Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Now ironic on the other hand.....
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Faith in permanent death
- Thread starter 839311
- Start date
Now ironic on the other hand.....
Otherright
Otherright
The Penrose-Hameroff Orch-OR.
Sure it is. Emergence occurs when simple processes interact to form a complex system. What definition are you going by?Windows 7 is not an emergent property of your computer.
Software is nothing more than the operations of the hardware. Transistors process voltages, but when organized in a specific way, we get something complex like Windows 7, Wikipedia, or the operation of this forum.
Nope, looks like the same hand to me.
Otherright
Otherright
But can you prove death is permanent?
Never? More parties? Hanging out with friends and family for millenia? Spending time with beautiful girls for eons? Movies, music, video games, sports, adventures, food. FOOD!!!
You never found the idea of an afterlife attractive? I dont believe that for a second.
St Giordano Bruno
Well-Known Member
Certainly not in a supernatural sense such as with Christian eschatology or discarnate spirits like ghosts or fairies.
Otherright
Otherright
Software is not operations of the hardware, they are operations for the hardware. Your OS is installed on your system, not a product that emerges because of the system.
Emergence:
1) Coming into view, existence, or notice.
2) Rising above a surrounding medium.
3) Arising or occurring unexpectedly.
Wet is an emergent property of water.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
I can't prove anything. This doesn't mean I need to engage in wild speculation based on wishful thinking and fear of scary unknowns. It appears we cease to exist upon death. There is zero objective evidence that anything other than this occurs. I don't feel the need to fuel fantasies to ease any fears.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Yes, it does. I guess mine just doesn't have an admin tattoo on it though.
Otherright
Otherright
Show me scientific evidence beyond the observation of death that nothing happens. Because I can show you evidence in physics and quantum biology that says not necessarily.
In what way is this testable? What tests has it passed?
Can a test be set up such that it could potentially falsify this theory if this theory were not true?
Besides, a brief view of this shows that they're talking about physical phenomena, so even if it was true, what makes you certain that it couldn't be replicated in another way?
What do you mean software is not operations of the hardware? Do you know what it means for software to be installed on hardware?
The OS is nothing more than information; data that is stored in (and in the physical world, consists of), memory and the ability to run the processes that the program describes that is held within this memory.
It's stored in some variety of non-volatile memory, and then the hardware can run the program via transistors and volatile forms of memory. It's all just hardware; software is the information held within that hardware, and is just a conceptual entity.
cheap. :yes:
Ahhh, thats better. But this isn't wild speculation, these possibilities are reasonable, some more likely than others. Second, its not wishful thinking. The possibility, what I consider a remote possibility, that when we die we do die permanently, isnt all that hard to deal with. There will be nothing. Thats not so bad as I see it. Its definetly preferable to one of the options I mentioned, that when we die our consciousness continues to exist in a kind of basic and undesirable condition for perhaps decillions of years. So, turning the table on you, perhaps assuming that when we die we die permanently may be a way to try to escape the harsh possibility of such a ******* existence.
Ok, maybe if I could choose it for a limited time. Maybe. Big fat maybe.
Otherright
Otherright
Yes, thank you. I know exactly what hardware and software are and how they work and this is getting way off track without you yourself, adding anything to it or explaining any meaningful position.
How do you think genuine self-aware intelligence will be possible in computers?
[youtube]WlBiLNN1NhQ[/youtube]
YouTube - ‪Always Look On The Bright Side of Life‬‏
See, that is sortta my point, 83. Life isn 't everything. Quality _counts_.
DarkSun
:eltiT
Is there evidence for a permanent death? If not, belief in a permanent death is faith-based. That is what OP is saying.
If I were to speculate, I'd say self-aware intelligence may be possible as humans begin to understand more fully how consciousness works in the brain. With billions of neurons, and trillions of interconnections between those neurons, I don't envision this occurring any time soon. A system meant to emulate the brain, or even to improve on it, may be a way to achieve true artificial sapience.
But then again, I'm not saying it's a certainty that AI will one day exist. Stating that such-and-such a thing will never happen in the future is a pretty bold and unsupported claim, especially when, after pressing, it's "supported" by incorrect notions of what software is or by assuming that computers would operate in the future very similarly to how they operate now.