Experiencing God

[Muffled]

How can you 'believe what you know?' That is illogical. If you know, then you do not believe, and vice-versa. Knowing is certainty. So are you certain about what the spirit tells you?

The statement by RF management is a statement of certainty, is it not?

I believed I knew my car keys were in my pocket however my daughter found them in the car with the car running. Believing I know something and actually knowing it can be two different things.
RF is simply saying that although one may think he knows something it is still just a belief. All I really know about the car keys is that I found them on the kitchen counter in the morning. I have no way of knowing if my daughter told me the truth. So it appears that our experiences tend to hold the best knowledge but even those can be clouded by perception ie water illusions on the highway on a hot dry day.

 

[Muffled]

What you see and how you see it is a reflection of what is in your own mind. You are obviously still caught in the throes of duality, thinking 'worthy' and 'unworthy'. The non-dual view would say: 'I am neither worthy, nor not-worthy'. Then you are free, which is really the goal of the spiritual experience.

You say 'some see a bit more clearly than others'; what do you suppose is in them that allows them to do so?

I believe you would be free if there were no God but there is so you will either be worthy in His eyes or not. I believe if your spiritual goal is to extirpate God then it is not a worthy goal.

 

[Blastcat]

I believe you would be free if there were no God but there is so you will either be worthy in His eyes or not. I believe if your spiritual goal is to extirpate God then it is not a worthy goal.

But there is so.. lol.

Well you believe in things.
Should you be congratulated for having beliefs?

 

[Sonofason]

I believed I knew my car keys were in my pocket however my daughter found them in the car with the car running. Believing I know something and actually knowing it can be two different things.
RF is simply saying that although one may think he knows something it is still just a belief. All I really know about the car keys is that I found them on the kitchen counter in the morning. I have no way of knowing if my daughter told me the truth. So it appears that our experiences tend to hold the best knowledge but even those can be clouded by perception ie water illusions on the highway on a hot dry day.

I agree with you. In a sense, it's like the concept of certainty. I can say that I am certain that some event has happened. But then someone might ask me, "well how certain are you"?

Well, to be certain is to "known for sure; established beyond doubt." If a person is certain, there can be no doubt about the certainty of it. If it is certain, it is certain. There is no such thing as 50% certain. You are either certain, or you are not. And since no one can prove beyond any doubt that they even exist, (in my opinion), there is no such thing as certainty at all. And so you would be right, that no one really knows for sure anything, and that all we think we know is nothing more than a belief that what we think we know is true.

 

[godnotgod]

I agree with you. In a sense, it's like the concept of certainty. I can say that I am certain that some event has happened. But then someone might ask me, "well how certain are you"?

Well, to be certain is to "known for sure; established beyond doubt." If a person is certain, there can be no doubt about the certainty of it. If it is certain, it is certain. There is no such thing as 50% certain. You are either certain, or you are not. And since no one can prove beyond any doubt that they even exist, (in my opinion), there is no such thing as certainty at all. And so you would be right, that no one really knows for sure anything, and that all we think we know is nothing more than a belief that what we think we know is true.

The problem here is the self, in this case it is propped up as 'the knower of the known'. So the question one might ask is: 'Who, or what, is it that knows?', and 'Who, or what, is it that thinks it can be certain or uncertain?'. Those who have spent any serious time with this issue have come up with the same answer: there is no such self; no such 'experiencer of the experience'*: there is only the experience itself. Without a self to question the veracity of the experience via Logic, Reason, and Analysis, there remains only the seeing of the experience as it is being experienced. Because there is no thought occurring during the experience, there is no idea of a self that is created via thought. One simply sees things as they are, and if one sees oneself in delusion, then again, we must ask: 'Who, or what, is it that sees oneself in delusion?' It is THAT which sees oneself in delusion that is not in delusion. Otherwise, it would not be capable of detecting the delusion to begin with. That there exists a self that is the experiencer of the experience is the delusion. To see and know this is to awaken.

*A metaphor that might be helpful in understanding this is the idea of a whirlpool. We look at whirling water in a stream and call it a 'whirlpool', but in reality, there is no such 'whirlpool', as 'whirlpool' is nothing more than whirling water. It is not a thing, but an action. In the same manner, we are not static entities called 'I'; 'I' is an illusion; a self-created principle. We are, instead, an action. We are the experience itself, without an experiencer of the experience. It's just a mistake.

 

[Trichakra]

Do you believe that God notices what we do?

Yes, I believe that god notice everything about us.

 

[paarsurrey]

Experiencing God

There is no restriction in having experience of G-d. In our age G-d conversed with Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, so we have a confirmation that G-d has not ceased to converse with one. Right? Please
Regards

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I'm surprised I overlooked this question. It's a good one.

I am amazed that so many believers that have had "spiritual" experiences won't share their experiences with others. It ought not surprise me however, as I too have had "spiritual" experiences that I just will not share with anyone. I gather that the telling of such experiences puts one at risk of throwing one's pearls to the swine.

My experience of God has actually brought me to a point where I no longer require faith to believe in God. I am absolutely certain of his existence and presence in my life.

So I guess that leaves me with a question for those who have had God experiences. What do you think it was that you did which enabled you to experience what you experienced? What did you do to invoke God's attention?

I'll talk about the spirits since god is life; and, by your very existence, you are experiencing life because you are alive and living it.

I knew spirits (gods if one likes) existed for years since I saw a spirit, experienced one physically both in my earlier years and recently about four year years ago after my grandmother passed.

I actually didn't do anything. I started my genealogy after my grandmother passed because I always feel the spirits are calling me and they tell me things like "call your father" or something. I experienced it when I was told to call my grandmother and I kept trying to get in touch. There was a reason and I couldn't pin point it deep inside that I needed to talk with her when I haven't talked with her in over 20 years. Then, I was at the mall and my aunt called me and said my grandmother passed away. She was dying in the hospital and no one told me.

I had spirits tell me to call my father since his liver was getting to him. I finally called and he had two surgeries. The first didn't work so they had to risk doing a second one to help his liver. Now he seems do be doing fine. I can only thank my family for that.

Prayers and rituals usually "invoke" their presence. However, I prefer prayer and just living everyday until I know a spirit has contacted me. I let them contact me until I find out more stronger or confirming ways to contact them beyond just ritual and offerings.

Sharing experiences are usually private; however, I'm not too much of a private person. The only think I ask is respect and show interest in who I am because I am well familiar with Christianity, and most people here are Christians, and I find interest in how they believe. I only had JW asked me more about my faith. No one else asks. My co-worker refused to talk about it saying it was satan talking to me. She also was trying to say my experiences were all medical related.

People are rude and that's another reason for not sharing.

I agree and liken to what you say. What I believe is no longer a belief but fact. I've had many confirmations and regardless if I call them spirits, family, or gods, they are still with us and guide us daily.

 

[Muffled]

Experiencing God

There is no restriction in having experience of G-d. In our age G-d conversed with Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, so we have a confirmation that G-d has not ceased to converse with one. Right? Please
Regards

I have my doubts about Mirza. I believe it is quite possible the originator of the Sikh religion heard from God. Some of the ones afterwards may have but God doesn't have grandchildren.

 

[Muffled]

I'm surprised I overlooked this question. It's a good one.



I'll talk about the spirits since god is life; and, by your very existence, you are experiencing life because you are alive and living it.

I knew spirits (gods if one likes) existed for years since I saw a spirit, experienced one physically both in my earlier years and recently about four year years ago after my grandmother passed.

I actually didn't do anything. I started my genealogy after my grandmother passed because I always feel the spirits are calling me and they tell me things like "call your father" or something. I experienced it when I was told to call my grandmother and I kept trying to get in touch. There was a reason and I couldn't pin point it deep inside that I needed to talk with her when I haven't talked with her in over 20 years. Then, I was at the mall and my aunt called me and said my grandmother passed away. She was dying in the hospital and no one told me.

I had spirits tell me to call my father since his liver was getting to him. I finally called and he had two surgeries. The first didn't work so they had to risk doing a second one to help his liver. Now he seems do be doing fine. I can only thank my family for that.

Prayers and rituals usually "invoke" their presence. However, I prefer prayer and just living everyday until I know a spirit has contacted me. I let them contact me until I find out more stronger or confirming ways to contact them beyond just ritual and offerings.

Sharing experiences are usually private; however, I'm not too much of a private person. The only think I ask is respect and show interest in who I am because I am well familiar with Christianity, and most people here are Christians, and I find interest in how they believe. I only had JW asked me more about my faith. No one else asks. My co-worker refused to talk about it saying it was satan talking to me. She also was trying to say my experiences were all medical related.

People are rude and that's another reason for not sharing.

I agree and liken to what you say. What I believe is no longer a belief but fact. I've had many confirmations and regardless if I call them spirits, family, or gods, they are still with us and guide us daily.

I believe one should be worthy of respect. I get respect the old fashioned way. I earn it.

I believe that is a bit presumptive but the general concept is that a demon can pose as a familiar spirit. The Biblical suggestion is made to test every spirit. A spirit may seem friendly but there is only one Good Spirit and that is God.

I run into this often on RF but my feeling is that I have something worthwhile to say so I will say it whether it is received well or not. I appreciate your candor in relating your experiences. I believe people may find it helpful. My wife thinks of celebrities just before they die. She is not spiritually minded so she doesn't question the source but it can't be her own mind because her own mind can't tell what is happening in someone else's life. It doesn't seem to serve any purpose other than to weird people out.

 

[Sonofason]

I'm surprised I overlooked this question. It's a good one.



I'll talk about the spirits since god is life; and, by your very existence, you are experiencing life because you are alive and living it.

I knew spirits (gods if one likes) existed for years since I saw a spirit, experienced one physically both in my earlier years and recently about four year years ago after my grandmother passed.

I actually didn't do anything. I started my genealogy after my grandmother passed because I always feel the spirits are calling me and they tell me things like "call your father" or something. I experienced it when I was told to call my grandmother and I kept trying to get in touch. There was a reason and I couldn't pin point it deep inside that I needed to talk with her when I haven't talked with her in over 20 years. Then, I was at the mall and my aunt called me and said my grandmother passed away. She was dying in the hospital and no one told me.

I had spirits tell me to call my father since his liver was getting to him. I finally called and he had two surgeries. The first didn't work so they had to risk doing a second one to help his liver. Now he seems do be doing fine. I can only thank my family for that.

Prayers and rituals usually "invoke" their presence. However, I prefer prayer and just living everyday until I know a spirit has contacted me. I let them contact me until I find out more stronger or confirming ways to contact them beyond just ritual and offerings.

Sharing experiences are usually private; however, I'm not too much of a private person. The only think I ask is respect and show interest in who I am because I am well familiar with Christianity, and most people here are Christians, and I find interest in how they believe. I only had JW asked me more about my faith. No one else asks. My co-worker refused to talk about it saying it was satan talking to me. She also was trying to say my experiences were all medical related.

People are rude and that's another reason for not sharing.

I agree and liken to what you say. What I believe is no longer a belief but fact. I've had many confirmations and regardless if I call them spirits, family, or gods, they are still with us and guide us daily.

I am sure I must have told this story somewhere in this thread, but I will tell it again. I cannot say exactly where it came from, whether it be angel or demon, God or the devil, some collective conscience, or something from within my own self, but quite a few years ago, I was living with my aged grandfather in his house. I was a member of a rock band, and we were doing a show about a two hours drive from home. Our drummer lived between the two locations, and was having a BBQ the following day which I planned on attending, and it was very late, so I stayed at his place that night. I was awoken from my sleep by a voice shouting my name, telling me to "go home". It was frightening. I sat up and listened, and the voice I heard said my name again, and said "you have to go home".

Immediately, I got up and went home to find an ambulance in my driveway. I ran inside to find my grandfather had suffered a major heart attack. I got to speak with him for about 10 minutes. And he died.

 

[paarsurrey]

Yes, I believe that god notice everything about us.

I agree with one. G-d notices, hears our prayers and helps us.
Please

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

I have my doubts about Mirza. I believe it is quite possible the originator of the Sikh religion heard from God. Some of the ones afterwards may have but God doesn't have grandchildren.

And your arguments for your doubts? Please
Regards

 

[Tabu]

Any one can have an experience of God through meditation , if they allow themselves to experience it.

 

[Sonofason]

Any one can have an experience of God through meditation , if they allow themselves to experience it.

Absolutely, I agree.

The other day, working in the office, I asked my boss a question. He was sitting at his desk working on something that must have been/might have been something important to him. He didn't hear a word I said. He didn't even acknowledge that I was speaking to him.

If we desire to hear God, if we desire to even notice God, we must be in a right state of mind that is conducive to hearing and noticing Him. I would say that being in a state of meditation is probably a more conducive state of mind to experiencing God than our states of mind throughout most of the rest of our days. However, even while meditating, our minds may not be open to consequential experiences of God. I believe that if we desire to hear someone, the focus of our attention ought to be on listening and hearing that person we desire to hear. Prayer, supplication, worship and praise can be effective as well.

 

[YmirGF]

Any one can have an experience of God through meditation , if they allow themselves to experience it.

Indeed, imagination is a powerful tool...... and can aid one into believing all kinds of nonsense.

 

[YmirGF]

Absolutely, I agree.

The other day, working in the office, I asked my boss a question. He was sitting at his desk working on something that must have been/might have been something important to him. He didn't hear a word I said. He didn't even acknowledge that I was speaking to him.

If we desire to hear God, if we desire to even notice God, we must be in a right state of mind that is conducive to hearing and noticing Him. I would say that being in a state of meditation is probably a more conducive state of mind to experiencing God than our states of mind throughout most of the rest of our days. However, even while meditating, our minds may not be open to consequential experiences of God. I believe that if we desire to hear someone, the focus of our attention ought to be on listening and hearing that person we desire to hear. Prayer is another effective means to experiencing God.

Indeed. With the "proper" mindset, imagination will flesh out expectations ...

 

[Sonofason]

Indeed. With the "proper" mindset, imagination will flesh out expectations ...

I bet you never experience God...not with that attitude.

 

[YmirGF]

I bet you never experience God...not with that attitude.

Evidently, you don't fully grasp the magnitude of what I am saying.

EDIT: If folks understood what I am meaning they would quickly understand that I am suggesting that they can literally meet the object of their adoration.... as reality will conform to your expectations. Reality, quite literally, molds itself to the understanding and expectations of the individual. If you expect to interact with a god of some kind - so you shall - if you believe.

The real fun begins when one goes beyond their preconceptions of how reality ought to behave.

 

[Sonofason]

Evidently, you don't fully grasp the magnitude of what I am saying.

I think your imagination is getting the best of you.