Evidence of Koran's validity?

[Snowber]

Peace to both of you brothers, we come from One and the same.

The authors of the Koran understood the Holy Bible to be 100% valid.

GOD was the author of the Qu'ran, GOD's Gospel and Torah that he sent to Jesus and Moses is 100% valid, today's however, is not.


Please show me where the Koran ever claims to be divinely inspired.

Good luck...

I'm not sure what the goal of this is since there are plenty of verses, here's a couple:

[10:37] This Quran could not possibly be authored by other than GOD. It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture. It is infallible, for it comes from the Lord of the universe.

[11:1] A.L.R. This is a scripture whose verses have been perfected, then elucidated. It comes from a Most Wise, Most Cognizant.


[17:85] They ask you about the revelation. Say, "The revelation comes from my Lord. The knowledge given to you is minute."

Jesus is the only begotten Son of God.

Even the authors of the Koran understood this...

The Qu'ran had one author, GOD. Saying Jesus is GOD's only begotten son is not only a blasphemy (which Jesus will bear witness against all Christians who believe this on the Day of Ressurection) but also a contradiction to the Bible itself. Here is a short answer to this that comes from "Jesus: Myths and Message" by Lisa Spray. You may also be interested in "The Myth of GOD incarnate" written by some excellent Christian scholars who have come to the conclusion that Jesus was NOT the blood son of GOD. GOD forbid.

What about those Biblical references to Jesus as the `only' son of God, or even `the only begotten son'?

The most prominent verse concerning Jesus' sonship to God, and the most frequently quoted, is John 3:16:

Yes, God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him may not die but may have eternal life. [John 3:16]

There are only three other verses, significantly also in the Gospel of John, that refer to Jesus as the only son. They are John 1:14 and 18, and John 3:18:

The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us, and we have seen his glory: the glory of an only Son coming from the Father, filled with enduring love. [John 1:14]

No one has ever seen God. It is the only Son, ever at the Father's side, who has revealed him. [John 1:18]

Whoever believes in him avoids condemnation, but whoever does not believe is already condemned for not believing in the name of God's only Son. [John 3:18]

It is extremely important to realize that the Gospels of Matthew, Mark and Luke never state that Jesus was God's only son. This is even more significant when we realize that the Gospel of John was the last Gospel written.

According to the translators of THE NEW AMERICAN BIBLE, the Gospels of Matthew and Mark were written shortly after the year 70 A.D., and the Gospel of Luke is dated to "approximately 75 A.D." The Gospel of John was the last, written between 90 and 100 A.D., at a time when we know the doctrine of Jesus' divinity was already well established. This fact is demonstrated by Bishop Ignatius' quote at the beginning of Chapter Four.

GOSPEL OF JOHN

In Chapter Two we discussed who actually wrote the Gospel of John. Because of its importance in the present discussion, let me recap: In their Introduction to the Books of the New Testament the translators of THE NEW AMERICAN BIBLE present the almost universally accepted theory that the Gospel of John was written by someone other than John, probably a disciple, and then edited later by another disciple (Ibid., p. xxxvii).

References to inconsistencies within the Gospel of John are made by the same translators:

However, more and more students of this gospel are coming to believe that ... inconsistencies were probably produced by subsequent editing in which homogeneous materials were added to a shorter original. Other difficulties for the theory of eyewitness authorship are presented by the gospel's highly developed theology, and by certain elements of its literary style. For instance, some of the miracles of Jesus have been worked into highly dramatic scenes (ch 9); there has been a careful attempt to have the miracles followed by discourses which explain them (chs 5 and 6); the sayings of Jesus have been woven into long discourses of a quasi-poetic form resembling the speeches of personified Wisdom in the Old Testament. (THE NEW AMERICAN BIBLE, p. xxxvii)

In other words, the Gospel of John was written not so much to present the historical facts about the life of Jesus Christ, but to present and explain already established dogma. Translators also note special problems in translating the Gospel of John:

The Gospel according to John comprises a special case. Absolute fidelity to his technique of reiterated phrasing would result in an assault on the English ear that would be almost unendurable. Yet the softening of the vocal effect by substitution of other words and phrases would destroy the effectiveness of his poetry. Again, resort is had to compromise. (THE NEW AMERICAN BIBLE, p. xxxvii)

In John 1:14 and 18 and John 3:16 and 18, the word `only' directly contradicts the numerous assertions that all righteous people are sons of God, and the Biblical references to others, like Israel, as God's first-born son.

Paul himself did not believe Jesus to be God's begotten son. In Romans he explains that Jesus was "descended from David according to the flesh" and then "made son of God in power according to the spirit of holiness..." (Romans 1:3-4). The NEW AMERICAN BIBLE has a footnote saying that the later phrase could also be translated as "was declared" or "was proclaimed the powerful son of God."

Whether Jesus was made, declared or proclaimed the son, this is clearly a different kind of sonship, one we can all strive for.

Only two verses before the description of Jesus as God's only son in John 3:16, the gospel's author calls Jesus Son of Man.

In fact this whole section of verses needs to be examined together:

Just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the desert, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that all who believe may have eternal life in him. Yes, God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him may not die but may have eternal life. God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him avoids condemnation,but whoever does not believe is already condemned for not believing in the name of God's only Son. [John 3:14-18]

For the whole book see:

Jesus: Myths and Message

The Bible is divine, the Qu'ran is not; just like the Book of Mormon. This is easy to prove in the spiritual ways the Bible is written. I ask my Muslin brother's to expalin to me what is divine or spiritual about the Qu'ran. I will give my answer shortly.

The Qu'ran is from GOD, that's enough spirituality for me. Seeing spirituality in any Scripture is objective. Here you have physical proof in the Qu'ran mathematically and scientifically. Instead, we follow what our parents taught us, even though they may be wrong. It's a shame =/

Peace.

 

[Luminous]

all your books are worthless Idols that make God cry tears of sadness for the vast stupidity of humanity and continued idolization of material things.

Certainty is the culprit

Once, in a great Caliphate:
All the philosophers, divines, and doctors of the law were assembled in court for the trial of Professor Nasruddin. The accusation was a serious one; he had been going from town to town saying, “Your so-called religious leaders are ignorant and confused!” So he was charged with heresy, the penalty for which was death.

“You may speak first,” said the Caliph.
The Professor was perfectly self-possessed. “Have paper and pens brought in,” he said, “and give them to the ten wisest men in this august assembly.”
To Nasruddin’s amusement, a great squabble broke out among the holy men as to who was the wisest among them. When the contention died down and each of the chosen ten was equipped with paper and pen, the Professor said,”Have each of them write down the answer to the following question: WHAT IS MATTER MADE OF?”
The answers were written down and handed to the Caliph who read them out. One said, “it is made of nothing.” Another said, “Molecules.” Yet another, “Energy.” Others, “Light,” “I do not know,” “Metaphysical Being” and so on.
Said The Professor to the Caliph, “When they come to an agreement on what matter is, they will be fit to judge questions of the spirit. Is it not strange that they cannot agree on something that they themselves are made of, yet they shall be unanimous in their verdict that I am a heretic?”

-It is not the diversity of our dogmas
But our dogmatism itself
That does the damage.
Thus, if each of us did what we are firmly persuaded
Is the will of God
The result would be utter chaos.
Certainty is the culprit.
The spiritual person knows uncertainty-
A state of mind unknown to the religious fanatic.

 

[kejos]

some excellent Christian scholars who have come to the conclusion that Jesus was NOT the blood son of GOD.

It is a myth that Christians believe that. The phrase 'Son of God' does not have any sense of progeny. It means 'son' in the sense of 'manifestation'. So Jesus was God himself, God in human form- obviously not the supernal deity whom mere mortals cannot experience.

There is just one deity, or Allah. Allah came to earth in the form of Jesus of Nazareth, lived a perfect life, despite temptation, and died for the sins of all, so that, like Abraham, all could be considered righteous and acceptable by faith in him. No amount of praying, fasting or pilgrimage can make up for even one 'small' sin; but faith in Jesus 'wipes out' all our sins.

 

[Benoni]

It is a myth that Christians believe that. The phrase 'Son of God' does not have any sense of progeny. It means 'son' in the sense of 'manifestation'. So Jesus was God himself, God in human form- obviously not the supernal deity whom mere mortals cannot experience.

There is just one deity, or Allah. Allah came to earth in the form of Jesus of Nazareth, lived a perfect life, despite temptation, and died for the sins of all, so that, like Abraham, all could be considered righteous and acceptable by faith in him. No amount of praying, fasting or pilgrimage can make up for even one 'small' sin; but faith in Jesus 'wipes out' all our sins.

Muslin cannot have faith in Jesus until God calls them first.

 

[Benoni]

Peace to both of you brothers, we come from One and the same.





The Qu'ran had one author, GOD. Saying Jesus is GOD's only begotten son is not only a blasphemy (which Jesus will bear witness against all Christians who believe this on the Day of Ressurection) but also a contradiction to the Bible itself. Here is a short answer to this that comes from "Jesus: Myths and Message" by Lisa Spray. You may also be interested in "The Myth of GOD incarnate" written by some excellent Christian scholars who have come to the conclusion that Jesus was NOT the blood son of GOD. GOD forbid.



For the whole book see:

Jesus: Myths and Message



The Qu'ran is from GOD, that's enough spirituality for me. Seeing spirituality in any Scripture is objective. Here you have physical proof in the Qu'ran mathematically and scientifically. Instead, we follow what our parents taught us, even though they may be wrong. It's a shame =/

Peace.

I asked in a earlier post what makes the Quran divine? The Bible is divine and I can prove it. So if the Quran is divine please show us. It Allah is God then his Quran must be divine. I will show you want I mean once I get an answer.

 

[Benoni]

Now I am asking my Christian brother's and sisters the same question. We can exchange apples an oranges all day long with our Muslim believers; but what makes the Bible divine and the book or mormon and the quran just another man made religious book?

 

[DeitySlayer]

I asked in a earlier post what makes the Quran divine? The Bible is divine and I can prove it. So if the Quran is divine please show us. It Allah is God then his Quran must be divine. I will show you want I mean once I get an answer.

This will be like two supertankers repeatedly slamming into each other. Both of you will start trying to argue from evidence, but eventually resort to random interpretations and personal belief.

 

[Benoni]

This will be like two supertankers repeatedly slamming into each other. Both of you will start trying to argue from evidence, but eventually resort to random interpretations and personal belief.

Nice opinion; but it will not happen. Yousee the Bible is divine and the Quran is n ot. it is that simple. But I am giving everyone 24 hrs.

 

[Snowber]

I asked in a earlier post what makes the Quran divine? The Bible is divine and I can prove it. So if the Quran is divine please show us. It Allah is God then his Quran must be divine. I will show you want I mean once I get an answer.

Peace everyone,

What makes the Qu'ran divine is the same reason the original Bible was divine, it came from a divine Being.

If you need more evidence, the first post is one place to start. If you need more

Like the Quran itself, the Quran's mathematical Miracle ranges from the very simple , to the very complex. The simple facts are those observations that can be
ascertained without using any tools. The complex facts require the assistance of a calculator or a computer.
The following facts do not require any tools to be verified, but please remember they all refer to the original Arabic text:

1- The first verse 1:1 known as "Basmalla" consists of 19 letters.

2-This verse was revealed to Muhammed after 74:30, which states
"Over it is 19". not a coincidence.

3-The Quran consists of 114 suras, which is 19X6.

4-The total number of verses in the Quran is 6346, or 19X334 (6234 numbered
verses and 112 unnumbered verses (Basmalla). 6234+112=6346. notice also that 6+3+4+6= 19

5-The Basmalla occurs in the Quran 114 times, despite its conspicuous absence
from Sura 9 (it occurs twice in Sura 27) and 114 = 19 X 6

6-From the missing Basmalla of Sura 9 to the extra Basmalla of Sura 27, there are precisely 19 Suras.

7-It follows that the total of the sura numbers from 9 to 27 9+10+11+12..... . +26+27) is 342, or 19X 18

8-This total (342) also equals the number of words between the two Basmallas of
sura 27. and 342 = 19X18

9-The famous first revelation (96:1-5) consists of 19 words.

10-This 19-worded first revelation consists of 76 letters, & 76=19X4

11-Sura 96, first in the chronological sequence, consists of 19 verses.

12-This first Chronological sura is placed atop the last 19 suras.

13-Sura 96 consists of 304 Arabic letters and 304 = 19X16

14-The last revelation (Sura 110) consists of 19 words.

15-14 different Arabic letters, form 14 different sets of "Quranic Initials" (Such as
A.L.M., of 2:1) and prefix 29 suras.These numbers add up to 14+14+29=57 19 X 3

16-The total of the 29 sura numbers where the Quranic initials occur is 2+3+7....+50+68=822, and 822 +14 (14 sets of initials)=836 =19X44

17-Between the first intialed Sura (Sura 2) and the last intialed Sura (Sura 68)
there are 38 un-initialed suras , 38=19X2

18-Between the first and last initialed sura there are 19 sets of alternating
"initialed" and "uninitialed" Suras,

19-The Quran mention 30 different whole numbers throughout,
1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,19,20,30,40,50,60,70,80,99,100,200,300,1000,2000,
3000,5000,50,000, & 100,000.
The sum of these numbers is 162146 = 19X8534

The following 2 facts may need some help with a calculator.

20- The word God (ALLAH) occurs throughout the Quran in its 114 Suras
2698 times and 2698= 19X142.

21-The number of verses where the word God occurs add up to 118123
also a multiple of 19, = 19X6217

22-The Quran's dominant message is that there is only "ONE GOD"
The word 'One", in Arabic "Wahid" in reference to God occurs 19 times
throughout the Quran.

23-The word "Wahid" itself, (one) has a numerical value of 19. W=6, A=1, H=8, D= 4. These are a well known values.

24-The word "Quran" occurs in the Quran 58 times, with one of them referring to
"another Quran" in 10:15, therefore, if excluded, the frequency of "this Quran" in
the Quran is 57, or 19X3

25- The first Pillar of Islam is stated in 3:18 as "La Elaaha Ella Hoo".(There is no
other God besides Him). This most important expression occurs in 19 suras.

If more is needed:

ONE is GOD

And then if that's not enough:

Initials prefixing Chapters of the Qu'ran, a Divine Message

That one is a long one and might not be read so I will give a summary. In the Qu'ran there are 29 initialed Suras, or chapter, in the Qu'ran. This means that 29 chapters start out something like "A.L.M" or "Q." or "T.H.". Until VERY recently (70's-80's) it was hypothesized what these meant, but not until now do we truly know by GOD's infinite mercy.

Now before I mention the amazing miracle that comes with this, remember that it comes from a Scripture 1400 years ago. It would be impossible for them to have counted all these occurrences and unravel the miracle in their day.

I will be introducing one part of this miracle, but there is even more to it if you read the links given. For each Sura prefixed by certain initials, for example the easiest one to count and verify is Sura 50, Q. It is prefixed by the letter Q.

[50:1] Q., and the glorious Quran.*

If you count all the Q's in the chapter you will get a number divisible by 19.

Now it might not seem so amazing just for this particular chapter since it is shorter and it is easier to count the Q's. But imagine chapters prefixed with A.L.M in some of the longer Suras (chapters), and having to count each individual letter. This holds true for ALL prefixed Suras. That means that you will always get a number divisible by 19 when counting the letters mentioned within the prefixed Sura.

Here is just a glimpse of the mathematical miracle ONLY concerning the letter Q

Sura 50 is entitled "Q," prefixed with "Q," and the first verse reads, "Q, and the glorious Quran." This indicated that "Q" stands for "Quran," and the total number of Q's in the two Q-initialed suras represents the Quran's 114 suras (57+57 = 114 = 19x6). This idea was strengthened by the fact that "the Quran" occurs in the Quran 57 times.

The Quran is described in Sura "Q" as "Majid" (glorious), and the Arabic word "Majid" has a gematrical value of 57: M (40) + J (3) + I (10) + D (4) = 57.

Sura 42 consists of 53 verses, and 42 + 53 = 95 = 19x5.

Sura 50 consists of 45 verses, and 50 + 45 = 95, same total as in Sura 42.

By counting the letter "Q" in every "Verse 19" throughout the Quran, the total count comes to 76, 19x4. Here is a summary of the Q-related data:
1. The frequency of occurrence of "Q" in Sura "Q" (No. 50) is 57, 19x3.
2. The letter "Q" occurs in the other Q-initialed sura (No. 42) exactly the same number of times, 57.
3. The total occurrence of the letter "Q" in the two Q-initialed suras is 114, which equals the number of suras in the Quran.
4. "The Quran" is mentioned in the Quran 57 times.
5. The description of the Quran as "Majid" (Glorious) is correlated with the frequency of occurrence of the letter "Q" in each of the Q-initialed suras. The word "Majid" has a gematrical value of 57.
6. Sura 42 consists of 53 verses, and 42 + 53 is 95, or 19x5. 8.
7. Sura 50 consists of 45 verses, and 50 + 45 is also 95, 19x5.
8. The number of Q's in all verses numbered "19" throughout the Quran is 76, 19x4.

Because the miracle of the Qu'ran is mathematical, it is perpetual and verifiable. Jesus resurrecting the dead, by GOD's leave, Moses turning the staff into a serpent, were miracles "of their time". We now have our own miracle, and it is VERIFIABLE, PERPETUAL, AND PROOF for those who want to know GOD.

I hope this gives you a glimpse of GOD's infinite power. GOD does not choose a certain community and give them a scripture because they are necessarily "special", but it is an important test for everyone.

[3:19] The only religion approved by GOD is "Submission." Ironically, those who have received the scripture are the ones who dispute this fact, despite the knowledge they have received, due to jealousy. For such rejectors of GOD's revelations, GOD is most strict in reckoning.

[41:44] If we made it a non-Arabic Quran they would have said, "Why did it come down in that language?" Whether it is Arabic or non-Arabic, say, "For those who believe, it is a guide and healing. As for those who disbelieve, they will be deaf and blind to it, as if they are being addressed from faraway."

[54:25] "Did the message come down to him, instead of us? He is a flagrant liar."

We all want our own personal scripture, but this is not GOD's system. We must be tested, we must put aside our ego's and accept that all Scriptures came from GOD, not just the ones "we received".

Peace brothers.

 

[Bowman]

[10:37] This Quran could not possibly be authored by other than GOD. It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture. It is infallible, for it comes from the Lord of the universe.

The ayahs leading up to 10.37 are discussing “alhaqqi” (i.e. The Truth), of which we are told refers to only Jesus Christ (4.171).

This is fact.

Thus, 10.37 is also a continuation of a discussion of Jesus Christ, as thus…

وما كان هذا القرءان أن يفترى من دون الله ولكن تصديق الذي بين يديه وتفصيل الكتب لا ريب فيه من رب العلمين​

Wama kana hatha alqur-anu an yuftara min dooni Allahi walakin tasdeeqa allathee bayna yadayhi watafseela alkitabi la rayba feehi min rabbi alAAalameena

10.37 And that this was the collection, that fabricated one, from superior (to) “allah”, and but (a) confirmation (of) Him in His presence, and explaining The Book, no doubt in it, from the lord of the jinn and of mankind.



The first thing that we observe in this ayah is that the Koran (i.e. ‘the collection&#8217 is called a fabrication (yuftara) – which is in complete agreement with 16.101.

Further, this ayah states that ‘the collection’ is shown to be superior to “allah”, but still is a confirmation (tasdeeqa) of Him (allathee i.e. Jesus Christ) in His presence “bayna yadayhi”.

What this means is that while the Koran is admittedly a fabrication of the previous scriptures (i.e. it is not divine in any manner whatsoever), it still contains the Biblical message of Jesus Christ.

Further still, ‘the collection’ is said to explain (tafseela) The Book (alkitabi i.e. The Holy Bible) – of which, the Holy Bible is stated to contain no doubt whatsoever in it (la rayba feehi).

Finally, this ayah concludes with the admission that ‘the collection’ (i.e. the fabrication) is from “allah” lord of the jinn (demons).

Thus….no brother….this ayah does nothing to support the false Islamic claims that the Koran was divinely inspired.

It does, however, promote the divine origin of the Holy Bible, and The Truth of Jesus Christ.

 

[Bowman]

[11:1] A.L.R. This is a scripture whose verses have been perfected, then elucidated. It comes from a Most Wise, Most Cognizant.

Alif-lam-ra kitabun ohkimat ayatuhu thumma fussilat min ladun hakeemin khabeerin

'Kitabun' refers to the Holy Bible, brother.

[17:85] They ask you about the revelation. Say, "The revelation comes from my Lord. The knowledge given to you is minute."

Wayas-aloonaka AAani alrroohi quli alrroohu min amri rabbee wama ooteetum mina alAAilmi illa qaleelan

This is 'The Spirit' being discussed here...not 'revelation', brother...

 

[Bowman]

The Qu'ran had one author, GOD. Saying Jesus is GOD's only begotten son is not only a blasphemy (which Jesus will bear witness against all Christians who believe this on the Day of Ressurection) but also a contradiction to the Bible itself. Here is a short answer to this that comes from "Jesus: Myths and Message" by Lisa Spray. You may also be interested in "The Myth of GOD incarnate" written by some excellent Christian scholars who have come to the conclusion that Jesus was NOT the blood son of GOD. GOD forbid.

Turning our attention to one of the quintessential Koranic ayahs used by Muslims as evidence for their position, 4.171, we can use this same verse to undeniably demonstrate that Jesus Christ is the Son…



4.171


يأهل الكتب لا تغلوا في دينكم ولا تقولوا على الله
إلا الحق إنما المسيح عيسى ابن مريم رسول الله
وكلمته ألقيها إلى مريم وروح منه فءامنوا بالله
ورسله ولا تقولوا ثلثة انتهوا خيرا لكم إنما الله
إله وحد سبحنه أن يكون له ولد له ما في
السموت وما في الأرض وكفى بالله وكيلا

Ya ahla alkitabi la taghloo fee deenikum wala taqooloo AAala Allahi illa alhaqqa innama almaseehu AAeesa ibnu maryama rasoolu Allahi wakalimatuhu alqaha ila maryama waroohun minhu faaminoo biAllahi warusulihi wala taqooloo thalathatun intahoo khayran lakum innama Allahu ilahun wahidun subhanahu an yakoona lahu waladun lahu ma fee alssamawati wama fee al-ardi wakafa biAllahi wakeelan

4.171 You The Book's family, do not go beyond the limits in your faith, and they do not say on “allah” except The Truth (is) only The Messiah Jesus, Mary's son, “allah’s” messenger, and his Word, cast forth to her, Mary, and Spirit from him; so believe by “allah”, and his messengers, and they do not say "Three." Refrain (it is) certainly agreeable to you, only “allah” one god glory be to him, that He has certainly been his Son, truly His what is in the heavens and in the earth and He sufficed by “allah”, a witness.


Examining the words in question…


يكون = “yakoona”

“yakoona” definition:

Accusative case. He has been.

References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume eight, p. 3004
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar, pp. 500 -502
Concordance of the Koran, Gustav Flugel, p. 169






ل = “la”

“la” definition:

A prefixed affirmative particle, verily, surely, certainly, indeed, truly. Prefix: an affirmative intensifying particle, used as a corroborative. A preposition denoting possession. It is also used as a preposition expressing attribution, design. Inseparable adverbial particle.

References:
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar pp. 504 - 505
A Grammar of the Arabic Language, W. Wright, Third edition, volume 1, p. 282
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 129






ه = “hu”

“hu” definition:

An indeclinable affixed personal or possessive pronoun of third person singular masculine; when affixed to a verb or preposition as a person pronoun, it means him or it; and when to a noun as a possessive, his or it. Singular personal or possessive pronoun. Him. Verbal suffix which expresses the accusative.

References:
A Grammar of the Arabic Language, W. Wright, Third edition, volume 1, p. 100
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 152



Observe that there are no negatives in this phrase at all….only the affirmative…


Thus…


له = “la” + “hu” = “lahu” = certainly his





And the final word under consideration…





ولد = “waladun”

“waladun” definition:

Noun. Singular and plural. A child, son, daughter, youngling, or young one: and children, sons, daughters, offspring, young, or younglings,: of any kind: often applied to an unborn child, etc, a fetus.

It comes from the root “walada”, which means she (a woman, or mother, or any animal having an ear, as distinguished from one having merely an ear-hole) brought forth a child, or young one; or children, young, or offspring; to beget, give birth. He begot a child, or young one, etc.

References:
An Arabic-English Lexicon, E.W. Lane, volume eight, pp. 2966 - 2968
The Dictionary of the Holy Qur’an, 1st edition, Abdul Mannan Omar, pp. 620 - 621
A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran, John Penrice, p. 162





Putting it all together we have….



….. “He has certainly been his Son” ….

 

[Bowman]

If you count all the Q's in the chapter you will get a number divisible by 19.

19.19 has to be without a doubt the 'Holy Grail' of the #19 phenomenon...for in this verse it speaks of Jesus divinity!

This truly is a miracle!

 

[Benoni]

Peace everyone,

What makes the Qu'ran divine is the same reason the original Bible was divine, it came from a divine Being.

If you need more evidence, the first post is one place to start. If you need more



If more is needed:

ONE is GOD

And then if that's not enough:

Initials prefixing Chapters of the Qu'ran, a Divine Message

That one is a long one and might not be read so I will give a summary. In the Qu'ran there are 29 initialed Suras, or chapter, in the Qu'ran. This means that 29 chapters start out something like "A.L.M" or "Q." or "T.H.". Until VERY recently (70's-80's) it was hypothesized what these meant, but not until now do we truly know by GOD's infinite mercy.

Now before I mention the amazing miracle that comes with this, remember that it comes from a Scripture 1400 years ago. It would be impossible for them to have counted all these occurrences and unravel the miracle in their day.

I will be introducing one part of this miracle, but there is even more to it if you read the links given. For each Sura prefixed by certain initials, for example the easiest one to count and verify is Sura 50, Q. It is prefixed by the letter Q.


If you count all the Q's in the chapter you will get a number divisible by 19.

Now it might not seem so amazing just for this particular chapter since it is shorter and it is easier to count the Q's. But imagine chapters prefixed with A.L.M in some of the longer Suras (chapters), and having to count each individual letter. This holds true for ALL prefixed Suras. That means that you will always get a number divisible by 19 when counting the letters mentioned within the prefixed Sura.

Here is just a glimpse of the mathematical miracle ONLY concerning the letter Q



Because the miracle of the Qu'ran is mathematical, it is perpetual and verifiable. Jesus resurrecting the dead, by GOD's leave, Moses turning the staff into a serpent, were miracles "of their time". We now have our own miracle, and it is VERIFIABLE, PERPETUAL, AND PROOF for those who want to know GOD.

I hope this gives you a glimpse of GOD's infinite power. GOD does not choose a certain community and give them a scripture because they are necessarily "special", but it is an important test for everyone.



We all want our own personal scripture, but this is not GOD's system. We must be tested, we must put aside our ego's and accept that all Scriptures came from GOD, not just the ones "we received".

Peace brothers.

All this is coding; you can do that to a comic book. This is not what I am speaking of.

 

[Snowber]

Sorry Bowman,

I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry here with that kind of translation.

Look at the verses in question:

WebQT - ©2003 Submission.org

In 6 different translations (another post in the forum about best Qu'ran translation shows a link to something like 17 different translations, you can try that too).

The way you've translated all this makes no common sense, nor does it make sense the way it's being translated.

I understand different interpretations come about by different people, but it takes some serious change in interpretation to see things the way you have friend.

I did a google search, I'm guessing you're the two results from facebook that come up saying the same thing?

I never could, nor would, convince someone whose heart GOD has blinded because of his own ignorance.

Peace be upon you, take a look at the Bible and Qu'ran once more, there is a lot to learn dear Bowman.

 

[Bowman]

Sorry Bowman,

I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry here with that kind of translation.

Look at the verses in question:


In 6 different translations (another post in the forum about best Qu'ran translation shows a link to something like 17 different translations, you can try that too).

The way you've translated all this makes no common sense, nor does it make sense the way it's being translated.

I understand different interpretations come about by different people, but it takes some serious change in interpretation to see things the way you have friend.

I did a google search, I'm guessing you're the two results from facebook that come up saying the same thing?

I never could, nor would, convince someone whose heart GOD has blinded because of his own ignorance.

Peace be upon you, take a look at the Bible and Qu'ran once more, there is a lot to learn dear Bowman.

Which ayah would you like to discuss in detail, brother?

 

[Benoni]

I will start with the VAST majority of Christians and especially the soulish carnal world which include all God as not called yet... I will refer to this group as the “world. The Word of God (The Bible) I see; meaning those the Lord has called to see do not see the same Bible as the world does.

Matthew 13
13:13 Therefore I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand. 14 And in them the prophecy of Isaiah is fulfilled, which says: 'Hearing you will hear and shall not understand, And seeing you will see and not perceive; 15 For the hearts of this people have grown dull. Their ears are hard of hearing, And their eyes they have closed, Lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them.' 16 "But blessed are your eyes for they see, and your ears for they hear;

The Bible is full of hidden symbolisms to include spiritual number, precious jewels; directions, all with a hidden spiritual meaning. The number six was the day Adam was created, when ever the number six is written in the Bible is speaks of man's flesh. Be it Genesis or Revelation this is a divine pattern. Does ot matter how man men were inspired to write the Bible these multiple hidden patterns are there; but only for those who have eyes to see, and spiritual ears to hear. If you do not have this vision to see these which you won't unless God opens your spiritual eyes you will never see them.

Here are just a few examples.

First Adam-Second Adam;
First Covenant; Second covenant
First Resurrection-Second Resurrection;
law-grace.

All thought the OT the pattern was the second son that God blessed; never the first. This was mistake, but a spiritual pattern repeated over and over in scripture. Of course there we other patterns like David who was the seventh son; but seven speaks of divine completeness. That is why God bless Isaac over Ishmael; for God’s ways are never mans ways; man according to his earthy tradition would always choose the first son; Jesus was the second Adam which was always God’s plan.


Another one of these spiritual scriptural visions is spiritual patterns; take Adam; when he left the Garden of Eden he went eastward. East always spiritually speaks of going away from the presence of God; this being in the natural speaking of course of all the eastern religions to include Muslin’s or the realm of the spiritual are to the East.

Another one of these symbolisms in scripture is the “moon”. The moon is symbolic of a reflected light; in other words not the light. The religious realm is what the moon is symbolic of which is but a small reflection of the true light which is Christ Jesus who is God. In the Book of revelation the moon will turn dark. By the way I am not a Trinitarian.

The number five speaks of God’s grace and blessings, all thought out the Bible. God uses numbers to hide his deep things

 

[Luminous]

You people waste your time worshipping Idol scriptures from ignorant desert people who had nothing better to do with their time. While you dwelve deep in your idol scripture, you let God pass you by.

 

[Snowber]

Peace Bowman and everyone,

Let us start with your post yesterday talking about verse 10:37.

You started by saying:

The ayahs leading up to 10.37 are discussing “alhaqqi” (i.e. The Truth), of which we are told refers to only Jesus Christ (4.171).

This is fact.

You say this is a fact, but there is no evidence for this. The Qu'ran is clear that Jesus was NOT the son of GOD, nor part of a trinity. If you'd like I can post all the verses that would answer this for you.

4:171 says:

[4:171] O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion, and do not say about GOD except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was a messenger of GOD, and His word that He had sent to Mary, and a revelation from Him. Therefore, you shall believe in GOD and His messengers. You shall not say, "Trinity." You shall refrain from this for your own good. GOD is only one god. Be He glorified; He is much too glorious to have a son. To Him belongs everything in the heavens and everything on earth. GOD suffices as Lord and Master.

Obviously, this verse is against any mention of a "trinity" and divinity of Jesus. He was a blessed messenger, by GOD's will. At the same time, he worried about his own necks, because he was a human being, as all messengers are.

[21:25] We did not send any messenger before you except with the inspiration: "There is no god except Me; you shall worship Me alone."
[21:26] Yet, they said, "The Most Gracious has begotten a son!" Glory be to Him. All (messengers) are (His) honored servants.
[21:27] They never speak on their own, and they strictly follow His commands.
[21:28] He knows their future and their past. They do not intercede, except for those already accepted by Him, and they are worried about their own necks.
[21:29] If any of them claims to be a god beside Him, we requite him with Hell; we thus requite the wicked.

You then transliterated the verse below and showed an awkward English translation of it (which you do not find online except at 2 facebook pages (using a google search of part of the verse) which seems like it may be you doing the same translation for someone else. Deception will only win over the weak at heart, remember that.

Wama kana hatha alqur-anu an yuftara min dooni Allahi walakin tasdeeqa allathee bayna yadayhi watafseela alkitabi la rayba feehi min rabbi alAAalameena

10.37 And that this was the collection, that fabricated one, from superior (to) “allah”, and but (a) confirmation (of) Him in His presence, and explaining The Book, no doubt in it, from the lord of the jinn and of mankind.

I mentioned a link before where you can compare 6 different translations and none of them are close to your personal translation (as it seems) brother. I speak Arabic but I am weak on reading/writing so I apologize that I cannot guide you through it word by word.

The closest translation to yours comes from a site called islamawakened and translates it as:

And this the Koran was/is not that it be fabricated from (by) other than God, and but confirmation (of) what (is) between his (Prophet Mohammad's) hands, and detailing/explaining The Book , no doubt/suspicion in it, (it is) from the creations all together's/(universes') Lord.

Here are the other six translations:

Khalifa
This Quran could not possibly be authored by other than GOD. It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture. It is infallible, for it comes from the Lord of the universe.

Yusuf Ali
This Qur'an is not such as can be produced by other than God; on the contrary it is a confirmation of (revelations) that went before it, and a fuller explanation of the Book - wherein there is no doubt - from the Lord of the worlds.

Pickthal
And this Qur'an is not such as could ever be invented in despite of Allah; but it is a confirmation of that which was before it and an exposition of that which is decreed for mankind - Therein is no doubt - from the Lord of the Worlds.

Shakir
And this Quran is not such as could be forged by those besides Allah, but it is a verification of that which is before it and a clear explanation of the book, there is no doubt in it, from the Lord of the worlds.

Sher Ali
And this Qur'an is not such that could be produced by anyone other than Allah. On the contrary, it fulfils that revelation which is before it and is an exposition of the perfect Law. There is no doubt about it that it is from the Lord of all the worlds.

"Progressive Muslims"
This Quran could not have been produced without God, but it is to authenticate what is already present, and to give detail to the Scripture in which there is no doubt, from the Lord of the worlds.

Also I noticed you translated "min rabbi al Aalameena"

Which simply means "from the Lord of the universe" in this context. You translated it as "from the lord of jinn and mankind", which already is a slight hint that you may be translating this in your favor.

You also said:

The first thing that we observe in this ayah is that the Koran (i.e. ‘the collection’) is called a fabrication (yuftara) – which is in complete agreement with 16.101.

In the context of this verse GOD would not call his Qu'ran a fabrication in the sense that it is a "lie".

Fabricate has many meanings:

To make; create.

To construct by combining or assembling diverse, typically standardized parts: fabricate small boats.

To concoct in order to deceive: fabricated an excuse.

So simply GOD has made the Qu'ran. We know this because when we read the whole Qu'ran, and not pick out verses and translate them without knowledge of the rest of the Scripture, we see that GOD would not say such a thing as the Qu'ran being a fabrication in the sense of a "deception" or "lie".

You go on to say:

Further, this ayah states that ‘the collection’ is shown to be superior to “allah”, but still is a confirmation (tasdeeqa) of Him (allathee i.e. Jesus Christ) in His presence “bayna yadayhi”.

What this means is that while the Koran is admittedly a fabrication of the previous scriptures (i.e. it is not divine in any manner whatsoever), it still contains the Biblical message of Jesus Christ.

Further still, ‘the collection’ is said to explain (tafseela) The Book (alkitabi i.e. The Holy Bible) – of which, the Holy Bible is stated to contain no doubt whatsoever in it (la rayba feehi).

The verse does not state the the Qu'ran, or "collection, is superior to GOD. This is a gross mistranslation, my friend.

The verse does not state that it is a "fabrication" of the previous scripture, it is a "confirmation". It does contain the Biblical message of Jesus, you're right, but Jesus never claimed to be GOD. What you have today, my friend, is not the Bible in its entirety, but instead, a fabrication by human hands.

You say it explains the Holy Bible "of which, the Holy Bible is stated to contain no doubt whatsoever in it". Though I may disagree with this and think that instead it means:

"It confirms all previous messages, and provides a fully detailed scripture", even if it did mean that it confirms the Holy Bible (which the Qu'ran does), again, the Bible (the TRUE Bible) is different from the contradictory fabrication people have today.

Many studies on this have been done already. You may be interesting in reading "Jesus: Myths and Message" here, which I've read and contains very strong evidence that the true Bible isn't what we see today.

My apologies, but I will not continue responding to the other posts because of time constraints, as well as the fact that I think it's already shown that you've translated this verse incorrectly.

Peace, brother. May GOD guide you if you are truly looking for the truth.

 

[Bowman]

Thanks for your reply, brother…

Peace Bowman and everyone,

Let us start with your post yesterday talking about verse 10:37.

You started by saying:"The ayahs leading up to 10.37 are discussing “alhaqqi” (i.e. The Truth), of which we are told refers to only Jesus Christ (4.171).

This is fact."



You say this is a fact, but there is no evidence for this. The Qu'ran is clear that Jesus was NOT the son of GOD, nor part of a trinity. If you'd like I can post all the verses that would answer this for you.

Actually, it is fact, as we will see in 4.171…and yes, the Koran proclaims over, and over, and over, that Jesus Christ is the Son.

As far as the Biblical concept of the Trinity, yes, it is contained in the Koran, even in 4.171…

Feel free to post other Koranic ayahs which you feel denies the Son.