Egyptian exodus proof or slavery?

[Ehav4Ever]

I agree with you. To my knowledge also there is no internal Jewish tradition saying that the Jews may have come from India. One, I have not studied the Jewish tradition from this standpoint.

That is one of the most important steps. Especially when one deals with the reality that even far-flung Torath Mosheh Jewish communities that have not had contact with each other for more 2,500 years have the same origin story when put back together. One expect that at least one community to have the origin you stated. Especially given the important placed in viritually all ancient Jewish communities on the following:

1. Required community and indivudal transmission of ancient Hebrew/Aramaic and a mix of Hebrew/Aramaic/Local venicular.
2. Required community and indivudal education to transmit the ability to read, write, and understand ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, Mishnaic Hebrew, and Talmudic Aramaic.
3. Required community and indivudal accuracy in copying ancient texts by hand. (within 2,500 years only 14 minor differences in Torah texts throughout the Torah Mosheh Jewish world).
4. Required community and indivudal preservation of ancient texts.
5. Required community and indivudal obervance of studying all of the above in constant repetition.

Such info may be hidden waiting to be discovered.

Highly unlikely based on what I wrote above.

Two, the Jewish "tradition," I understand, is WHOLLY post-Exile starting about 600 BCE.

Not true. Archeology here in Israel is constantly showing a direct connection between pre-and post exile Northern Israel (Samartian) and Yehudah (Jewish-Israeli). Also, the exiles did not move the entire Jewish population from the land of Israel. In the region of Yehudah (Judah) the Babylonians only exiled the government. The average Yehudi (Judean) was left here and in fact both the Assyrians and Babylonians left records of their conquest of both Northern Israel (here in the location where I live in Israel) and also Yehudah (Judea). They make no mention of Israel being in the Indus Valley.

Thus, we may not get a record if the memory had faded or been exorcised before this time.

As they say, this theory has no legs to it, based on all of the information I provided earlier.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

Please post again the links to the books on Scientific proof of Exodus. I have downloaded the links to the videos you posted. But the earlier links have disappeared before I could download them. Thx.

I just checked all of the links are still there. You can see them in the following posts I made.

Egyptian exodus proof or slavery? (#1)

Egyptian exodus proof or slavery? (#2)

Egyptian exodus proof or slavery? (#3)

Egyptian exodus proof or slavery? (#4)

The Importance of Correct/Accurate Terminology in Discussing Torah/Yahaduth

 

[Ehav4Ever]

My sense is that we may find such memory and we may work on Point No 1 above.

Respectfullly, I don't think that is going to get you anywhere. There is no record of all of the Jews who worldwide collectively forgeting what our ancestry was. That is a huge longshot of a claim and in order to hold by it, not knowing Hebrew/Aramaic and not knowing the history of EVERY diaspora Jewish community that have existed you will end up simply making up things to get a conclusion w/o letting the evidence lead you where it will lead you.

I would like to get your guidance as to in which books such evidence may be available.

See my previous post where I gave a list of a few books.

I have gone through the Targums. They mostly follow the Masoretic text. We need to look at the pre-Masoretic traditions.

The problem with your statement here is that you have not correctly identified something that is very critical. The Targums do not go by Masoretic texts. Masoretic text means a Humash with vowels and ta'amim added. Torah Scrolls for example, are not Masoretic Texts. The Targums hold by Torah Scrolls, which are non-Masoretic texts. Further, the Samaritan Torah is not Masoretic either.

Also, the Dead Sea scrolls are not Masoretic and they line up with Torah scrolls.

Please suggest what I must read. Many thanks.

See the above and my last post. Also, you can ask the Jews who are still living in India.[/QUOTE]

 

[Ehav4Ever]

@Ehav4Ever I'm slowly comprehending your Torath Mosheh Jewish due to your appreciation of teaching.

I'm curious. Have you ever felt fire burn in your spirit heart before? And if you have, do you associate fire burning as spiritual nourishment?

What does this style of writing look like to you through your Torath Mosheh Jewish understanding?

When I allow light, unconditional love, who lives within me, to continue teaching me, I'll feel a continuing fire burning in my spirit heart. I understand that the burning fire is continuing spiritual nourishment from light. Can you relate?

And now my challenge is how to spin this message to Exodus so it will remain on topic. Due to this, I'll ask, if you do relate in any way of nourishment from God, in what ways do you know how people from the Exodus era have been nourished by God?

We Torath Mosheh Jews have a different take. We see that the Source of reality/creation has given us many great opportunties with world that we live in, the environment where we find ourselves, and also the Torah then know the presence of Hashem.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I've known about him for a while.

How fun!

I have a number of his books on the shelf behind me, along with other books on the topic, which begs the questions:

1. How many of his books have you actually read?
2. How many other books addressing Israel's ethnogenesis have you actually read, and by what authors?

I'm willing to presume that your answers will be honest. I'm also willing to suggest other books that may serve to better inform you opinion.

 

[River Sea]

We Torath Mosheh Jews have a different take. We see that the Source of reality/creation has given us many great opportunties with world that we live in, the environment where we find ourselves, and also the Torah then know the presence of Hashem.

"Hashem," a new word to add to my vocabulary, to know the presence of Hashem. We know the presence of Hashem as we allow Hashem teach us.

 

[Riders]

I have not been able to see the video yet. I am aware of the work of abraham benhur. He has traced Jewish burials from Babylon to india after the exile c 600 bce. These videos may relate to this migration. This does not stand against the outward migration from india c. 1300 bce during the exodus.

Does that prove the Exodus happened?

 

[Brian2]

Does that prove the Exodus happened?

This find tends to show that the conquest story of Canaan is true and that the late writing of the Pentateuch is not true.
Together with discoveries relating to Israel in Egypt and to the plagues of Egypt and the fact that placing the Exodus and conquest in the Biblical time of the 1400s BC aligns the archaeology of Canaan with the Biblical account in Joshua, the Exodus and Conquest story in the Bible has been proven imo.
Ancient Hebrew ‘Curse Tablet’ Discovered at Joshua’s Altar on Mt. Ebal

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

This find tends to show that the conquest story of Canaan is true and that the late writing of the Pentateuch is not true.

I do not think there is much debate that Jews entered Canaan. Question is wherefrom they came.

 

[joelr]

How fun!

I have a number of his books on the shelf behind me, along with other books on the topic, which begs the questions:

1. How many of his books have you actually read?
2. How many other books addressing Israel's ethnogenesis have you actually read, and by what authors?

I'm willing to presume that your answers will be honest. I'm also willing to suggest other books that may serve to better inform you opinion.

I'm not that interested in Israels ethnogenesis. I'm interested in where the mythology came from. I read his book on who were the early Israelites. I am about to start Francesca Stavrakopoulou's new book. I am interested in comparative mythology which she gets into. Most of my reading in on the NT.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I'm not that interested in Israels ethnogenesis.

Yep.

 

[Brian2]

I do not think there is much debate that Jews entered Canaan. Question is wherefrom they came.

Because of misinterpretations of the archaeological evidence and of what the Bible tells us, many archaeologists and historians say that the Jews did not enter Canaan, but were part of the Canaanite population all along,,,,,,,,,,,,,,or possibly came into Canaan in small groups after leaving Egypt that way also.
I have not heard of anyone saying that they might have come from the Indus Valley, except you.
The Bible certainly mentions nothing about that region.
With the conquest story being confirmed by the recent find of the curse tablet on Mt Ebal however, many archaeologists and historians might be more open to the historicity of the Exodus and conquest stories in the Bible.
It is however amazing how many misinterpretations of the Bible and archaeology have happened about those events however.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

"Hashem," a new word to add to my vocabulary, to know the presence of Hashem. We know the presence of Hashem as we allow Hashem teach us.

In terms of your earlier question. The following may help.

 

[KWED]

Is there proof of the Egyptian Exodus the story of Moses, the desert, and the red sea, is there any chariots found in the red sea?

No.

What's the Red sea deal anyways, I always heard that Moses' group got through the Red Sea, and the Egyptians got stuck, but some say the Red Sea was so shallow anyways that it didn't make sense.

According to some, it was actually the "Sea of Reeds" and refers to a shallow, papyrus lake in the Nile delta.

What about the Pharoah, the leader of Egypt, what has been written by Egyptians about him?

Which Pharaoh? There were over 100 of them?
That's like saying "What about the king, the leader of England, what has been written by the English about him?"

 

[KWED]

Ron Wyatt found chariot remains on the
bottom.of the Red Sea.
I heard about that.
Enjoy
Wyatt Family - legitimate site of Ron Wyatt discoveries

Seems legit.

 

[joelr]

Yep.

I'm interested in comparative mythology and evidence for syncretism and supernatural beings. Also if scripture is true in small details. I am seeing evidence that the Israelites emerged from Canaan peacefully and formed their own nation. Dever agrees with this. Carol Meyers agrees, Dr Josh Bowen, Dr. Francesca Stavrakopoulou as well. Is there a non-fundamentalist who disagrees with this?

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I am seeing evidence that the Israelites emerged from Canaan peacefully and formed their own nation.

No, you are seeking confirmation of what you're predisposed to believe while continuing to evade my questions.

It's OK. The works of people like Dever and Finkelstein have a great deal to recommend them, as does ...

​

 

[Muffled]

Christians claim slaves built the pyramids, these military quarters claimed they built the pyramids.

I believe I have never heard a sermon saying Jews built the pyramids. The Biblical evidence does not support it. Slavery is mentioned but all that means is the people did not have self determination which is why the Pharaoh could order all the first born males to be killed.

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

Because of misinterpretations of the archaeological evidence and of what the Bible tells us, many archaeologists and historians say that the Jews did not enter Canaan, but were part of the Canaanite population all along,,,,,,,,,,,,,,or possibly came into Canaan in small groups after leaving Egypt that way also.
I have not heard of anyone saying that they might have come from the Indus Valley, except you.
The Bible certainly mentions nothing about that region.
With the conquest story being confirmed by the recent find of the curse tablet on Mt Ebal however, many archaeologists and historians might be more open to the historicity of the Exodus and conquest stories in the Bible.
It is however amazing how many misinterpretations of the Bible and archaeology have happened about those events however.

I have not studied the archaeological evidence of the invasion of Canaan. Perhaps Joshua's conquests were small but blown upin the Bible. Thus, we do not gete idence of large-scale conflict.
It is true that exodus from india is a new idea. But then that is what re.search is all about.

 

[Bharat Jhunjhunwala]

I believe I have never heard a sermon saying Jews built the pyramids. The Biblical evidence does not support it. Slavery is mentioned but all that means is the people did not have self determination which is why the Pharaoh could order all the first born males to be killed.

No subset of population of a kingdom has self.determination. there appears to have taken place a politicalconflict between the king and the vassal Hebrews. The question is why did the all. Powerful God not vanquish the king instead of making the Jews flee. And why glorify fleeing?