FBI Finds Jan 6th not Planned or Coordinated By Trump or Far-Right Groups

[Bodie]

The only thing I'd add is that I'm not really sure what the commission is going to accomplish. A report? If so, no conservative will ever believe it (few will even bother to read it), and you can be sure right wing media will go into overdrive to tell their followers that it's just a product of the "deep state" and "socialist/communist Democrats".

Such a strawman you have there, read post #20, Pelosi sidestepped standard procedure to pack her "commission" with people who already agreed with her to ensure the "correct" outcome. No deep state involved, just corrupt democratic politicians attempting to justify their own narrative for political gain under the pretense of bipartisanship.

 

[Jose Fly]

Such a strawman you have there, read post #20, Pelosi sidestepped standard procedure to pack her "commission" with people who already agreed with her to ensure the "correct" outcome.

Um....no....she acted to keep diehard Trumpists who believe the big lie of the "stolen election" off of the committee.

No deep state involved, just corrupt democratic politicians attempting to justify their own narrative for political gain under the pretense of bipartisanship.

And what "narrative" is that?

 

[Bodie]

Um....no....she acted to keep diehard Trumpists who believe the big lie of the "stolen election" off of the committee.

You mean she flouted traditional practices to reject the minority appointments In favour of those that agreed with her big lie

And what "narrative" is that?

That Trump is guilty no matter what the actual facts are, it's pure political theatre

 

[Jose Fly]

You mean she flouted traditional practices to reject the minority appointments In favour of those that agreed with her big lie

What lie, and what evidence do you have that the Republicans who are on the committee support it?

That Trump is guilty no matter what the actual facts are, it's pure political theatre

I haven't seen any indication of that. In fact, I'd say it'd be difficult to make such an accusation before they've really even started their investigation or released a report. Now, if during the investigation they manipulate the process towards a specific end and then release a report that reaches conclusions with no evidentiary support, then you'll have a point.

But right now it looks to me as if you're engaging in exactly the sort of naked partisanship you're accusing the Democrats of.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Edit: Had to check and make sure this wasn’t the Right-Wing-Nut Dir. But it’s OK. We can speak the truth here. The gif stays.

I rest my case.

 

[Bodie]

What lie, and what evidence do you have that the Republicans who are on the committee support it?.

I gave names in post #20
Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

“What we know now is enough. The President of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing,” Cheney said in a statement. “There has never been a greater betrayal by a President of the United States of his office and his oath to the Constitution. I will vote to impeach the President.”

-Liz Cheney

"Cheney is the second House Republican to vow to follow Democrats in impeaching Trump after Rep. John Katko (R-NY) said he would earlier Tuesday. Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) announced he would vote to impeach Trump shortly after Cheney did. A fourth House Republican, Rep. Fred Upton (R-MI), announced late Tuesday that he would vote in favor of impeachment as well."

Wyoming Rep. Liz Cheney Says She Will Vote to Impeach Trump Over Capitol Riot

BEFORE ANY INVESTIGATION

Is that enough evidence for you? They already made up their minds in January, that is why Pelosi wanted them on her panel.

Now, name ANY fair court that would appoint a juror that publicly stated that they would convict before the trial or any evidence weighed.

Just to refresh your memory:
FBI finds no evidence that Trump and his allies were directly involved with organizing the violence of the Capitol riot: report


source: Trump Not Directly Involved in Organizing Capitol-Riot Violence: Report

 

[Laika]

Now, name ANY fair court that would appoint a juror that publicly stated that they would convict before the trial or any evidence weighed.

Honestly, that's actually true as people are meant to be presumed innocent. But admittedly this already has happened once when the victims of the insurrection served as judge and jury at the crime scene by voting on the impeachment trial in Congress. What weird times we live in.

 

[Jose Fly]

I gave names in post #20
Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

“What we know now is enough. The President of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing,” Cheney said in a statement. “There has never been a greater betrayal by a President of the United States of his office and his oath to the Constitution. I will vote to impeach the President.”

-Liz Cheney

"Cheney is the second House Republican to vow to follow Democrats in impeaching Trump after Rep. John Katko (R-NY) said he would earlier Tuesday. Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) announced he would vote to impeach Trump shortly after Cheney did. A fourth House Republican, Rep. Fred Upton (R-MI), announced late Tuesday that he would vote in favor of impeachment as well."

Wyoming Rep. Liz Cheney Says She Will Vote to Impeach Trump Over Capitol Riot

BEFORE ANY INVESTIGATION

Um....that was part of the impeachment hearings in the House, not the investigation by the Jan 6 Committee. And you do realize that the Jan. 6 Committee isn't just looking at Trump's role in the attempted insurrection, right?

I mean....if you're worried about what the House Committee is going to conclude about Trump, you're a bit late to the party. The House already concluded that Trump was responsible for inciting insurrection (they voted to impeach him for it), and even Mitch McConnell agreed (he just didn't see any point in convicting Trump after he was already out of office, which in hindsight was a mistake).

The Committee is working to fully investigate all aspects of what happened that day, what led up to it, and how to prevent it from happening again. So maybe stop worrying so much about your dear leader.

Is that enough evidence for you? They already made up their minds in January, that is why Pelosi wanted them on her panel.

Now, name ANY fair court that would appoint a juror that publicly stated that they would convict before the trial or any evidence weighed.

Who else should she have gotten? Republicans tried to put diehard Trumpists who believe in the cause behind the insurrection on the committee. Would that have been okay with you?

EDIT: Also, this isn't a "court", nor is it a trial. It's a House Committee that's conducting an investigation. If they find evidence of criminal activity, they will likely refer it to the appropriate law enforcement agencies and let them take it from there. Then after they've done their own investigation, there might be a trial.

Try and keep the processes straight.

 

[Kooky]

Please forward any questions and concerns to the F.B.I. regarding their findings and tell them where they are wrong in their assessment, who knows? you may just crack the case WIDE OPEN!

You mean their assessment that conspiracy charges are hard to prove even though they very definitely found evidence of milita and Neonazi groups planning their assault weeks in advance?

 

[Sand Dancer]

Of course. The left never accepts the facts. Just their agenda and propaganda.

Still with the generalizing...

 

[Bodie]

Um....that was part of the impeachment hearings in the House, not the investigation by the Jan 6 Committee.

You asked for evidence that the appointees were biased, I gave it to you.if you have no problem with two people that said they would impeach Trump for things the F.B.I says there is no supporting evidence for serving on the committee then I'd say you have no desire for truth or fairness and you are either being willfully ignorant or purposely stupid.

 

[Brinne]

Bit of a misleading thread title for the contents of the article presented.

The article goes on to say that far-right groups had planned and stockpiled equipment for an infiltration of the capital -- however they had no grand plans as to what to do after. Yet, that's still a far-right group with intent to infiltrate our nation's capital. If it was a leftist group we'd be hearing night and day about the "failed marxist socialist revolution of January 6th!"

Section of the article in question:

" FBI investigators did find that cells of protesters, including followers of the far-right Oath Keepers and Proud Boys groups, had aimed to break into the Capitol. But they found no evidence that the groups had serious plans about what to do if they made it inside, the sources said. "​

 

[Bodie]

You mean their assessment that conspiracy charges are hard to prove even though they very definitely found evidence of milita and Neonazi groups planning their assault weeks in advance?

innocent until proven guilty, that is the standard.

 

[Bodie]

If it was a leftist group we'd be hearing night and day about the "failed marxist socialist revolution of January 6th!"

Strawman

 

[lewisnotmiller]

This isn't exactly current but we still see the false narratives in media that Trump and far right groups coordinated or planned Jan 6th, but it's still a popular lie that is still parroted even though the FBI found little evidence of it.

I'm somewhat unaware of those narratives, but might be due to my distance from it (being Australian).
Were there generally credible news services suggesting this was the case?
Do you have some links?

So the question is:
Why does some media outlets and those who parrot the disinformation about Jan 6th keep at it? It seems holding on to a lie is more comfortable than facing the findings of one of the largest law enforcement entities in the U.S. even when that lie serves to cause division and undermines democracy.

"WASHINGTON, Aug 20 (Reuters) - The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result, according to four current and former law enforcement officials.
Though federal officials have arrested more than 570 alleged participants, the FBI at this point believes the violence was not centrally coordinated by far-right groups or prominent supporters of then-President Donald Trump, according to the sources, who have been either directly involved in or briefed regularly on the wide-ranging investigations.
"Ninety to ninety-five percent of these are one-off cases," said a former senior law enforcement official with knowledge of the investigation. "Then you have five percent, maybe, of these militia groups that were more closely organized. But there was no grand scheme with Roger Stone and Alex Jones and all of these people to storm the Capitol and take hostages.""
source: Exclusive: FBI finds scant evidence U.S. Capitol attack was coordinated - sources | Reuters

Given the general and deliberate amount of disinformation there is being distributed about all sorts of things, with American politics certainly being amongst them, I wouldn't think reducing the motivation for such behavior to 'comfort' is very insightful, whichever side of the political divide is at play.

 

[Brinne]

Strawman

You left out the rest of my post; but feel free to tell me in what part of that I am misrepresenting your argument?

 

[Subduction Zone]

I gave names in post #20
Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger

“What we know now is enough. The President of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing,” Cheney said in a statement. “There has never been a greater betrayal by a President of the United States of his office and his oath to the Constitution. I will vote to impeach the President.”

-Liz Cheney

"Cheney is the second House Republican to vow to follow Democrats in impeaching Trump after Rep. John Katko (R-NY) said he would earlier Tuesday. Rep. Adam Kinzinger (R-IL) announced he would vote to impeach Trump shortly after Cheney did. A fourth House Republican, Rep. Fred Upton (R-MI), announced late Tuesday that he would vote in favor of impeachment as well."

Wyoming Rep. Liz Cheney Says She Will Vote to Impeach Trump Over Capitol Riot

BEFORE ANY INVESTIGATION

Is that enough evidence for you? They already made up their minds in January, that is why Pelosi wanted them on her panel.

Now, name ANY fair court that would appoint a juror that publicly stated that they would convict before the trial or any evidence weighed.

Just to refresh your memory:
FBI finds no evidence that Trump and his allies were directly involved with organizing the violence of the Capitol riot: report


source: Trump Not Directly Involved in Organizing Capitol-Riot Violence: Report

He did "summon the mob". It may not have been organized to overthrow the government, but he did do that.

And there is no doubt that he lit the flame. Or have you forgotten how he repeatedly lied about the election?

What Trump did not do was to plan on insurrection. That is all that the FBI found. They did not find him innocent by any means.

 

[Brickjectivity]

There was an insurrection. The investigation was needed, and Trump instigated it with his smack talk. I've no problem with the FBI results of the investigation. Also Liz Cheney did the right thing for her party. The party should get rid of Doctor President Trump.

 

[metis]

Perhaps some of the more naive may buy into that romantic vision but it is apparent that Nancy Pelosi's motives are far from sorting out facts from fiction. The conventional way is for the majority to allow the minority the ability to name it's own dissenting members as they have no influence over the majorities ultimate decision other than contradicting the majorities claims and raise questions. Pelosi refused to do this and outright rejected the minority choices of Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) and Jim Banks (R-Ind) in favour of Liz Cheney (R-Wyo) and Adam Kinzinger (R-Ill) two republicans who bought into the insurrection narrative as outlined by Pelosi. The Jan 6th commission is nothing more than a vehicle to conduct a show trial under the pretense of bipartisanship.

She wouldn't allow those whom already were on record denying what happened, thus showing that they had their conclusion before any evidence was even presented.

 

[metis]

“What we know now is enough. The President of the United States summoned this mob, assembled the mob, and lit the flame of this attack. Everything that followed was his doing,” Cheney said in a statement. “There has never been a greater betrayal by a President of the United States of his office and his oath to the Constitution. I will vote to impeach the President.”

-Liz Cheney

Clearly that was happening as I watched it live for several hours, and it doesn't take a ph.d. in political science to know at least the basics of what was going on and why.