Evidence

[TransmutingSoul]

Fair enough. This doesn't resonate with me at all.

Call me superficial, but I'm not going to read 30 pages to find out, so:

Has it been provided? (Page number/s and post/s).

Maybe best I supply your own solution.

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

They are great for giving people an undeserved sense of guilt.

I would rather say that sense of guilt is justified.

 

[Truthseeker]

What then is the point of this thread? If you understand that busy people are not going to invest large amounts of time investigating something just because you say so, then why bother? It's like this, a vacuum cleaner salesman comes to your door and says "I have this amazing cleaner that I'd like you to buy. I understand that you won't take my word for that, so please go away and test this machine and compare it to other machines. A fair test will take several months, you need to test make sure it will last. When you're done, come back and tell me if you want to buy it". How many machines would he sell, do you think?

The question is of course, what is a better approach? I don't know, maybe some links for each point made? Some equivalent of Consumer Reports (not sure what that would be)?

Yes, I know you didn't start the thread. but you'll do to respond to.

I didn't start this thread as you say. I do consider this thread to be a mistake. It won't lead to anything productive probably. Not with @Subduction Zone anyway. I doubt that anyone will be persuaded here that God exists, or that Baha'u'llah is a true Prophet, not in any thread. I just try to make friends where I can. I can learn here, too, sometimes. @Seeker of White Light believed in Baha'u'llah through Baha'u'llah, not through any Baha'is.

 

[muhammad_isa]

I do consider this thread to be a mistake..

Well, it's doing quite well for a mistake .. 600 posts so far.

 

[Trailblazer]

The Baha'i message is essentially, our prophet is from God and everything he says is the truth. And we know that, because he said so.

No, that is not the Baha'i message.
The message is that we know that Baha'u'llah was who He claimed to be because of the evidence that supports His claims.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Like some Catholics have a vision of Mary. Baha'is have visions of Abdul Baha. And Pentecostals get filled with the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues. Real good proof. If it's real.

Actually Abdul'baha was left to us for evidence of the Woed of Baha’u’llah.

A Proof of how to live our lives.

Regards Tony

 

[Truthseeker]

The Baha'i message is essentially, our prophet is from God and everything he says is the truth. And we know that, because he said so.

No, that's not why we believe that.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I didn't start this thread as you say. I do consider this thread to be a mistake. It won't lead to anything productive probably. Not with @Subduction Zone anyway. I doubt that anyone will be persuaded here that God exists, or that Baha'u'llah is a true Prophet, not in any thread. I just try to make friends where I can. I can learn here, too, sometimes. @Seeker of White Light believed in Baha'u'llah through Baha'u'llah, not through any Baha'is.

You are in this OP for the wrong reason then.

It OP is only to determine what is valid evidence. It is not here to prove anything from that evidence.

The proofs can be found or negated by determination of the evidence, not everyone will find proofs in the evidence.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

We don't live in a vacuum. Ideas about religion, God and spiritual things are all around us. Why only the Baha'i interpretation? Why only the fundy Christian interpretation? Of course, Baha'is believe this is a new message and has corrected all the false beliefs that have accumulated over time. But still, for some people, it is only a religion that is making a lot of assumptions, God is real, and Baha'u'llah is his manifestation for this day and age. God being real depends on Baha'u'llah being a manifestation. That's something that we can all look at the claims and evidence, and I like to add, the prophecies, to see if he fulfills those things he claims.

The evidence is there for all of us to pursue.

Regards Tony

 

[Truthseeker]

Well, it's doing quite well for a mistake .. 600 posts so far.

Yeah, that's true, a lot of posts. That doesn't mean it accomplished anything. People like to argue.

 

[Trailblazer]

You probably will not accept my definition. That is why I ask others for theirs. Quite often they do not have one because they do not understand the term. I can define scientific evidence quite easily. But I have never seen believers in woo woo define what they mean by evidence.

There is no scientific evidence for religion, for obvious logical reasons. Religion is not science.

Evidence: the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid: https://www.google.com/search

Evidence is anything that you see, experience, read, or are told that causes you to believe that something is true or has really happened.
Objective evidence definition and meaning | Collins English Dictionary

Proof: evidence or argument establishing or helping to establish a fact or the truth of a statement: https://www.google.com/search

Objective evidence refers to information based on facts that can be proved by means of search like analysis, measurement, and observation. One can examine and evaluate objective evidence.
https://askinglot.com/what-does-objective-evidence-mean

There is no objective evidence for God, and any logical person would understand why.

Has Anyone Ever Seen God?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

An English translation would therefore be helpful

Ask and thou shall receive

Bahá’í Reference Library | The Bahá’í Faith

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Unfortunately I am not the one that claimed to have evidence and then failed.

Who failed?

Regards Tony

 

[Truthseeker]

It OP is only to determine what is valid evidence. It is not here to prove anything from that evidence.

Oh, sorry. I didn't understand.

 

[Trailblazer]

Meanwhile this site puts it directly in number 4 out of 10:

That might very well be true, which is why the couple needs to have the discussion about sex and how important it is to them BEFORE they get married. However, what was once important may become less important for one of them over time, in which case they need to discuss that and try to find a way to deal with it.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Yeah, that's true, a lot of posts. That doesn't mean it accomplished anything. People like to argue.

Mmm .. this thread seems to be like a "honeypot"

The thread itself, is evidence of something..

 

[John53]

I didn't start this thread as you say. I do consider this thread to be a mistake. It won't lead to anything productive probably. Not with @Subduction Zone anyway. I doubt that anyone will be persuaded here that God exists, or that Baha'u'llah is a true Prophet, not in any thread. I just try to make friends where I can. I can learn here, too, sometimes. @Seeker of White Light believed in Baha'u'llah through Baha'u'llah, not through any Baha'is.

It seems we agree on something and that's the purpose of this thread, proselytising.

 

[QuestioningMind]

So you have concluded that the evidence contained absolutely no proof? That's fine, no issue from me about that.

Can I ask, just out of interest, did you pursue any of the evidence provided?

Regards Tony

Unverifiable claims just barely qualifies as bad evidence and doesn't come even close to providing anything akin to proof. Yes, I have read many if not most of the unverifiable claims and they remain just that, claims that cannot be verified.

 

[Truthseeker]

It seems we agree on something and that's the purpose of this thread, proselytising.

It seems that I was mistaken about that. @TransmutingSoul just told me that I was mistaken that this thread was to convince anyone. He said it was to establish what evidence was.

 

[Subduction Zone]

That might very well be true, which is why the couple needs to have the discussion about sex and how important it is to them BEFORE they get married. However, what was once important may become less important for one of them over time, in which case they need to discuss that and try to find a way to deal with it.

Or, just maybe, and since there does not appear to be a good reason not to, they could see if they were compatible or not.