Everyday Biphobia

[Uberpod]

Is this Biphobic: Female bisexuals clearly exist but there is a real question whether male bisexuals do. Males seem to have a predominant preference of male or female with some having a very mild reactivity beyond their general tendency.

 

[LuisDantas]

Sorry.

 

[LuisDantas]

Is this Biphobic: Female bisexuals clearly exist but there is a real question whether male bisexuals do. Males seem to have a predominant preference of male or female with some having a very mild reactivity beyond their general tendency.

It seems clear to me that male bisexuals do in fact exist. It would be odd if they did not.

 

[Uberpod]

It seems clear to me that male bisexuals do in fact exist. It would be odd if they did not.

This is interesting: http://www.susiebright.blogs.com/BiMen.pdf

 

[Revoltingest]

It seems clear to me that male bisexuals do in fact exist. It would be odd if they did not.

I've found an easy way to deal with all the diversity of humans:
Whatever people tell me about themselves, I take'm at their word. Straight, bi, trans, gay, etc.....they best understand who they are. Perhaps some will change over time, but at any point in time, they are who they are. Judgement? The only morality issue for me is whether one minds one's own business...& not mine.

Caution:
I don't believe everything I'm told. There's my ex-maintenance guy who did under-water salvage of alien technology in the Navy.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

This is interesting: http://www.susiebright.blogs.com/BiMen.pdf

Genital arousal is not synonymous with sexual arousal. People can become sexually aroused by things that are not genitals, and some people (homo/bi/hetero) are turned off by the appearance of genitals. Also, an erection is not the best way to measure arousal, as erections can happen without sexual arousal and sexual arousal may not always produce a full erection. Nullos also make this very complicated, as these are men who sometimes report having sexual arousal and even report a feeling of sexual climax, despite the fact they do not have a penis or testicles.
And let's be honest, it's silly to try to measure sexual arousal in a lab setting.

 

[LuisDantas]

some people (homo/bi/hetero) are turned off by the appearance of genitals.

(Raises hand)

 

[Drolefille]

This is interesting: http://www.susiebright.blogs.com/BiMen.pdf

Read the "Discussion" portion at the bottom for some rather specific analysis of the reasons why the results may have shown the way they did. Additionally there is a phenomena where gay men will sometimes identify as bisexual prior to coming out as gay. This would fall under the "non-sexual" reasons for identification under the Discussion section and might influence how the person identified. It would be interesting to see if the results changed if people were classified based not just on identification but past sexual activity if this would change things.

This pattern of "progressing" from bisexual to gay identified is one of the reasons for bi-erasure. Guys who are actually bisexual (and I've met them, they do exist) get accused of being gay.

There's a lot of anecdata that women are more sexually fluid then men but I've not really seen that backed up scientifically.

 

[Drolefille]

Genital arousal is not synonymous with sexual arousal. People can become sexually aroused by things that are not genitals, and some people (homo/bi/hetero) are turned off by the appearance of genitals. Also, an erection is not the best way to measure arousal, as erections can happen without sexual arousal and sexual arousal may not always produce a full erection. Nullos also make this very complicated, as these are men who sometimes report having sexual arousal and even report a feeling of sexual climax, despite the fact they do not have a penis or testicles.
And let's be honest, it's silly to try to measure sexual arousal in a lab setting.

I agree except that I do believe it is possible to measure sexual arousal in a lab setting, just that extrapolating it isn't always going to be the same as real world experience.

Genitals can look hilarious or hot or kinda gross or beautiful and all of the above at the same time.

 

[Uberpod]

Genital arousal is not synonymous with sexual arousal. People can become sexually aroused by things that are not genitals, and some people (homo/bi/hetero) are turned off by the appearance of genitals.

Genital arousal does not refer to being aroused by genitals, it refers the genitals being aroused -- tumescence of males and lubrication by women. It is synonymous with physical sexual arousal.

Also, an erection is not the best way to measure arousal, as erections can happen without sexual arousal and sexual arousal may not always produce a full erection.

This is the best measure of sexual attraction, though not perfect. It usually correlates highly with self-report, but not in this case.

Nullos also make this very complicated, as these are men who sometimes report having sexual arousal and even report a feeling of sexual climax, despite the fact they do not have a penis or testicles.

Low occurring phenomena do not suggest that the overall paradigm is not valuable.

And let's be honest, it's silly to try to measure sexual arousal in a lab setting.

That is a ridiculous statement. It obviously worked!! Watching porn can occur anywhere nowadays.

 

[illykitty]

Never experienced it personally as I am in a straight relationship and I'm not open about my bisexuality irl (apart from my husband knowing).

But I have read a lot of things online that were bi-phobic, such as females claim to be bi for male attention (because it's "hot", a straight male fantasy), that there's no such thing as bi, etc.

None of it was aimed at me specifically but it's slightly frustrating to be dismissed so easily... It really puzzles me.

 

[Uberpod]

Contrast male bisexuals to female bisexuals: In similar studies most women who said they were bisexual showed arousal to men and to women.

 

[Drolefille]

Contrast male bisexuals to female bisexuals: In similar studies most women who said they were bisexual showed arousal to men and to women.

So did you read my response at all? Because you ignored it and I addressed this. There are easily some issues with selection as well as labeling AND they acknowledge other possibilities. It isn't so simple as to say "They don't exist." especially as I've met some myself.

 

[Drolefille]

 

[Uberpod]

So did you read my response at all? Because you ignored it and I addressed this. There are easily some issues with selection as well as labeling AND they acknowledge other possibilities. It isn't so simple as to say "They don't exist." especially as I've met some myself.

Lesbians can also perch awhile in the bisexual category just like gay men. I do not see where you explained the difference. In grappling with non-heterosexual identity there are some gay vs lesbian differences. Some gay men deny they are gay because they did not fall in love with a man only fooled around. Early lesbians may say the opposite: I love my female best friend in a very special way, but I am not lesbian because I don't want sex with her. In all three strategies people try to hold onto a piece of heterosexuality instead of admitting applicability to a more stigmatized group, ie homosexuality. Given the cover strategies ie people lie to themselves, how can you be sure self described male bisexuals are actually bisexuals for the long haul?

 

[Drolefille]

A criticism of biphobia/erasure in the lesbian community.

What lesbians think of bisexual women:

(She apologized for this video actually.)

What gay men think of bisexual men:

 

[Drolefille]

Lesbians can also perch awhile in the bisexual category just like gay men. I do not see where you explained the difference. In grappling with non-heterosexual identity there are some gay vs lesbian differences. Some gay men deny they are gay because they did not fall in love with a man only fooled around. Early lesbians may say the opposite: I love my female best friend in a very special way, but I am not lesbian because I don't want sex with her. In all three strategies people try to hold onto a piece of heterosexuality instead of admitting applicability to a more stigmatized group, ie homosexuality. Given the cover strategies ie people lie to themselves, how can you be sure self described male bisexuals are actually bisexuals for the long haul?

Because there is a different social acceptance of male and female homosexuality and bisexuality. There isn't a documented phenomena of women identifying as bisexual as ONLY a stepping stone, not as an accurate identity. Previous studies of bisexual men picked guys from gay bars or HIV clinics. Again, not exactly the best place to find strictly bisexual men. The social perspective on non-straight men is much harsher than on non-straight women. Stepping out of the bounds of heterosexuality for men is physically dangerous in a way that does occur among women but IMO is much riskier for men.

Anecdotally I know quite a few male bisexuals who ARE bisexual for the long haul. So I know they exist. Pansexual guys who are sexually and romantically active with men and women at the same time are proof of it. But this fits into bisexual erasure, we assume that if a guy settles down with a girl or a guy he must be straight or gay, this occurs for women as well (but the initial bisexuality is more accepted by society.). Sexuality also does change, someone may be attracted to multiple genders for a while and then only one gender later for multiple reasons - negative experiences, social pressure, or a change in interest. Sexuality being innate and uncontrollable doesn't necessarily mean it's static for everyone.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Lesbians can also perch awhile in the bisexual category just like gay men. I do not see where you explained the difference. In grappling with non-heterosexual identity there are some gay vs lesbian differences. Some gay men deny they are gay because they did not fall in love with a man only fooled around. Early lesbians may say the opposite: I love my female best friend in a very special way, but I am not lesbian because I don't want sex with her. In all three strategies people try to hold onto a piece of heterosexuality instead of admitting applicability to a more stigmatized group, ie homosexuality. Given the cover strategies ie people lie to themselves, how can you be sure self described male bisexuals are actually bisexuals for the long haul?

How can you be sure they aren't? Looks like we just have to take their word for it.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

It's exactly what I first posted in this thread. People hold disdain and hatred towards transsexuals, and then want to get all up in our business about our sexuality and our genitals. This is not only rude to do to transsexuals, but is rude and impolite to do to anyone.

FWIW, I wasn't asking you about your genitals. I was asking someone who had been with a transsexual to tell me what it was like. Since it's a public forum you just happened to hear the conversation. If I offended the person I asked then I apologize.

 

[Drolefille]

FWIW, I wasn't asking you about your genitals. I was asking someone who had been with a transsexual to tell me what it was like. Since it's a public forum you just happened to hear the conversation. If I offended the person I asked then I apologize.

It was off topic to begin with. I'd add on there that you seem completely oblivious to the point @Shadow Wolf was making - that you have posted your "distaste" for transgender women, calling them gay men, and then as she put it "got all up in their business" by asking about their genitals. Trans women are not a sideshow act for you to be grossed out by and then ask rude questions about.

And besides if you said something rude in public, and someone was offended, would you actually respond "Hey lady, you just overheard a public conversation, I'll only apologize to the guy I was talking to, not to you." I rather hope you wouldn't and I know it doesn't live up to the values you claim to believe in. Either live by those values to the T or stop judging others who don't. Hypocrisy is the worst answer.