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Evolution is illogical and non sense

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
Is evolution the mutation of any said...being or life form?
No. Evolution is simply put change over time. The word itself comes from Greek, meaning something like "turning". Things turn and change. Mutations are only a part of the puzzle. In the whole, is a rather complex system but usually the summary or simplification is that you have gene changes and selection. Gene changes can come from several different things, mutation, infection, copy error, and maybe other. Also, you have recombination that happens through reproduction. Then, for selection, there are several types there as well, sexual, natural, artificial, and perhaps more. Over time, the changes in the genes are so drastic that the group that share those genetic changes look very different from the original individuals, and have new and different traits (faster, stronger, smaller, bigger, ...) and they have been "selected" simply because their traits give them the edge to survive and reproduce better than the others. Now, this would only explain how one species becomes another species, but it's not uncommon to have a group being split, and then the two groups evolve independently of each other, and over time, you'll have a group that reminds more of the first group, and another that looks more different, and the two groups aren't even compatible, or just simple aren't mating because of their outside differences (part of sexual selection, what's interesting is that this has actually been documented happening in our time, with a family of rats, I have to look it up and find it if you're interested).
 

Cruiser88

New Member
I'm glad to hear you state that you care about others. That's a vastly different sentiment, however, than the one you communicated in your previous post, where you stated, quite explicitly, that it was a WASTE OF TIME -- your exact words -- to talk to atheists.

Yet here you are, talking to atheists. So? Is it a waste of time to talk to us? Or is it not a waste of time? Can you explain why, if it's such a waste of time, you're going right ahead and doing it anyway?

Did I say I was talking to atheists? this part of the program is directed towards those "babes in Christ" I spoke of earlier. They should know what they are up against. Jesus came to His own chosen people, validated His ministry in countless miracles and healings because the Jew demands a sign. And yet HE WAS REJECTED and killed by His own..........so here we sit surrounded on these forums by admitted atheists for the most part who we should know are blinded to the truth by the Prince of the power of the air..........and how well should we expect to do?
 

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
Did I say I was talking to atheists? this part of the program is directed towards those "babes in Christ" I spoke of earlier.
You weren't clear about that. You spoke about babes in Christ and atheists in the post before, and actually, since atheists were mentioned last in your leading paragraph in the previous post, it's a lead-in into what you're talking about next. So I can see why people got confused over your post.

They should know what they are up against. Jesus came to His own chosen people, validated His ministry in countless miracles and healings because the Jew demands a sign. And yet HE WAS REJECTED and killed by His own..........so here we sit surrounded on these forums by admitted atheists for the most part who we should know are blinded to the truth by the Prince of the power of the air..........and how well should we expect to do?
What does this have to do with the current discussion though? You're derailing the topic quite a bit and are making it into a preaching corner. There are other sub-forums on this site for that.
 

Ouroboros

Coincidentia oppositorum
Are you implying that Satan can destroy the word of God?
Something I learned as a cultish Christian, doubt is a million times stronger than faith. If you believe God to heal you, then maybe, just maybe in a million years you can get it. But just doubt for a single microsecond that there's a possibility that God won't heal you. You're d**m right he won't. A mustard seed of faith might be able to move a mountain, but a quark of doubt will create a universe. :D
 

Blastcat

Active Member
Is evolution the mutation of any said...being or life form?
Evolution is not just mutation.. mutation is a factor in how life forms can evolve, but not the only factor or force. Some mutations have not be beneficial, and some might be beneficial .. those mutations that help a group survive better depending on the environment will have a higher degree of ability to pass those genes on. Only organisms that can survive can pass on their genetic code.

Those organisms who can't adapt as well, tend to die off after a while. And when they are all gone, they can't pass on their genetic code at all..

Sometimes, change is a good thing.
 

The Unknown Nihilist

. . . . . . . . . . . . .
Explain this to me evolutionist. In science they can explain in specific detail many functions found in nature. Photosynthesis etc. All about systems, Muscular, Nerve and it goes on. Yet evolution never can explain evolution is that type detail. You can not give one proven example of evolution of one species to another higher order species. You can't tell us what it started at and what it became. You can't explain the no. of steps it took and what each step entailed to get there. That is not like the science I am referring to above. So evolution is really non science non sense.

Hi I am new and will try my best to give you an understandable reply. I don't know how to quote properly yet so bare with me please.
Species do not move to another "higher" species. Homo sapiens and existing ape species had a common ancestor. That is a proven example. But I think you are asking for an OBSERVABLE instance of a species changing into a completely different species. Keep in mind I can not show you an ape giving birth to a human. Nor would that be an example of evolution in action. But maybe I can show you a better way of how it works.

Some redwood trees are 200 years old. We know this because of Dendrochronology. You have herd of it. Dendrochronology is counting the rings on a cut stump and that is observable and proven. Grow a tree for ten years and it will have ten rings when you cut it every time. And some trees can be traced back hundreds of years. So lets say you pick off a seed from a 200 year old tree just cut down and you plant it in your back yard. You water it and after some time a tiny spurt comes out. You keep watering the redwood seed spurt and after a couple years the spurt starts to grow taller. The question you need to ask yourself is would it be reasonable to say that given enough time and care the spurt will eventually turn into one of the many 200 year old redwood trees? Well of course it would! But no one has actually observed a planted redwood seed grow into a 200 year old tree. Because no one has lived 200 years. Speciation sometimes takes millions of years. But it is proven because of observable facts in fossil records and the rock layer formations we find them in. Not just for humans and apes but many different specious of animals. Also it has been proven through viral markers in our DNA.

Another scientific theory is the heliocentric theory. This theory is proven fact and states that the earth moves around the sun. But no one as actually observed the earth go around the sun. No one has actually captured video footage of the earth going around the sun. Would you say that there is no observable evidence for the heliocentric theory? Of course not! Because there are many other observable facts we have put together that prove it does move around the sun.





Plus explain this. You say An explosion of energy started all the extreme order and precision we see in creation. Yet in no other example can you give where an explosion of energy ever produces order, precision etc. When I see storms, explosions etc. Much less energy than the Big Bang supposedly had and the aftermath is anything but order, precision, intracate design etc. My logic and common sense just doesn't buy it.

Increasing entropy in a closed system can create order. In simple terms it was not the "explosion" or expansion of the universe that produced order but the gravity that closed everything in together in separated individual closed systems if that makes sense. Gravity formed the planets and the galaxies and the chemical compositions that make up everything.

This video reveals how entropy sometimes creates order out of chaos




Evolution says the Design we see in creation only appears designed. Well that might be correct if talking about a cloud. But we are talking about FUNCTIONAL DESIGN etc.

Like male nipples? or the appendix? Armpit hair? Your tail bone? Goosebumps? What are their functions? These things are useless now but had important functions long ago. Natural selection favors the random mutation of genes that allow it to constantly reproduce.

Evolution has no real thinking brain. Yet you act as if it did. It reminds me of the illustration I like to give.
Mother Nature decides to form the faces on Mt Rushmore. So it gets the forces and processes of nature to join together and uses rain, wind, erosion and time to form those faces. It shows design (we know it was) yet it isn't life. But see life not only shows Design, it is functional and makes real life possible.

This is a bad analogy. I don't want to go into all the arguments that have refuted the watchmaker argument. You can google those. Here.

Argument from design - RationalWiki


That is all I will cover for now.
 

outhouse

Atheistically
Babes in Christ will spend years arguing with atheists..........time to grow up and realize they're blind and in the dark.........all arguments here are a waste of time........as is quite evident.........

Do you really hate credible education and academia?
 

outhouse

Atheistically
..........time to grow up and realize they're blind and in the dark.........

Sir, its unlikely you have half the biblical education we do. It is against forum rules to refer to us as childish because we stand behind facts and education and knowledge instead of faith.

Evolution is fact, could you stay on topic to the thread?
 

Guy Threepwood

Mighty Pirate
Not every person who argues for evolution says that there's no God. Only fools think that atheism and evolution are the same. It's a n equivocation fallacy.

Again though if we define evolution as generally taught, that every feature of every living thing was derived from chance rather than design- this would be a pretty big overlap in a Venn diagram with atheists would it not? They are both minority views based on the same ideology of chance v design governing all the universe and life.
 

`mud

Just old
Premium Member
Equivocality versus the chaotic velocities of the Cosmos.
One entity can't become the other.
It is most certainly an equivocation fallacy !
~
'mud
 

Blastcat

Active Member
Again though if we define evolution as generally taught, that every feature of every living thing was derived from chance rather than design- this would be a pretty big overlap in a Venn diagram with atheists would it not? They are both minority views based on the same ideology of chance v design governing all the universe and life.

The theory of evolution is not about chance. IF you define the theory of evolution that way, it's just wrong. So, we don't have to pay attention to that. We SHOULD pay attention to what evolution theory actually IS.
 

Christifidelis

New Member
Explain this to me evolutionist. In science they can explain in specific detail many functions found in nature. Photosynthesis etc. All about systems, Muscular, Nerve and it goes on. Yet evolution never can explain evolution is that type detail. You can not give one proven example of evolution of one species to another higher order species. You can't tell us what it started at and what it became. You can't explain the no. of steps it took and what each step entailed to get there. That is not like the science I am referring to above. So evolution is really non science non sense.

Plus explain this. You say An explosion of energy started all the extreme order and precision we see in creation. Yet in no other example can you give where an explosion of energy ever produces order, precision etc. When I see storms, explosions etc. Much less energy than the Big Bang supposedly had and the aftermath is anything but order, precision, intracate design etc. My logic and common sense just doesn't buy it.

Evolution says the Design we see in creation only appears designed. Well that might be correct if talking about a cloud. But we are talking about FUNCTIONAL DESIGN etc. That is a big big difference. It is what makes life possible since that Function makes life possible.

Evolution has no real thinking brain. Yet you act as if it did. It reminds me of the illustration I like to give.
Mother Nature decides to form the faces on Mt Rushmore. So it gets the forces and processes of nature to join together and uses rain, wind, erosion and time to form those faces. It shows design (we know it was) yet it isn't life. But see life not only shows Design, it is functional and makes real life possible.

In all of my life, I have yet to see where I find functional Design, Engineering, Programming etc not have intelligent brains behind it. Yet evolution tries to sell me that what we have occured w/o an actual intelligent brain behind it. Really? Like Mother Nature and the faces on Mt Rushmore?

Even atheist mathematician Fred Hoyle admitted it took intelligence and evolution was impossible. He described it thusly. The odds for evolution are the same as a tornado going through a junkyard and forming a 747 ready for take off on a runway! How did he get around the obvious intelligence needed that he acknowledged. He said it had to have come from outer space! That is sure pure science huh!

Sir Isaac Newton had an atheist friend that he couldn't convince him of God. So he went to a skilled carpenter friend. He asked him to make for him a copy to a scale of our solar system. After it was finished Sir Isaac Newton went and picked it up after paying for it. The work was exquisite. He placed it on a prominate place in his house. Not too long afterwards his atheist friend came by. He couldn't help but notice the great artistic replica of our solar system. He asked Sir Isaac Newton who made it. Newton replied No one it just appeared out of no where. The friend kept asking and Newton kept replying the same. Finally the friend got really mad. Then Sir Isaac Newton explained what he had done and the purpose for it. He told him, This is basically what you keep telling me about our solar system etc. I wanted to show you how absurd that really is. Then the friend got the point. I hope you do too.

I want examples where precise intricate Design Engineering Programming has ever occurred w/o actual intelligence behind it? Gee, if I walk upon a beach and see a cell phone, computer etc I know it took intelligence to Design, Engineer and Program it? Why can't you admit the obvious?

Dawkins the Blind watchmaker has always amused me. Why? Regardless of whether a watchmaker was blind or not. He couldn't make Design, Engineer or Program the watch w/o actual intelligent thinking brain could he?

There are two books you should read. First one is "A Closer Look at the Evidence" by Richard and Tina Kleiss and "Inspired Evidence" by Bruce Malone. They are two books that are daily readings of one page each day. They go over many areas of science etc and show how when evolution has to get specific it falls flat on its face. Ironically, when you read evolutionist own words they actually betray the truth of the fraud and horrible science it truly is.

http://www.searchforthetruth.net/

BTW isn't it interesting that man's "evolved" brain still can't match what evolution says a non thinking intelligence Designed, Engineered and Programmed. Man study's nature to learn how to better things for man and still can't match it. Yet evolution did it so much better before mankind had "evolved" yet! How silly do you think I am! Worse is what man has tried to match, Kidney, heart machines etc. Mankind can't come close to matching. Yet evolution did it better than our top of the line "evolved" brain can do! Please explain how that is possible. Mother Nature example again!

So I want logical common sense replies to disprove my logical, comon sense "evolved" brain. Stick to the subject and don't use your usual tactics of avoidance and changing the subject to avoid answering what you can't. Much less personal attacks showing you can't answer so you attack saying I don't understand evolution. See the problem is I actually do. That is why, like Fred Hoyle, I realize it is impossible and took a supreme Intelligence. Difference I acknowledge God, Jesus the actual creator God. Colossians first Chapter and part of chapter 2 and Romans chapter 1.

That is the site you can go to the purchase those books.

BTW I taught a lesson on "How to filter evolutionary teaching using their own words" last Sunday. I had it recorded. I hope to post it on You Tube fairly soon. I am not a techno person. So my friend will have to help me. He has been real sick with strep throat. So not sure when we will be able to post it.

God Bless You All.
 

Christifidelis

New Member
Dear ttechsan;

There may indeed be aspects of the reigning theory of organic evolution that you do not well understand, as some of your interlocutors are claiming. I believe, nonetheless, that your instincts as to the impossibility of large-scale evolution are sound. I am no young earth Creationist, but I have been introduced to the writings of some who criticize evolutionary ideas from a very different angle, and I believe that these criticisms, properly understood, are absolutely decisive. I would be more than happy to discuss some of these criticisms with you if you like. Please keep posting on this subject, ttechsan! God bless you.

Christifidelis
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
Dear ttechsan;

There may indeed be aspects of the reigning theory of organic evolution that you do not well understand, as some of your interlocutors are claiming. I believe, nonetheless, that your instincts as to the impossibility of large-scale evolution are sound. I am no young earth Creationist, but I have been introduced to the writings of some who criticize evolutionary ideas from a very different angle, and I believe that these criticisms, properly understood, are absolutely decisive. I would be more than happy to discuss some of these criticisms with you if you like. Please keep posting on this subject, ttechsan! God bless you.

Christifidelis
So, let's hear about some of these absolutely decisive criticisms. I'm certainly curious.
 

`mud

Just old
Premium Member
"Mother Nature decides to form the faces on Mt Rushmore." ???
Am I really loosing my mind ? :partypooper:
~
'mud
 
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