or normative statements (about what ought to be), and that it is not obvious how one can coherently transition from descriptive statements to prescriptive ones. Hume's law or Hume's guillotine is the thesis that an ethical or judgmental conclusion cannot be inferred based on purely descriptive factual statements.

The apparent gap between "is" statements and "ought" statements, when combined with Hume's fork, renders "ought" statements of dubious validity. Hume's fork is the idea that all items of knowledge are based either on logic and definitions, or else on observation. If the is–ought problem holds, then "ought" statements do not seem to be known in either of these two ways, and it would seem that there can be no moral knowledge. Moral skepticism and non-cognitivism work with such conclusions."
 
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YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Oh, I think you greatly misunderstand them. The serious Chabadniks that I've known spent hours and hours every week studying Torah and Talmud.
Most likely they do and of course women have a different position in that group. Like women cannot lead a congregation as some do in different congregations. Have you asked the more serious Chabadniks if they believe there was a great flood as described by Moses? Do they believe Moses existed as written, if you know? There are some Chabadniks in my area, if I have a chance I'll ask but you seem to have had an acquaintance better with them. I also have a close friend who was an orthodox Jew, no more however. I'll ask her if she learned in her orthodox congregation about end times and what they mean. Thanks for bringing that up, if I can I'll let you know.
 

Baroodi

Active Member
I'm unaware of any "end-time prophecies" in Hinduism.

That doesn't mean there aren't any. It just means that I'm unaware of any and that if there were, they are of no interest to me.
then how people are going to be judged? sinners to be punished and the good people to be rwarded
 

Baroodi

Active Member
Prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him and all his good followers) says; the time is over when the people wake up to see the sun rising from the west. That is the last day.
 

Jedster

Flying through space
Most likely they do and of course women have a different position in that group. Like women cannot lead a congregation as some do in different congregations. Have you asked the more serious Chabadniks if they believe there was a great flood as described by Moses? Do they believe Moses existed as written, if you know? There are some Chabadniks in my area, if I have a chance I'll ask but you seem to have had an acquaintance better with them. I also have a close friend who was an orthodox Jew, no more however. I'll ask her if she learned in her orthodox congregation about end times and what they mean. Thanks for bringing that up, if I can I'll let you know.
I was a Chabadnik for short period and lived and studied with them. Yes, they do believe in the flood and the words Moses, i.e. Torah as written.
I am sure if you just walk into their centre, they'll be happy to speak with you(and probably try to convert you Noahism :>) ).
 
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