Faith

[halbhh]

Also, can we do anything to obtain faith, or is out of our hands?

Maybe someone answered, but one direct answer from Paul is in Romans --
Romans 10:17 Consequently, faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of Christ.

And this is also lining up with some things Christ said directly also, about listening and hearing, and other verses about listening. (listening/hearing meaning not looking to prove an idea or a doctrine, but truly listening as if one is the student, and Christ the teacher (instead of the other way around such as only looking to prove one's own doctrine (which is trying to be the Teacher))).

So....we want to read Christ's words in a very different way than they are often read by many. Instead of talking over Him with a doctrine or agenda...we want to truly listen. So we are 100% silent, listening, and He is the only one doing the talking.

 

[james bond]

Faith is a gift of God. True faith is dead without works btw ...

What can you do to obtain more faith? You exercise faith. That is put it in operation. Trusting God everyday. Start with small things and build your faith up. You start small ... I lost my keys, I pray. I find them. My faith grows and I can pray for greater things next time. Simple.

True faith is not dead without works. We want to place our faith in Jesus and his sacrifice and that he is the Lord. It does not mean that works is not important, but through faith we become a good tree that bears good fruit, i.e. works follows naturally. In time, Jesus will see that we are all good trees that bear good fruit in his garden.

 

[Jeremiah Ames]

You're speaking in allegories. How is the term objectively defined?

Huh? Knowledge based on ignorance? I thought it was based on knowledge or evidence.

Why can one not learn without unsupported belief? Shouldn't belief be provisional, pending adequate evidence?
Faith can never lead one astray? Hasn't mankind made all sorts of bad decisions based on faith; on guesswork?
What is "faith unsubstantiated?" All faith is unsubstantiated, by definition. If it were substantiated it would no longer be faith.

I cannot see how faith leads to knowledge.
In my thinking:
We hear facts (or truths, whatever you want to call them), from any number of possible sources in the world.
These facts sit in our mind, and are effectively useless. Until we use our rational abilities to think about the facts, and weigh them alongside many other facts. Eventually, we have knowledge.

 

[Jeremiah Ames]

You're kinda weird.

Faith is a universalized need. Humans actually crave something to believe in. I think Dawkins wrote The God Delusion, but the one having a delusion is him. Left to their own devices, even atheists always always find something to worship, whether luck or the state or nihilism (death).

Kinda weird??

You’ve gotta be kidding me?

I’m totally weird. No ‘kinda’ here.

 

[74x12]

True faith is not dead without works. We want to place our faith in Jesus and his sacrifice and that he is the Lord. It does not mean that works is not important, but through faith we become a good tree that bears good fruit, i.e. works follows naturally. In time, Jesus will see that we are all good trees that bear good fruit in his garden.

Well James said in his epistle faith without works is dead. (James 2:17) I think what we should know is that you can't bear fruit without works. So to perfect fruit of the Spirit does take effort. And faith is a fruit of the Spirit.

Just looking through the list of the fruits of the Spirit in Galatians 5:22-23. We find that all of these have to do with actual works. For example love is good but in 1st John 3:18 we find that we shouldn't just love in word only; but in deed which is to mean actions. So that is works perfecting love. All the other fruits are similarly made perfect through works or through trouble or persecution.

 

[james bond]

Well James said in his epistle faith without works is dead. (James 2:17) I think what we should know is that you can't bear fruit without works. So to perfect fruit of the Spirit does take effort. And faith is a fruit of the Spirit.

Just looking through the list of the fruits of the Spirit in Galatians 5:22-23. We find that all of these have to do with actual works. For example love is good but in 1st John 3:18 we find that we shouldn't just love in word only; but in deed which is to mean actions. So that is works perfecting love. All the other fruits are similarly made perfect through works or through trouble or persecution.

What you are doing is quote mining James and taking what he said out of context. God doesn't want us to use works as a resume for getting into heaven. Then, one misses the point of what our Savior and Lord Jesus did for us. That the sacrifice of his only Son was promised by God in order to rectify Adam's sin and our sins because he loved his children so much. Your quote mining contradicts other passages in Scripture.

Works is not what will lead us to salvation nor guarantee a place for us in heaven. Instead, God tells us that faith will lead us to want to do works and not for the rewards. It is in and of itself one's own reward. What James is talking about is comparing true faith verse false faith and that false faith is the one that is dead. It could just be based on works thinking this will lead to salvation. James states true faith will lead to good works.

 

[74x12]

God doesn't want us to use works as a resume for getting into heaven.

No one said that and you can't.

Works is not what will lead us to salvation nor guarantee a place for us in heaven.

No one said that either. I think you possibly completely misunderstood the concept.

What is your explanation of the parable of the talents?

Matthew 25:14-30 (KJV)
14 For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
15 And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
16 Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
17 And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
18 But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
19 After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
20 And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
22 He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
23 His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
24 Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
29 For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

[stvdv]

As some know my experiences of what brought me back to Christianity that had much to do with repeated premonitions I had that went on for almost two years, I truly came to believe that this was the Holy Spirit dragging me back. However, with that being said, it still was my choice through "free will" to return.

Thank you for sharing. Experiences like this take believing to another level ... like you said "I truly came to believe"

However, with that being said, I don't believe our "calling", or whatever one wants to call it, only relates to just one religion.

Thanks for sharing. Wonderful.

it still was my choice through "free will" to return

Sometimes I wonder, is it my choice?
It was His Grace I had premonitions, maybe there is no "Choice". Feels like God called me back. Like scientific proof, once you have it, no way back

 

[Ponder This]

Where does it come from?


My thoughts: From the good works that we do. So, I see faith alone as an evil insanity created by the Devil to lead people astray. Makes people believe that they don’t actually have to DO anything.


Also, can we do anything to obtain faith, or is out of our hands?

What say you?

Faith is a spiritual quality that does not arise from any physical phenomena or mental calculation or emotional exertion. Or to be more precise, it transcends these.
It is trust of the highest form and truest Loyalty.
It can be blind to reason or based on consistent repeatable events, which demonstrates it's independence of mental calculation.
A burst of fanaticism can fade when put to a test or a Love can endure trials beyond anything you've imagined, which demonstrates its independence from emotional exertion.
It can relate to any particular physical activity or to no physical activities at all.
Thus, having examined its nature as independent of physics, mind, and emotion, what is left?
Spirit. Spirit embodies that which is transcendent of the temporal phenomena which arise and decline. It may be embodied in any particular phenomenon, but is not bound to that phenomenon.

And so Faith may be cultivated in the same way that all spiritual qualities are cultivated, through practice of awareness, meditation, prayer, and chastity.

 

[Neuropteron]

Hi,

According to Hebrews 11:1 “faith is “the assured expectation (hypostasis) and evident demonstration (elegkhos) of unseen realities”. A related noun in Hebrew is ‘emeth’ meaning truth.

The two Greek qualifiers ‘epistasis’ and ‘hypostasis’ in this verse are those also used in relation to contractual signing and authorization of title deeds of unseen purchases, wherein an official seal gives reason for confidence in the unseen value or acquisition.

Living by faith is contrasted in walking by sight or outward appearances: “We are walking by faith not by sight” said the apostle at 2 Corinthians 5:7.

The Bible author invites his worshipers to ‘test him out’; that is to do his will and then experience his blessing. Malachi 3:10 reads:

“Bring the full tithes (ie. follow God’s instructions/laws etc) into the storehouse, that there may be food in my house; and thereby put me to the test, says the Lord of hosts, if I will not open the windows of heaven for you and pour down for you an overflowing blessing.’ (Malachi 3:10 RSV)

How faith may be acquired, cultivated and blessed is demonstrated by Bible life accounts of Abraham, Noah, Naomi and Ruth, Mary and all those listed in Hebrews chapter 11 which are a good study on this quality which like a garden must be cultivated.

Reading the bible with an honest mind and heart develops a basis for faith and acting on what is therein ‘evident’ leads to a personal friendship with the creator. Faith is also a by-product or ‘fruitage’ of Yahweh’s holy spirit. (Galatians 5:22,23)

 

[Native]

In science, somebody can have faith in a new cosmological idea and assume some possible facts which become a new theory and if thoroughly scientific analyzed and confirmed, this becomes knowledge.

In the western religion, several doctrines are just claims without any natural explanations at all and thus, they are left to the belief category.

 

[metis]

Sometimes I wonder, is it my choice?
It was His Grace I had premonitions, maybe there is no "Choice". Feels like God called me back. Like scientific proof, once you have it, no way back

Yep, I hear ya.

 

[Hawkins]

Faith means "Faith in Jesus Christ" will be assessed as a judgment to see if one is saved. However who can evaluate faith except for God/Jesus Christ.

The question boils down to, can you evaluate correctly a human's faith. That's not possible. We can however roughly tell one's faith by how he behaves. How he behaves reflects what faith he might possess by an evaluation from other humans.

So if you don't have good works while you can, by a human evaluation you may not possess the faith as required by the New Covenant for you to be deemed the saved. This is an evaluation for yourself as well as from other humans.

 

[Valjean]

Faith means "Faith in Jesus Christ" will be assessed as a judgment to see if one is saved. However who can evaluate faith except for God/Jesus Christ.

The question boils down to, can you evaluate correctly a human's faith. That's not possible. We can however roughly tell one's faith by how he behaves. How he behaves reflects what faith he might possess by an evaluation from other humans.

So there is no faith in any but the Christian religion?

"Evaluate faith?" Why would my ability to put a value on someone else's belief be of any value?

Behavior? I don't see "good Christians" behaving any better than good Muslims or good atheist Buddhists.
"By their fruits shall ye know them" Who has the better record, Christians or secularists?

 

[Ayjaydee]

Faith means "Faith in Jesus Christ" will be assessed as a judgment to see if one is saved. However who can evaluate faith except for God/Jesus Christ.

The question boils down to, can you evaluate correctly a human's faith. That's not possible. We can however roughly tell one's faith by how he behaves. How he behaves reflects what faith he might possess by an evaluation from other humans.

So if you don't have good works while you can, by a human evaluation you may not possess the faith as required by the New Covenant for you to be deemed the saved. This is an evaluation for yourself as well as from other humans.

Saved for what?

 

[Valjean]

Faith is poorly supported belief. It has nothing to do with religious orthodoxy, per se.