Evidences Supporting the Biblical Flood

[shunyadragon]

Just as Jesus said to those Sadduces, at Matthew 22:29: "You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God."

Yes, power of God...you seem to ignore that... the Noachian Flood was a divine event! He caused the two separate 'oceans' of water -- those above the Earth, and those below, in "the vast fountains of the deep" -- to break open; He brought the animals to Noah; He closed the Ark's entrance; He gave Noah those ideal ratios, along with all other instructions, to build the vessel.

For you and others to think that He did nothing else to protect them during the event, is simply unreasonable.

Jehovah could've put them in a bubble and just levitated them. But Jehovah always wants people to show their faith in Him when possible, acting in their behalf.

By providing Noah those instructions containing the ideal proportions, it not only allowed Noah to express his faith, but
revealed that it was from a Divine Source.

Tell me...can you come up with better ratios of length to width to height? Maybe you think the Ark "cube" in the Epic of Gilgamesh is feasible?

Better ratios are meaningless when a ship that big held together by wooden pegs will not work.

Despite modern technology no one has built a ship like this that even floats fully loaded.

Still waiting . . .

The contemporary ships cited had steel structural support. There was no steel nor even iron at the time the ship was claimed to be built.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Just as Jesus said to those Sadduces, at Matthew 22:29: "You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God."

Yes, power of God...you seem to ignore that... the Noachian Flood was a divine event! He caused the two separate 'oceans' of water -- those above the Earth, and those below, in "the vast fountains of the deep" -- to break open; He brought the animals to Noah; He closed the Ark's entrance; He gave Noah those ideal ratios, along with all other instructions, to build the vessel.

For you and others to think that He did nothing else to protect them during the event, is simply unreasonable.

Jehovah could've put them in a bubble and just levitated them. But Jehovah always wants people to show their faith in Him when possible, acting in their behalf.

By providing Noah those instructions containing the ideal proportions, it not only allowed Noah to express his faith, but
revealed that it was from a Divine Source.

Tell me...can you come up with better ratios of length to width to height? Maybe you think the Ark "cube" in the Epic of Gilgamesh is feasible?

I am ignoring nothing. You are now claiming that God is a liar. You probably do not understand why.

And you are back to bogus claims. Those are not "ideal ratios" . You utterly failed to support that claim.

And don't forget: To believe in the Flood one has to believe in a God that lies.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

...held together by wooden pegs...

There's another false assumption. Genesis 4:22

 

[Subduction Zone]

There's another false assumption. Genesis 4:22

Nothing there that changes the myth in any way.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

And you are back to bogus claims. Those are not "ideal ratios" . You utterly failed to support that claim.

And don't forget: To believe in the Flood one has to believe in a God that lies.

Documented upport is found in Isambard K. Brunel, architect of the SS Great Britain, whose ratio was 30:5:3, identical to the Ark.

And the US Navy, who built barges in WWII unwittingly using the same proportions.

How did Noah know?

..."one has to believe in a God that lies"?

Matthew 22:29

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Nothing there that changes the myth in any way.

Just correcting.a flawed assumption.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Documented upport is found in Isambard K. Brunel, architect of the SS Great Britain, whose ratio was 30:5:3, identical to the Ark.

And the US Navy, who built barges in WWII unwittingly using the same proportions.

How did Noah know?

..."one has to believe in a God that lies"?

Matthew 22:29

Hardly "documented support" since I can find boats with different rations. In fact this book goes over why different boats have different ratios. There is no listed "ideal" dimensions. The best dimensions are used depending upon what the boat is to be used for, what sort of propulsion it has, cargo etc.. Finding one ship that matches the ratios of the Ark proves nothing. You would have to show that is that dimension of all ships regardless of use which a quick check will show that is not the case:

The Art and Archaeology of Venetian Ships and Boats

And you are still claiming that God lied regardless of the dimensions of the boat.

All of the scientific and archaeological evidence tells us that there was no flood. How do you explain that?

 

[Subduction Zone]

Just correcting.a flawed assumption.

Nope, creationists are banned from using the word "assumption" since they can never support that claim.

 

[shunyadragon]

Documented upport is found in Isambard K. Brunel, architect of the SS Great Britain, whose ratio was 30:5:3, identical to the Ark.

And the US Navy, who built barges in WWII unwittingly using the same proportions.

How did Noah know?

..."one has to believe in a God that lies"?

Matthew 22:29

Ratios are meaningless. No one has built a fully loaded bronze Age Ark that even will float in open water. God. of course, does not lie, but I have no reason to believe the mythology of Genesis was revealed by God.

Again, again, and again . . . there is absolutely no evidence any such flood ever happened.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Ratios are meaningless. No one has built a fully loaded bronze Age Ark that even will float in open water. God. of course, does not lie, but I have no reason to believe the mythology of Genesis was revealed by God.

Again, again, and again . . . there is absolutely no evidence any such flood ever happened.

And when I was a believer I did not believe that God lied either. Which is of course why I did not accept the Noah's Ark story. Believers in the Flood refuse to see how they are calling God a liar whenever they say the flood story is true.

 

[SkepticThinker]

The Ark was used for 1 year. Actually, 5 months floating. The Wyoming was in service for 14 years! The Santiago was in service for 63 years! (Why did the article not mention that? It lends some dishonesty to the piece.)

Some of these ships, the Wyoming and others mentioned, were masted ships. All, though, were designed to move under power, from the wind or other means. All the Ark needed, was to float. So really, nothing about these ships in the article, applies.

Plus, the Ark was built over a span of at least 50 years...the pre-Flood atmosphere being more humid, would allow the hull's resinous planks to expand, forming a more water-tight barrier. In addition, it was covered inside & out with bitumen!

I've been saying the dimensions were ideal. That is not correct, it's not the point, really. We don't even know which kind of cubit -- the base measurement -- was used. It could vary from about 15 inches to 22 inches.

But we do know the ratios used: the length was 10x the height, and 6x the width.
These very ratios are the basis of what modern shipbuilders use, with slight modifications depending on the vessel's purpose.

How did Moses know? Just guessing? No, this is evidence of Divine inspiration, detailing an actual event.

I found this on Wikipedia, regarding the Wyoming:

"Because of its extreme length and wood construction, Wyoming tended to flex in heavy seas, which would cause the long planks to twist and buckle, thereby allowing sea water to intrude into the hold (see hogging and sagging). Wyoming had to use pumps to keep its hold relatively free of water. In March 1924, it foundered in heavy seas and sank with the loss of all hands."
Wyoming (schooner) - Wikipedia


She foundered and sank during a storm.


And this on another site:
"She was constructed of 2,400 tons of longleaf yellow pine, 700 tons of white oak and 300 tons of iron and steel (fittings, fastenings, and strapping)."
http://www.mainemaritimemuseum.org/media/docs/resources/2013/01/28/Schooner_Wyoming_Fact_Sheet_1.pdf


Would you suggest that the Ark was also constructed using iron and steel?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Just as Jesus said to those Sadduces, at Matthew 22:29: "You are mistaken, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God."

Yes, power of God...you seem to ignore that... the Noachian Flood was a divine event! He caused the two separate 'oceans' of water -- those above the Earth, and those below, in "the vast fountains of the deep" -- to break open; He brought the animals to Noah; He closed the Ark's entrance; He gave Noah those ideal ratios, along with all other instructions, to build the vessel.

For you and others to think that He did nothing else to protect them during the event, is simply unreasonable.

Jehovah could've put them in a bubble and just levitated them. But Jehovah always wants people to show their faith in Him when possible, acting in their behalf.

By providing Noah those instructions containing the ideal proportions, it not only allowed Noah to express his faith, but
revealed that it was from a Divine Source.

Tell me...can you come up with better ratios of length to width to height? Maybe you think the Ark "cube" in the Epic of Gilgamesh is feasible?

Oops, we're back to the magic claims again.

It's unreasonable to attempt a scientific discussion about the Ark, then decide that magic is responsible for the stuff you can't explain. Your entire scientific argument is moot if you're going to invoke magic whenever you feel like it.


Why didn't Jehovah just put Noah, his family and two of every animal in a bubble and levitate them to begin with, and just not bother with some guy having to build an Ark? Why didn't God just snap his fingers and murder everybody and everything on the planet save for Noah, his family and two of every animal? It would have been easier. The problem is, when you invoke magic, what you're doing is just making stuff up.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Documented upport is found in Isambard K. Brunel, architect of the SS Great Britain, whose ratio was 30:5:3, identical to the Ark.

And the US Navy, who built barges in WWII unwittingly using the same proportions.

How did Noah know?

..."one has to believe in a God that lies"?

Matthew 22:29

Who cares? This is all irrelevant if you're just going to end up invoking magic anyway.

 

[Bear Wild]

Oops, we're back to the magic claims again.

It's unreasonable to attempt a scientific discussion about the Ark, then decide that magic is responsible for the stuff you can't explain. Your entire scientific argument is moot if you're going to invoke magic whenever you feel like it.


Why didn't Jehovah just put Noah, his family and two of every animal in a bubble and levitate them to begin with, and just not bother with some guy having to build an Ark? Why didn't God just snap his fingers and murder everybody and everything on the planet save for Noah, his family and two of every animal? It would have been easier. The problem is, when you invoke magic, what you're doing is just making stuff up.

This is exactly why the story of Noah is so much better as a myth to teach about Jewish beliefs rather than an event that actually happened and makes no sense in the world we live in. The story is clearly written to say, look if you do not follow the Jewish law to the letter the see what will happen to you. God will be willing to kill all non-believers or even those who stray from the law and also willing to take down every other living thing despite that the rest of the living creatures had nothing to do with the problem. That is a powerful message if you are a follower of the Jewish faith. As an actual event it becomes impossible to explain and in trying to find real evidence makes the story unbelievable.

 

[shunyadragon]

And when I was a believer I did not believe that God lied either. Which is of course why I did not accept the Noah's Ark story. Believers in the Flood refuse to see how they are calling God a liar whenever they say the flood story is true.

It is difficult if not impossible for many to realize that Genesis is very human document edited, redacted and compiled from older sources by the evidence. The account of Genesis is not an argument for nor against the existence of God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It is difficult if not impossible for many to realize that Genesis is very human document edited, redacted and compiled from older sources by the evidence. The account of Genesis is not an argument for nor against the existence of God.

I agree, it is only an argument against a specific version of God. But clearly not all versions. Most Christians do not seem to take that story very seriously at all and their faith is not threatened by this.

 

[ecco]

But we do know the ratios used: the length was 10x the height, and 6x the width.
These very ratios are the basis of what modern shipbuilders use, with slight modifications depending on the vessel's purpose.

Documented upport is found in Isambard K. Brunel, architect of the SS Great Britain, whose ratio was 30:5:3, identical to the Ark.

And the US Navy, who built barges in WWII unwittingly using the same proportions.

Huh?

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Nothing new here. Pretty much how humanity behaves since the first human hundreds of thousands of years ago.

Oh brother...exactly! That’s the point!
Jesus was describing real people, in a real event. Not some allegorical myth.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh brother...exactly! That’s the point!
Jesus was describing real people, in a real event. Not some allegorical myth.

You are back to claiming that Jesus was not divine.

 

[Vaderecta]

I appreciate your take. Just look at the evidence I posted, though.

Here is something you might enjoy (then again, you might not):

http://www.2001translation.com/Authenticity.htm

Take care!

I can't really believe your serious. There is your stated view and then your sources and then the actual source. Are you aware of who wrote the bible? They didn't know how to cure cancer or what microbes were. We have vaccines now mate.