• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Exodus Archeology Evidence

River Sea

Well-Known Member
Let us consider Amarna letter in detail. First of all, these are dated to about 14 to 13th century BCE, after the Exodus. So, the mention of Mitsrayim in Amarna tablets may only indicate that the word had been brought from somewhere else. If Egypt was actually known as Mitsrayim earlier, then we should have found such mention of this name earlier as well. The fact that Exodus took place around the 14th or 13th century, and that is when Amarna letters were sent. Therefore, the mention of the word Mitsrayim could be an imported name which was imported from the Indus Valley. The basic point we are considering is whether the biblical name Mitsrayim refers to Egypt or to the Indus Valley. Here, I think Amarna letters do not establish the mention of Mitsrayim in Egypt, because these could be importation from Indus Valley. We should remember, that there is always a tendency amongst people to capture names and places. So, it is possible that in order to glorify their homeland of Mitsrayim, the Amarna people may have appropriated the name Mitsrayim for Egypt.

Same topic, two threads by @Mrpp due to @Mrpp thinking' made a mistake due to learning. I wish in the same thread and extremely point out what @Mrpp learned so I can follow. I am extremely lost due to this. Due to two threads on the same topic.
The other thread on same topic is Exodus Archeology Evidence part 2 updated

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala
I understand Mitsrayim is located in the Indus Valley, and I also understand that the word Israel means Krishna God.

Israel derived from Sanskrit word Ishwaralaya, which means Isha or Krishna God

@Bharat Jhunjhunwala
So would that mean Brahman when saying Krishna God? Can you explain in more detail what Isha is, please?

Also these Amarna letters that @Mrpp shared, what were the intent of these letters? What was the purpose? I am confused by two threads, I'm lost. I wish there was only one thread for this same topic.

So let's start with this question @Bharat Jhunjhunwala @Tamino @Mrpp what was the purpose of Amarna letters for?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
It's hard to say just what's meant by
a "historical jesus".

Usually that would be non-magical Jesus. In other words a man with followers that was killed by the Romans via crucifixion.
There was nobody by that name, nor
is the nativity story historic.
Actually the original version of "Jesus" in Aramaic was a fairly common name, And there are two different nativity stories. Neither of them are historic and they are also at least ten years apart from each other. Matthew has it when Herod was still king of Judea and we do have records of when he stopped being king. That was in 4 BCE. And Luke has it ten years later since he sited the Census of Quirinius as the bogus cause of his parents going to Bethlehem
No person referred to as Jesus
can be identified to time of place of
birth or death.

A real person apparently displeased the
Romans and was killed, then said to
have come back to life.
As for anything else-
The deeds and sayings of said person have
very dubious provenance.

How real a person is / was if virtually nothing
actually known and most of it is fictional can
be debated of course.

But I'd say the character represented by the name
Jesus in Christian mythology did not exist.

" Lono" cult may have started with a real person
but by the time Captain Cook showed up there was
nothing real remaining.
Yes, myths can appear very suddenly. They do not take generations to form. In the US there are millions that believe the myth that Trump won the second election. And that is with the existence of modern news sources. Jesus probably existed as a man. He was apparently tried by the Romans and crucified, and like almost all he would have been left up on the cross. The most unbelievable part of the story until he was supposedly resurrected is that he was taken down in the first place. Leaving people up to serve s a warning to others was part of the process. No excuse is even attempted in the Gospels, which is extremely odd. It is almost as if all of the writers put their fingers in their ears when it came to normal Roman punishment.
 

gnostic

The Lost One
And that is with the existence of modern news sources. Jesus probably existed as a man. He was apparently tried by the Romans and crucified, and like almost all he would have been left up on the cross. The most unbelievable part of the story until he was supposedly resurrected is that he was taken down in the first place. Leaving people up to serve s a warning to others was part of the process. No excuse is even attempted in the Gospels, which is extremely odd. It is almost as if all of the writers put their fingers in their ears when it came to normal Roman punishment.

back when I was researching the Holy Grail for my Timeless Myths website, back in 2000, I started re-reading the gospels about Jesus' death.

I came to realisation, the same as you did, above, that Romans usually kept bodies they have crucified on the crosses for display for weeks and even months, to allow carrion birds and rats to feed on the corpses. They don't take the bodies down shortly after death as the gospels have narrated. It was the standard practices of the Romans, to let the corpses to rot on the crosses.

It was one of the things that didn't ring true, about Jesus' death.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Israel derived from Sanskrit word Ishwaralaya, which means Isha or Krishna God

I do not believe any Jew or Israeli would agree with this contrived explanation of the origin of the Nation's name, "Israel.'

The name Israel (Hebrew: Yīsrāʾēl; Septuagint Greek: Ἰσραήλ, Israēl, "El (God) persists/rules", though after Hosea 12:4 often interpreted as "struggle with God") refers to the patriarch Jacob who, according to the Hebrew Bible, was given the name after he successfully wrestled with the angel of the Lord.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Historians didn't believed in Jesus or David exsiststed now historians are gradually are starting to change minds. Instead of following simply opinions you should focus on facts of the case.
Historians do not believe nor believe in history, Not true at all how historians consider ancient history, people and events. It is more correct to say that historians are skeptical about ancient history with limited documentation as to who Jesus and David were. Most academic historians by far have in the past and now accept Jesus and David as historical figures who lived in the time frame the Bible describes.
 
Last edited:

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
back when I was researching the Holy Grail for my Timeless Myths website, back in 2000, I started re-reading the gospels about Jesus' death.

I came to realisation, the same as you did, above, that Romans usually kept bodies they have crucified on the crosses for display for weeks and even months, to allow carrion birds and rats to feed on the corpses. They don't take the bodies down shortly after death as the gospels have narrated. It was the standard practices of the Romans, to let the corpses to rot on the crosses.

It was one of the things that didn't ring true, about Jesus' death.
This is mostly true, and yes I am skeptical of the Gospels account of the life of Jesus, but I do believe that it is possible that relatives may pay the Roman guards to take bodies down for burial.
 

River Sea

Well-Known Member
@Tamino @Bharat Jhunjhunwala @Mrpp


Fig. 3. Te broad collar from Tomb KV 55 (Tebes, Valley of the Kings), 18th Dynasty; National Museum of Egyptian Civilization, Cairo (JE 39631/CG 52674);
(afer Vernier 1925, pl. XL:52.674)

G. PAPASAVVAS • AURA SUPPLEMENT 9 · 49

Screenshot
1719122894185.png


Reason why I shared this?
I don't know why?
 

River Sea

Well-Known Member
I am not dismissing. The fact that Israel wandered in Sinai for 40 years. I am saying that this Sinai was located in Iran and not in Egypt. If one travels from Indus Valley to Israel, one would pass near Taftan volcano, which lies on the southeast corner of Iran. So, this was Mount Sinai even looks at the description of the volcanic eruption in the Bible. It matches very much with the sulfuric eruptions that are taking place in Mount Taftan even today. So, the question is not whether they wandered for 40 years. The question is, where did they wander? And here I'm simply saying that the correct interpretation is that they wanted in Iran, near Isfahan.

@Mrpp @Tamino @Bharat Jhunjhunwala
Youtube video showing Taftan Volcano

 

IsraelMoses

Member

IsraelMoses

Member
Discovery and Significance of the Tel Dan Stela


The largest fragment of the Tel Dan Stela, Fragment A, was discovered at Tel Dan in northern Israel in July 1993 (Biran and Naveh 1993; Wood 1993). Then, in June 1994, two additional joining fragments, labeled Fragment B, were found (Biran and Naveh 1995). Together, Fragments A and B represent only a fraction of a much longer inscription. The language is Aramaic and it celebrates the victory of a king of Aram over Israel and Judah. It is the first royal inscription from the kingdom period to be found in Israel.


Tel Dan Inscription, the first royal inscription from the kingdom period to be found in Israel.
Fragment A (right) was discovered in 1993 and Fragment B (left) was discovered one year later.
Dated to ca. 841 BC, the original inscription named at least eight Biblical kings.



The most stunning aspect of the document is the reference to Judah as the “House of David.” For the first time, it was thought, the name David appeared in an extra-Biblical document. At about the same time, however, two French scholars, André Lemaire (1994) and Émile Puech (1994), independently recognized the same phrase in the Mesha Inscription, which has been around for well over 100 years (Wood 1995). It now likely that the name David is in a third inscription. Egyptologist K.A. Kitchen believes that the phrase “highland of David” appears in the Shishak inscription in the Temple of Amun at Karnak, Egypt (1997: 39–41). All this at a time when a number of scholars were challenging the existence of the United Monarchy and a king name David!
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Discovery and Significance of the Tel Dan Stela


The largest fragment of the Tel Dan Stela, Fragment A, was discovered at Tel Dan in northern Israel in July 1993 (Biran and Naveh 1993; Wood 1993). Then, in June 1994, two additional joining fragments, labeled Fragment B, were found (Biran and Naveh 1995). Together, Fragments A and B represent only a fraction of a much longer inscription. The language is Aramaic and it celebrates the victory of a king of Aram over Israel and Judah. It is the first royal inscription from the kingdom period to be found in Israel.


Tel Dan Inscription, the first royal inscription from the kingdom period to be found in Israel.
Fragment A (right) was discovered in 1993 and Fragment B (left) was discovered one year later.
Dated to ca. 841 BC, the original inscription named at least eight Biblical kings.



The most stunning aspect of the document is the reference to Judah as the “House of David.” For the first time, it was thought, the name David appeared in an extra-Biblical document. At about the same time, however, two French scholars, André Lemaire (1994) and Émile Puech (1994), independently recognized the same phrase in the Mesha Inscription, which has been around for well over 100 years (Wood 1995). It now likely that the name David is in a third inscription. Egyptologist K.A. Kitchen believes that the phrase “highland of David” appears in the Shishak inscription in the Temple of Amun at Karnak, Egypt (1997: 39–41). All this at a time when a number of scholars were challenging the existence of the United Monarchy and a king name David!
The reference is acknowledged by most scholars to refer to a Hebrew King David, but at present no evidence for a United Kingdom ruled by David., The reference may refer to a local ruler.
 
Last edited:

River Sea

Well-Known Member
If you don't understand what I am writing then you shouldn't write at all. I will try be as simple as I can. Armana leeters gives description of Joshua conquest and so gives us evidence for his invasion. Suddenly change into Idea one God (with similarities) gives evidence for such interaction beetwen Israel and Egypt. Like think for moment how would Egyptians react to such event. There would be massive change in their beliefs and that exactly what happened. Egyptians specifically said they wittnesed. You didn't focus on my evidence just barely scratched surface on my end assumption on who Exodus pharaoh could be. Second command is still high in command and just beacuse they don't mention something doesn't mean anything. Diffrent writers have diffrent priorities.

Further down I shared video where Dr. Falk talks about this, please see. May 15, 2023 Dr. Dave A. Falk showed his disappointment about Mt. Ebal curse amulet. "This is terrible epigraphy. It's some of the worst I've ever seen", says Dr. Dave A. Falk.

@Mrpp

AI Overview
Learn more…Opens in new tab

The Amarna Letters are a collection of clay tablets written in Akkadian Cuneiform that contain diplomatic correspondence between Egypt and other lands in the Eastern Mediterranean during the 14th century BCE. The letters were discovered in 1887 by villagers in the Central City and are now on display at the British Museum in London. Some say that the letters record events that happened at the same time as the Bible's account of Israel's invasion of Canaan, and that they therefore provide evidence of the invasion. The letters also provide insight into Egyptian relations with other regions, including Babylonia, Assyria, Syria, Alashiya (Cyprus), the Mitanni, and the Hittites, and have been important in establishing the history and chronology of the period

@Mrpp

How come in this book titled "Five Views on the Exodus" that Scott Stripling kept focusing on the curse tablet for? I'm confused because how is that Exodus?

AI Overview
Learn more…Opens in new tab

The Mount Ebal curse tablet is a folded lead object that was discovered in January 2019 at Mount Ebal in Israel. The tablet is dated to 1400-1200 BCE and contains an ancient curse written in a proto-alphabetic script. It is considered to be the oldest Hebrew text ever found in the Land of Israel and may provide insight into the date of the Exodus from Egypt.

The tablet was discovered by Dr. Scott Stripling, the provost at the Bible Seminary in Katy, Texas, during an excavation at the site. The tablet was nearly mistaken for a stone but "popped out" when rinsed under water using a wet sifting process. Researchers have used X-ray tomography scanning and photography to examine the tablet, which is 2 x 2 centimeters (.8 x .8 inches) in size. The tablet includes the name of God, evidence of Hebrew writing in Israel earlier than previously known, and the earliest known writing of “Yahweh,” or the divine name of God.

However @Mrpp
The epigraphy needs to be in a row
1719177097645.png


@Mrpp

Please watch the video, because I found it to reference what I had shared. Then, with reference to the video, you'll see for yourself.

May 15, 2023 Dr. Dave A. Falk showed his disappointment about Mt. Ebal curse amulet. "This is terrible epigraphy. It's some of the worst I've ever seen", says Dr. Dave A. Falk.

Time stamp: 1:04:01
I placed it where it explains, so hopefully when you click on the video, it'll go there; if it doesn't, please go to 1:04:01

Manna Machine Alert!!! The Mt. Ebal Amulet Peer-Review Article (May 15/2023)

May 15, 2023 Dr. Dave A. Falk showed his disappointment about Mt. Ebal curse amulet. "This is terrible epigraphy. It's some of the worst I've ever seen", says Dr. Dave A. Falk.

@Mrpp please listen it's at that time stamp in video that Dr. Falk expresses


Screenshot
1719177760107.png


@Mrpp drawing is a mess

1719177894872.png


@Mrpp no orders to the characters

1719177967943.png
 
Last edited:

gnostic

The Lost One
Learn to read first before embarrasing yourself on internet. First of all explain me how would small number of bandits would take multiple cities. Especially when next pharaoh had to reastablish control over those settlements. Explain why letters say all kings lands are lost beacuse you can't. So Joshua conquest wasn't only unrest there probably just squashed some small problem. Again you cherrypicking only letters you want instead doing science and focus on all letters. Many archeologists and historians would dissagre with that and thinks beacuse of evidence that it was not some small unrest but all lands were lost.
In EA 288, Jerusalem’s mayor once again beseeches the pharaoh. Note the description of the far-reaching extent of the Habiru’s conquests: “May the king give thought to his land; the land of the king is lost. All of it has attacked me. … I am situated like a ship in the midst of the sea …. [N]ow the Habiru have taken the very cities of the king. Not a single mayor remains to the king, my lord; all are lost” (emphasis added). :) learn to read Also Merneptah stele prooves they were establish there did you even know what it is?
If you don't understand what I am writing then you shouldn't write at all. I will try be as simple as I can. Armana leeters gives description of Joshua conquest and so gives us evidence for his invasion. Suddenly change into Idea one God (with similarities) gives evidence for such interaction beetwen Israel and Egypt. Like think for moment how would Egyptians react to such event. There would be massive change in their beliefs and that exactly what happened. Egyptians specifically said they wittnesed. You didn't focus on my evidence just barely scratched surface on my end assumption on who Exodus pharaoh could be. Second command is still high in command and just beacuse they don't mention something doesn't mean anything. Diffrent writers have diffrent priorities.

No, it doesn’t.

There are no mentions of Joshua, of Israel or of Hebrew, anywhere in those Amarna correspondents.

What you seemed to be ignoring is that, Canaan was still part of Egyptian Empire, since Akhenaten's father, Amenhotep III had re-conquered Canaan. There were numbers of local Canaanite kings who were subjected to Egyptian overlordship over Canaan, so they were like “city-states”, but these rulers were like client-kings to the pharaohs.

Among the correspondents were those by Biridiya of Megiddo, especially in regards to their conflict with neighbouring Labaya of Shechem, who attacked Megiddo. that tell us, Canaan was never under one Canaanite monarch.

none of Biridiya’s letters to Akhenaten, say anything about under the thumb of Israel or the Hebrews.

Yes, I am well aware, Habiru or ʿApiru, being equated with the Hebrews, by some scholars/translators, but none of their assumptions have been verified that the Habiru. A lot of descriptions about the Habiru are too vague, to describe a specific ethnic group, let alone that of the Israelites. There are assumptions that the Habiru were multiethnic groups of West-Semitic people.

There were another group of invaders, who attacked Egypt and the Levant later in 19th dynasty, the Sea Peoples. They were like the Habiru, whose origin remained a mystery to the Egyptians, and even with modern scholars. It most likely we will never know who ʿApiru or Habiru really were.

Canaan have been been conquered many times, especially from Egypt, while they fought with more powerful kingdoms that wanted Canaan, such as the Mitanni (18th dynasty, eg Thutmose II & Amenhotep II), and later the Hitties (during the 19th dynasty of Egypt, eg Ramesses II, 13th century BCE).

Until, they can verified that the ʿApiru or Habiru are conclusively Hebrew-speaking people, there are too much doubts about their status.
 
Last edited:

Bharat Jhunjhunwala

TruthPrevails
You may accept these accounts as based on your beliefs, but there is no independent evidence or known facts to support your claims, Your addition to the account as Exodus originated in the Indus Valley contradicts the known evidence of the history of the Hebrews in the Levant and Babylonia, and the known history of Egypt,

The Pentateuch cannot be considered evidence, because it is a compilation after 600 BCE without provenance, You may teat a hypothesis that the accounts of Exodus and Joshua are historically accurate, but there is no evidence to confirm this,
Please tell me what known evidence is contradicted by Exodus from the Indus Valley. Only then it may me possible for me to respond. Further, I think the time of composition of Pentateuch does not mean that whatever written is false. The correct position is that Pentateuch was revealed to Moses around 1400 BCE and it was carried orally. So, oral evidence cannot be dismissed as non-existence and if you say that there is no evidence to confirm Joshua’s conquest then I don’t understand what would be the evidence that suits you. The problem is that when you say that no independent evidence and known facts are available then you seem to say that some independent evidence and known facts are available. Bu you do not specify what is available. Hence, you are not enabling a discussion.
 

Bharat Jhunjhunwala

TruthPrevails
"Will find evidence' is hypothetical and what you presented is even more hypothetical and at present there is no independent evidence, You have failed to present any evidence to support your case. The only thing that may have happened is that some slaves migrated out of Egypt when there was a famine. Actually the historical evidence demonstrates no such Exodus ever happened as describe. What is well documented is the exile in Babylonia,

Again scriptures and letters are not evidence in and of themselves without independent evidence to confirm them. There is abundant evidence of conflicts, wars and slavery involving Hebrews, Canaanites, and Egyptians in the history from the 16th century and 6th century BCE that he Exodus and Joshua stories can be loosely based on. There are pictures of Hebrew slaves in Egyptian carvings, The dominant wars documented are between Egyptians, Canaanites, The Northern Egypt kingdom with Egypt colonizing Canaan and no sign of Jacob or his army. There are Egyptian letters and writings that describe a history of the Levant region that is completely in conflict with the Exodus and Jacob version of the history.

As documented the Hebrew tribes were minor pastoral Canaanite tribes in the Hills of Judah until after ~900 BCE when they became a major player and a Kingdom.

There are absolutely no independent references, nor anything written by Hebrews to confirm the Pentateuch accounts nor your version.

See post #135
I am providing you very concrete evidence that the Hakkara River had stop to flow to the west at 1500 BCE. Why you do not want to apply your mind to that evidence and keep on repeating that I have not provided any evidence, how can I provide evidence, please explain.
 

Bharat Jhunjhunwala

TruthPrevails
No, it doesn’t.

There are no mentions of Joshua, of Israel or of Hebrew, anywhere in those Amarna correspondents.

What you seemed to be ignoring is that, Canaan was still part of Egyptian Empire, since Akhenaten's father, Amenhotep III had re-conquered Canaan. There were numbers of local Canaanite kings who were subjected to Egyptian overlordship over Canaan, so they were like “city-states”, but these rulers were like client-kings to the pharaohs.

Among the correspondents were those by Biridiya of Megiddo, especially in regards to their conflict with neighbouring Labaya of Shechem, who attacked Megiddo. that tell us, Canaan was never under one Canaanite monarch.

none of Biridiya’s letters to Akhenaten, say anything about under the thumb of Israel or the Hebrews.

Yes, I am well aware, Habiru or ʿApiru, being equated with the Hebrews, by some scholars/translators, but none of their assumptions have been verified that the Habiru. A lot of descriptions about the Habiru are too vague, to describe a specific ethnic group, let alone that of the Israelites. There are assumptions that the Habiru were multiethnic groups of West-Semitic people.

There were another group of invaders, who attacked Egypt and the Levant later in 19th dynasty, the Sea Peoples. They were like the Habiru, whose origin remained a mystery to the Egyptians, and even with modern scholars. It most likely we will never know who ʿApiru or Habiru really were.

Canaan have been been conquered many times, especially from Egypt, while they fought with more powerful kingdoms that wanted Canaan, such as the Mitanni (18th dynasty, eg Thutmose II & Amenhotep II), and later the Hitties (during the 19th dynasty of Egypt, eg Ramesses II, 13th century BCE).

Until, they can verified that the ʿApiru or Habiru are conclusively Hebrew-speaking people, there are too much doubts about their status.
we have to realized that absence of something does not mean that not happened. We must argue for the positive rather than negative. On the other hand, I totally agree with you that Cannan was under the control of Egyptians. Hence, Egyptian may have selectively recorded what suited them.
 

gnostic

The Lost One
we have to realized that absence of something does not mean that not happened. We must argue for the positive rather than negative. On the other hand, I totally agree with you that Cannan was under the control of Egyptians. Hence, Egyptian may have selectively recorded what suited them.

Sorry, but it not logical that the absence of evidence to be true or that it did happen.

I totally agree with you that Cannan was under the control of Egyptians. Hence, Egyptian may have selectively recorded what suited them.

Sure. But you are forgetting that Canaanite rulers have exchanger diplomatic correspondents with the 14th century BCE Amenhotep III and his son, the Akhenaten - the Amarna letters.

Amenhotep had married a number of foreign princesses, thereby achieved peace with usual enemies, through married alliances, whereas his predecessors (father and ancestors in the 18th dynasty were often at wars).

Whether there are propaganda or not, which I am sure there are, there are still writings that were recorded during most of the earlier rulers of the 18th dynasty. Contemporary records are far more reliable than those writings narrating events that centuries before the authors’ times.

Genesis was composed in the 6th century BCE, but narrated events like Adam, Noah, Abraham & Joseph, supposedly a thousand or thousands of years, would be myths, not historical texts. Moses certainly didn’t write Genesis, despite traditions say he did.

Plus, you saying that Egyptian texts are propagenda, but wouldn’t that also applied to the Old Testament & to the New Testament gospels?

Do you really believe that any scripture (eg Bible, Quran , Vedic and Hindu texts, Buddhist texts, Taoist texts, etc) to be all biased propaganda?
 

gnostic

The Lost One
Please tell me what known evidence is contradicted by Exodus from the Indus Valley. Only then it may me possible for me to respond. Further, I think the time of composition of Pentateuch does not mean that whatever written is false. The correct position is that Pentateuch was revealed to Moses around 1400 BCE and it was carried orally. So, oral evidence cannot be dismissed as non-existence and if you say that there is no evidence to confirm Joshua’s conquest then I don’t understand what would be the evidence that suits you. The problem is that when you say that no independent evidence and known facts are available then you seem to say that some independent evidence and known facts are available. Bu you do not specify what is available. Hence, you are not enabling a discussion.

There are no evidence that the Genesis, Exodus, Numbers, Leviticus & Deuternomy, all books that were traditionally attributed to Moses as its author.

The problems with Jewish traditions & Christian traditions, or any other religions’ traditions, they are terribly unreliable like legend, myth, folklore, etc, because they tends to be embellished, and cannot be verified.

If a person known to exist, the person’s life can be distorted, embellished, his or her life & personality (eg virtues) is often “idealised”, and even story/stories around that person can be invented (eg fiction).

For example, St George slaying a dragon. St George, who lived in the 3rd century CE and died in very early 4th century CE, have often being anachronistic depicted in arts as a “medieval knight”, fully decked in armoured in High & Late Middle Ages style, during that time, and even today.

The story about the dragon was invented in the 11th century, and became even more embellished in the next 2 centuries. Earlier sources in the 3rd, 4th & 5th centuries, didnt have any “dragon”.

You have heard of the saying “larger than life” before, haven’t you?

And if a person who don’t exist, like in myths, then traditions are just carrying on the same “tradition” as myth, making up more about stories about the mythological character., eg Adam, Noah, and even most likely Moses, Joshua & Samson.

And then there are some people whose lives we cannot determine to exist or not, like King David & King Solomon - where we cannot be certain. Even I cannot determine if there are historicities to them. But what I think is most likely, is that the books of Samuel, Kings, etc, of an unified and powerful kingdom in the late 11th to the mid-10th centuries BCE, didn’t happen, including Solomon’s fable wealth.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
The conclusion that the Exodus did not happen at the time and in the manner described in the Bible seems irrefutable when we examine the evidence at specific sites where the children of Israel were said to have camped for extended periods during their wandering in the desert (Nurnbers 33) and where some archaeological indication -if-present- would. almost certainly be found. According.to the biblical narrative, the children of Israel camped at Kadesh-barnea for thirty eight of the forty years of the wanderings. The general location of this place is clear from the description of the southern border of the land of Israel in Numbers 34. It has been identified by archaeologists with the large and well-watered oasis of Ein el Qudeirat in eastern Sinai, on the border between modern Israel and Egypt. The name Kadesh was probably preserved over the centuries in the name of a nearby smaller spring called Ein Qadis. A small mound with the remains of a Late Iron Age fort stands at the center of this oasis. Yet repeated excavations and surveys throughout the entire area have not provided even the slightest evidence for activity in the Late Bronze Age, not even a single shred left by a fleeing band (600,000 -1.000.000*) of frightened refugees.

Ezion-geber is another place reported to be a camping place of the children of Israel. It is mentioned in other places in the Bible as a later port town on the northern tip of the Gulf of Aqaba, has led to its identification by archaeologists at a mound located on the modern border between Israel and Jordan, half way between the towns of Eilat and Aqaba. Excavations here in the years I938-I940, revealed impressive Late Iron Age remains, but no trace whatsoever of Late Bronze occupation. From the long list of encampments In the wilderness, Kadesh-barnea-and Ezion-geber are the only ones that can safely be identified, yet they revealed no trace of the wandering Israelites.

Repeated archaeological surveys in all regions of the peninsula, including the mountainous area, around the traditional site of Mount' Sinai, near Saint Catherine's Monastery, have yielded only negative evidence: not even a single sherd, no structure, not a single house; no trace of an ancient encampment. One may argue that a relatively small band of wandering Israelites cannot be expected to leave material remains behind. But modern archaeological techniques are quite capable of tracing even the very meager remains of hunter-gatherers and pastoral nomads all over the world. Indeed, the archaeological record from the Sinai peninsula discloses evidence for pastoral activity in such eras as the third millennium BCE and the Hellenistic and Byzantine periods. There is simply no such evidence at the supposed time of the Exodus in the thirteenth century BCE

Extract from The Bible Unearthed.
* My numbers according to the Bible.
One would think that if 2.5 million people lived there for 38 years, there would be some evidence left behind, like burials, fire pits, animal bones, broken pots and so on. And LOTS of them.
 
Last edited:
Top