El Mexico.....the Fifty First State

[Epic Beard Man]

leaving doesn't help

Neither does staying. I've said in another thread a while back, none of these lands truly belong to humans. Mother nature can easily swallow us up and simply another group will come in and take our place. We need to be humble.

 

[metis]

noted....

but the flow of people coming north is troublesome

I can't picture myself illegally crossing a border
live almost in secret
and when caught......I HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE HERE!!!!!!

At this point, we are at 0 net illegal immigration, but that could obviously change in the future. Secondly, most even on the Dem side of things don't believe we should just led anyone in.

And finally, the vast majority of the ones who insist they have a right to be here are the "Dreamers", who came here not of their own volition but have lived here, studied here, worked here, payed taxes here, served in out military here, and who know no other country, including where they originally came from. IMO, it's morally deplorable to send them back, unless of course they've committed crimes.

 

[Thief]

Neither does staying. I've said in another thread a while back, none of these lands truly belong to humans. Mother nature can easily swallow us up and simply another group will come in and take our place. We need to be humble.

that's not the answer

I'm thinking....if Mexico would sell out......be a state......

We Americans really COULD help the situation
the argument over citizenship.....gone
border crossings.....no point
wages would be minimum....a rich man's check to them

I suppose America would want something in return?

 

[Thief]

At this point, we are at 0 net illegal immigration, but that could obviously change in the future. Secondly, most even on the Dem side of things don't believe we should just led anyone in.

And finally, the vast majority of the ones who insist they have a right to be here are the "Dreamers", who came here not of their own volition but have lived here, studied here, worked here, payed taxes here, served in out military here, and who know no other country, including where they originally came from. IMO, it's morally deplorable to send them back, unless of course they've committed crimes.

and they were here legally?

let's not throw citizen law to the wind

and with all they have gained in schooling and experience .....their homeland would be better

 

[metis]

and they were here legally?

let's not throw citizen law to the wind

and with all they have gained in schooling and experience .....their homeland would be better

My position is more of a moral argument in that the law should always be a "respecter of person". This is why judges have discretionary powers on punishment issued or not issued. To send these people back to a country that they are not even familiar with is morally repulsive, imo, much like we don't imprison people whom are innocent. .

 

[Thief]

My position is more of a moral argument in that the law should always be a "respecter of person". This is why judges have discretionary powers on punishment issued or not issued. To send these people back to a country that they are not even familiar with is morally repulsive, imo, much like we don't imprison people whom are innocent. .

seems to me....no one is above the law.....
so yeah.....no respecter of peson

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

I might suggest .....the people of Mexico do not love their country
they would rather run from it

I've been there.
They seem to really like it.
But of course, it's not so great for all.

You are correct. Mexicans are proud, patriotic, and largely uninterested in living in America. Those that go there do so for economic opportunity, send their money back home to Mexico, and return as soon as they can, where they are celebrated by their families.

How do I know? I bought a home in Mexico in 2005 and moved into it in 2009 upon retirement, where I have lived continuously since..I much prefer my Mexican life to the American life I left behind. I understand that I don't live a typical Mexican life and can't speak for those that grew up here, and that the presence of so many foreigners creates extra economic opportunities for the locals, but my Mexican neighbors are obviously happy people.

This is our village. It's a very peaceful, beautiful place:

I can't picture myself illegally crossing a border
live almost in secret

Many of my American neighbors are here in Mexico illegally. Most of them entered legally on tourist visas, and then never bothered to renew them. These days, we're seeing a huge influx of American expatriates, mainly for the favorable weather and the low cost of living, but also due to loss of interest in American life. Recently arrived Americans generally take from 1-3 years to decompress from the constant bickering and fear-mongering.

 

[Revoltingest]

You are correct. Mexicans are proud, patriotic, and largely uninterested in living in America. Those that go there do so for economic opportunity, send their money back home to Mexico, and return as soon as they can, where they are celebrated by their families.

How do I know? I bought a home in Mexico in 2005 and moved into it in 2009 upon retirement, where I have lived continuously since..I much prefer my Mexican life to the American life I left behind. I understand that I don't live a typical Mexican life and can't speak for those that grew up here, and that the presence of so many foreigners creates extra economic opportunities for the locals, but my Mexican neighbors are obviously happy people.

This is our village. It's a very peaceful, beautiful place:

View attachment 20298

View attachment 20299



Many of my American neighbors are here in Mexico illegally. Most of them entered legally on tourist visas, and then never bothered to renew them. These days, we're seeing a huge influx of American expatriates, mainly for the favorable weather and the low cost of living, but also due to loss of interest in American life. Recently arrived Americans generally take from 1-3 years to decompress from the constant bickering and fear-mongering.

The snowboarding looks terrible there.
I'm retiring in Michiganistan.
(The snowboarding sux slightly less here.)

 

[Thief]

You are correct. Mexicans are proud, patriotic, and largely uninterested in living in America. Those that go there do so for economic opportunity, send their money back home to Mexico, and return as soon as they can, where they are celebrated by their families.

How do I know? I bought a home in Mexico in 2005 and moved into it in 2009 upon retirement, where I have lived continuously since..I much prefer my Mexican life to the American life I left behind. I understand that I don't live a typical Mexican life and can't speak for those that grew up here, and that the presence of so many foreigners creates extra economic opportunities for the locals, but my Mexican neighbors are obviously happy people.

This is our village. It's a very peaceful, beautiful place:

View attachment 20298

View attachment 20299



Many of my American neighbors are here in Mexico illegally. Most of them entered legally on tourist visas, and then never bothered to renew them. These days, we're seeing a huge influx of American expatriates, mainly for the favorable weather and the low cost of living, but also due to loss of interest in American life. Recently arrived Americans generally take from 1-3 years to decompress from the constant bickering and fear-mongering.

Thank you.....well posted

would you be opposed to annexing Mexico?
assuming you think border crossing is the norm

 

[metis]

I much prefer my Mexican life to the American life I left behind.

My wife is from Italy, and one of her uncles lived for a while in Argentina, and he felt the same way as you do. He loved it there, people being so friendly and respectful, but he came back to live here in the States because of family.

 

[Nous]

My experience suggests that the average Mexican street hustler is seemingly smarter and more informed than the average American high school graduate--possibly such as even in basic math. I'd say likewise about all of Latin America that I've visited.

BTW, the article "el" does not belong in front of Mexico.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Thank you.....well posted

would you be opposed to annexing Mexico?
assuming you think border crossing is the norm

Thanks for the kind words.

Annexing Mexico might be helpful for the average Mexican growing up in Mexico, but wouldn't do anything for us except subject us to American jurisdiction and law again. For example, we can buy most pharmaceuticals over the counter without a prescription, which is nice.

We already have access to all of the American culture we care to partake of. We have Amazon delivery, satellite radio and TV, Internet, bootleg DVDs for about two dollars apiece, a Walmart, a Dominoes pizza, and a Subway (sandwiches).

But we are concerned about modernization. Village life is pretty nice. We walk almost everywhere, and the little driving we do is very little. We've put bout 15,000 miles on our vehicle in 9 years. More traffic and more traffic lights are undesirable.

An interesting phenomenon is the Americanization of Mexican holidays thanks to retail outlets like Walmart. Mexican Christmas is a desert holiday - camels, Magi, and mangers - but is gradually transitioning into a snow holiday with Christmas lights and trees, Santa, reindeer, etc..

Likewise with the Day of the Dead celebration, a celebration of the memories of the deceased. Every year, we see more trick-or-treaters.

I would worry that Mexico merging with the States would accelerate that process.

My wife is from Italy, and one of her uncles lived for a while in Argentina, and he felt the same way as you do. He loved it there, people being so friendly and respectful, but he came back to live here in the States because of family.

Regarding Latin America, Argentina is a popular American expat destination, as are Costa Rica and Ecuador. And I've heard of a few who went to Panama and Beliz and were apparently happy.

America is a good place to get an education and to make a living, but once those aren't factors, it comes down to culture, climate, life style, and the cost of living. Life improved in all of those areas upon relocation.

Spoiler: description of life here

For example, our home is on a mountain lake a mile up in the Sierra Nevadas, and we have a very temperate climate despite our more equatorial latitude. It never snows here, and is rarely 90 degrees - usually in the 70's - so we have and need no central air or heat.

The cost of living is very low. The two of us spend about $20,000 a year in total, a number kept low by not having to make a mortgage or rent payment, a car payment, credit card payments, or even a power bill (we get about 2000 hours of high sunshine a year - perfect for solar panels). Our social security checks more than cover that.

And in addition, we are getting about 8% interest on our savings, which are in government insured CDs (the Mexican equivalent), meaning that we can live well without touching our savings, savings that are actually growing.

Taxes are low (about $100/yr for our property tax). We're not supporting a massive military or servicing the interest on a large debt.

We have former neighbors that returned to Canada (near Toronto, I believe) two years ago to be with grandchildren. They're here for a few months, and we are now once again having breakfast together every Sunday morning on the plaza. They report that dinner for two in a good, non-chain restaurant with appetizer and a drink or two each runs around $150, meaning that they go out much less than they did when they were our neighbors. My omelette, hash brown, toast, and coffee last Sunday was about $3. Our check for two was about $7.

There are benefits to living such a simple life in a country with very little government. We see horses walking down our cobblestone street, hear burros braying, sheep bleating, and roosters clucking from our home (not to mention church bells), and can walk to about five good restaurants and ten mediocre ones in less than ten minutes. We shop on foot buying our produce in one place and meat in another, for example, which is all locally raised.

In any event, this new life suits us very well at this juncture of our lives.

 

[Thief]

My experience suggests that the average Mexican street hustler is seemingly smarter and more informed than the average American high school graduate--possibly such as even in basic math. I'd say likewise about all of Latin America that I've visited.

BTW, the article "el" does not belong in front of Mexico.

thank you....I forgot my Spanish lesson

 

[Thief]

the culture is going to blend.....no matter what
Mexico is going to disappear

the culture will blend first in the states
taken home by border crossings

in the meantime......politics and border war

I've seen some documentaries about the crossings
seems the immigrants drop their exhausted supplies on private property
and the land owner is fined 500dollars for the garbage
not good for acceptance of foreigners

and many people die making the trip over the line
many more hand over all they have in cash, hoping the 'coyote' will keep his promise

I've seen a line of illegals ziplocked wrist to wrist and escorted out, where I used to work
they were all using the same social security number


I think we need to negotiate a new type of border
and send the dreamers home

If they want what America has to offer.....the problem is in Mexico

 

[Buddha Dharma]

i think we need an North and South American union, borders are obsolete

I fully agree. A North American Union would be a reassurance after so much bad policy.

 

[Buddha Dharma]

I thought Israel was already the 51st state.
Tom

With all the federal assistance they receive, you would think so.

 

[columbus]

many people die making the trip over the line
many more hand over all they have in cash, hoping the 'coyote' will keep his promise

I think we need to negotiate a new type of border

How about one that applies to US citizens?
We decide how many people we will give jobs to, give that many green cards, and prosecute people who give away more jobs than that.

What is the problem with a border policy that applies to us?
Tom

 

[Thief]

How about one that applies to US citizens?
We decide how many people we will give jobs to, give that many green cards, and prosecute people who give away more jobs than that.

What is the problem with a border policy that applies to us?
Tom

we don't seem able to guard it

 

[columbus]

we don't seem able to guard it

Because we don't want it guarded. We, as a society, want a bunch of cheap disposable labor.
If we started prosecuting criminal employers the problem would be resolved in short order.
Tom

 

[Thief]

Because we don't want it guarded. We, as a society, want a bunch of cheap disposable labor.
If we started prosecuting criminal employers the problem would be resolved in short order.
Tom

I agree
and I've immigrants cuffed and carted away

but the lure is extensive

shall we jail the employers?