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Flood Evidences — revised

Audie

Veteran Member
Noah still had to gather them into the ark...

19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you.

Though it is telling that you think this idea is any less ridiculous? :rolleyes:

Freshwater frogs hopping from Australia to the Middle East, hilarious. :facepalm:

And blind worm snakes
But really- its people with no sense
of the preposterous who let Nigerian oil
ministers have access to their bank account
or think Noahs ark was a real boat.

Ha- some even think that syncline on mt ararat
( noahs ark park) really is noahs ark!
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
Inane replies without evidence is irritating.


Exactly what evidence did you provide to support your inane "weathering" claim? Given science has calculated the age of the Himalayas, one of the youngest mountain ranges, as over 50 million years old, you're going to need more than unevidenced rhetoric about weathering to refute it, as Audie pointed out.
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
I imagine unless they work for the creation institute they want to remain employable.
Hell, even then they do not usually lose their tenure as long as they do the jobs for which they were hired.

Have you noticed how seldom the speakers for the assorted creationist organizations who hold advanced degrees speak on topics in their own field of expertise? There certainly are a few, like Behe and Ross. but if you bet on any random seminar held by one of those groups, you would be wise to bet against.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Cool, you know more than any astrophysicist.
You mean a human using a title bestowed by group behaviour?

A man first highest spiritual DNA history who men today themed was their man god knew space was just a thin plane. Once the separating eternal just language spirit burnt as did the gods O. They were removed space was stretched by dense gases.

You once preached space owns no measure it's just empty a thin plane and stretched. Why you inferred it to a woman's womb.

At least you knew why you theoried for science was direct to a reaction thesis. To build design machines then change earths mass.

Most of you just lie today for status cult group agreement.

As the I am correct scientist said..
as science only. I said I built machines reacts machines only by thesis. Science. Artificial.

If you are a correct human you don't use inventions to claim correct human. Notice human is the first subject.

In wisdom a natural human knows themself.

Your stories recorded.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Exactly what evidence did you provide to support your inane "weathering" claim? Given science has calculated the age of the Himalayas, one of the youngest mountain ranges, as over 50 million years old, you're going to need more than unevidenced rhetoric about weathering to refute it, as Audie pointed out.

I have had my shsre of experience with
guys who cant stand it that any woman knows asmuch or more than they.
From a pint size Asian its particularly galling.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
I'm not talking about a creator. I'm talking about the geology.
And I answered you: I share the same POV with quite a few geologists.

Just what facts that are understood by geologists, do you think, refute our view?

I accept plate tectonics and their movements...it fits the facts that we experience now.
But plate movement had a beginning, it didn’t always exist.
Uniformatarianism, “the present is the key to the past,” is a false premise.
However if the as you are implying the universe is not billions of years old, how is light visible from starts that are billions of lights years away?
Another straw man! Misrepresenting my POV, once again.

For the last time, I agree with science RE: the age of Earth & universe. I stated as such in the OP!
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
Sheldon said:
However if the as you are implying the universe is not billions of years old, how is light visible from starts that are billions of lights years away?
Another straw man! Misrepresenting my POV, once again.

For the last time, I agree with science RE: the age of Earth & universe. I stated as such in the OP!

So you accept that the earth is 4.543 billion years old, and the universe 13.8 billion years old, then why the histrionics over the scientific fact that evidence the Himalayas as just 50 million years old?

You also have not offered any evidence to support your rhetorical claim about weathering? Can we infer then you have only the bare claim?
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
And I answered you: I share the same POV with quite a few geologists.
Yeah, yeah. You can find "quite a few" geologists who will agree with you that the world is flat. I am asking why the vast majority of the people who are the most informed about, and experienced with, the earth's physical structure and substance, its history, and the processes that act on it do not agree with you. Based on your track record, all you have got to offer is a pile of obfuscation and misdirection, but I am always open to be pleasantly surprised.
 

Sheldon

Veteran Member
And I answered you: I share the same POV with quite a few geologists.

Just what facts that are understood by geologists, do you think, refute our view?

I accept plate tectonics and their movements...it fits the facts that we experience now.
But plate movement had a beginning, it didn’t always exist.
Uniformatarianism, “the present is the key to the past,” is a false premise.

Another straw man! Misrepresenting my POV, once again.

For the last time, I agree with science RE: the age of Earth & universe. I stated as such in the OP!

Still waiting for you to produce anything beyond pure rhetoric to support your denial of the scientific age of the Himalayas, because they are not "weathered"?
 

Audie

Veteran Member
Still waiting for you to produce anything beyond pure rhetoric to support your denial of the scientific age of the Himalayas, because they are not "weathered"?

Obviously no,data, no publication, no details,
nothing but opinion is ever going to be presented.
Continuing to ask is just goading.
 

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
Flood Evidences — revised
Global Flood evidence:

***1.Vast herds of grazing animals, perhaps millions of them, discovered within the permafrost (called muck fields by some, due to the mud mixed in from previous melting), in the Alaskan and Yukon regions. In the Siberian permafrost, a few have been discovered upright, with food (some which only grows in temperate climates) discovered still unchewed in their mouths, like the Berezovka Mammoth. (They died instantly, not from a slow-moving ice age!)

http://www.amendez.com/Noahs Ark Articles/NAS Worldwide Mammal Massacre.pdf

The question is raised — and properly so: “How could a Global Flood cause such freezing temperatures?” Keep in mind, some of the water (not most...most were from the “vast springs” underneath the ground) came from above, from the atmosphere....the troposphere?...the mesosphere?...the stratosphere? The Bible doesn’t say, it is silent. (Maybe from all five.) But the waters existing above the Earth prior to the Flood, resulted in mild temperatures, and pleasantly warm.... similar to a greenhouse effect, worldwide. (That’s why Adam & Eve could go naked, and be very comfortable.) Yes, the Bible indicates there were seasons, but apparently mild ones.

All of that drastically changed, with the break in this vapor(?) / ice (?) canopy! Temperatures would drop suddenly!

***2.This project, completed by physics students of the University of Leicester, provides an interesting conclusion:
‘Noah’s Ark would have floated’.

And this one:
Could Noah’s Ark Float? In Theory, Yes | Science | Smithsonian

Further information:
Noah’s Ark was the focus of a major 1993 scientific study headed by Dr. Seon Hong at the world-class ship research center KRISO, based in Daejeon, South Korea. Dr. Hong’s team compared twelve hulls of different proportions to discover which design was most practical. No hull shape was found to significantly outperform the 4,300-year-old biblical design. In fact, the Ark’s careful balance is easily lost if the proportions are modified, rendering the vessel either unstable, prone to fracture, or dangerously uncomfortable.
The research team found that the proportions of Noah’s Ark carefully balanced the conflicting demands of stability (resistance to capsizing), comfort (“seakeeping”), and strength. In fact, the Ark has the same proportions as a modern cargo ship.


The study also confirmed that the Ark could handle waves as high as 100 ft (30 m). Dr. Hong is now director general of the facility and claims “life came from the sea,” obviously not the words of a creationist on a mission to promote the worldwide Flood. Endorsing the seaworthiness of Noah’s Ark obviously did not damage Dr. Hong’s credibility.

Dr. Seon Won Hong was principal research scientist when he headed up the Noah’s Ark investigation. In May 2005 Dr. Hong was appointed director general of MOERI (formerly KRISO). Dr. Hong earned a B.S. degree in naval architecture from Seoul National University and a Ph.D. degree in applied mechanics from the University of Michigan, Ann Arbor.

Thinking Outside the Box: Size and Shape of the Ark

***3.Coupled with that, the dimensions of the Ark, a 6-to-1 ratio of length to width, and 10-to-1 ratio of length to height, are exactly what is needed for a non-powered vessel of that size to maintain stability! Only in the last 2 centuries have ship builders recognized that these proportions are perfect for non-powered barge-like ships to be seaworthy. This is powerful evidence supporting a literal interpretation: How could Moses have known, in recording the event, that Noah was given such ideal dimensions? Fortunate guessing?

***4.The numerous Flood legends (exceeding 250, one anthropologist says near 1,000), that share many similarities, some strikingly so, that indicates a common source.



***5.Furthermore, the Bible indicates, in Psalms 104, that the Flood was the cause of Earth’s mountains reaching such great heights. (With the underground waters spewing upward, the land would, by necessity, settle downward.) This would mean the high mountainous ranges we have today, like the Alps, the Himalayas, the Andes, and others, did not exist before the Flood; they are relatively young in formation. Some were even underwater prior to the Flood — see #6. (Not that the rocks are young, but that the features they form, are new, geologically speaking. What do we see? We observe crisp, well-defined features! If these mountains were millions of years old, we would see weathered, rounded features, due to the extreme wind and other erosion forces that they constantly endure. But we don’t! (This evidence is the easiest of all the geological facts to see...yet to me the most overlooked.)

***6.[related to #5]The marine creatures discovered on the tops of many mountain ranges, even on Mt. Everest — gigantic clams, some measuring 5 feet or more across, found in the closed position, indicating (again) that these creatures experienced a catastrophic event, leading to their quick death. (Clams in natural death, die w/ their shells open.) All remain exposed....if they’re millions of years old, why aren’t they eroded, also? Because these particular ones died at the Flood!!

***7.Where did all the water go? Apparently, it’s still here, at the Earth. If we again take into account what Psalms 104 reveals — that it was the Flood that caused our current topography, the very high mountains and low valleys, then the Earth’s terrain was somewhat smoother than now. (And Genesis tells us, the highest mountain was covered by around 22 ft. of the water.) It’s been determined that if the Earth was smoothed out like a billiard ball, the present water in all the ocean and lake basins would cover the planet to a depth of 2.5 miles! More than enough.....yet, scientists have discovered even more water in the Earth’s mantle, estimated to be almost 10 times as much as exists on our surface! So, that presents no obstacle!

***8.The Chinese character for "boat" comprises three radically different symbols: 'vessel', 'mouth' (representing a person), and the number ''8”. Why is this significant? Because there were 8 people who survived the Flood in the Ark. Some ancient Semitic person thought the Flood Event was worthy enough, to incorporate it into their language, helping others to remember the Chinese word for boat. They didn't have a Bible to get the idea from, and I doubt Moses knew any Chinese people, to get his writing from!

Are you of the mindset that, when reading about God causing a global Flood, you don’t think He’d use His power throughout other aspects of the event? Or afterwards? Let’s see what the Genesis account reveals: He brought the waters above and below to Earth’s surface....He gave Noah instructions on building the Ark, providing those ideal proportions....He brought the animals to Noah (No, Noah didn’t have to go get them, as some dishonestly purport.)....and He closed the door. Only those w/ closed minds would assume (want to, maybe?) that God’s power stopped there. Is He somehow incapable of protecting the occupants in the Ark, or the plant life underneath the waters? Does Jehovah God have to reveal / explain every aspect involved? If He brought the animal to Noah, is it too much of a stretch to believe that Jehovah redistributed them to their former locations after the Flood?

Jehovah God is not required to explain anything more to us....what we do know, the evidence, is enough to build faith in the account.

Another indirect line of evidence, as to why God would cause such a catastrophe, are the Greek, Roman, Hindu, Norse, etc., myths describing “gods” interacting w/ humans, having relations w/ women, and producing offspring. (Since most all myths have some kernel of truth, this common narrative between them, of gods having sex w/ human females & bearing children, must be it.) It parallels Genesis 6:1-4, and explains to some extent why Jehovah had to step in, to thwart the eventual subjugation of the human race into sex slavery. But these “myths” created after the event, have kept it living in the collective mind of the human race.

Why it is discussed so much, I don't understand, please? Right?

Regards
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Flood Evidences — revised


Why it is discussed so much, I don't understand, please? Right?

Regards
The theme a moon O sits in space and it's been releasing it's gases for a very long time. Gas pushed it at earth.

Once I believed the moon body had come out of planet earth. So it might have hit earth bounced off.

The moon hence has become over a long time period smaller.

The earth owns a huge water mass. No scientist can state what ocean water mass once existed or how much water earth has lost.

As a loss is a UFO cooled body using ice to cool its gases that leaves earth by vacuum causes.

Historic father's advice to brother. Dont build machines out of earths mass. As earth owns the balances of released radiation as above so below.

So he ignored him. We lose the balances the vacuum voids takes our UFO heat. Ice gets colder.

Ice colder keeps burning gases water cooled.

If ice gets colder all of a sudden water could snap freeze.

By a theist claiming his earth machine science is cosmic. Wanting extreme cold held as a fixed constant. By thesis science first does not own cosmic. We live in balanced light heat.

Before he wanted gas light burning held at the ground fixed as machine constant. Earth body kept heated balance. Was releasing radiations.

Science destroyed life.

So not only does he have one earth God machine science now...he theoried direct to body base one machine. He's tried to double up as instant attack. Making it three times force change.

As earth does it itself as origin to number one.

As man only ever used one earth machine for converting. He changed one earth God body.

As his science is man's is pre cause and he says he knows. So then when he theories he says I will knowingly cause. By inventing causes. Life's sacrificed.

He wanted ground held light constant...why invention caused new sink holes. Now he wants ground held extreme cold.

So the space body that owns end life saving wont let him hold it. As it ended the attack. Void cosmic extreme cold natural.

The attack ended when the hot star mass hits earth.

Thesis is after all O a God.

O UFO ark hence hit mountain. It is eye shaped. By cosmic pressures.

Now he wants eternal hell infinite God. By greed a thesis about mass first as mass gain and mass ownership. Everything he says.

Earth however is one earth special earth in his mind.

Replace of the stone was theoried in his theory. His thought exact to his want of origin god. I use the mass. So it needs replacing as non stop resource.

He can't resource the moon. So he says new.

New machine not pyramid new power plant not pyramid. Is all new.

New occurrence not old star fall.

I saw in vision my new attack...a star planet enter the eye of a Satan star group activated.

Why its flooding non stop on earth at the moment is a sign.

As not until the hit landing did the flooding of the ground stop.

In the past ice didn't manifest but the cold conversion owning dinosaurs heaven was present. By space conditions.

Why a cold burning star was pulled in that activated instant freeze.

Therefore Muhammad Moses incident gained a fallen star in science. It was correct.

Man's idea space was giving back earths radiation fake. It was holding it to earth.
 

SA Huguenot

Well-Known Member
Thanks for your affirmation of the OP!
I appreciate the support!
Although I should tell you, I'm not a YEC. I haven't found the Bible to support that view.
We can discuss that privately, if you'd like.
sorry to reply only now.
I was banned for a few weeks.
Sure, we can discuss your old earth view.
I make a point to listen to all theories, and yours do count to me because I might learn something I never knew before.
I learned a lot from people who did not agree with me in the past.
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
sorry to reply only now.
I was banned for a few weeks.
Sure, we can discuss your old earth view.
I make a point to listen to all theories, and yours do count to me because I might learn something I never knew before.
I learned a lot from people who did not agree with me in the past.
Well, glad you’re back.

I accept the evidence of an Old Earth. So in other words, the rock strata we observe throughout the earth, was laid down over eons. The fossils we find within the deeper layers of strata are therefore extremely old, too.

But there have also been found soft tissue in T-Rex fossils that were dated at least 65 million years old (myo). The dating methods must be inaccurate, in these cases…very inaccurate.

But I’m sure that most are very old… T-Rex had probably existed for millions of years. So, the oldest remains of T-Rex discovered, could be at least 65 myo.

But I’m getting off the subject re: the Grand Canyon….I agree the layered strata existed unseen prior to the Flood, but the Flood is what cut through those layers, thereby exposing the strata of the GC….and removed the volume of sediment and earth - about 1,000 cu. miles - that is now missing. Scientists can’t account for that large amount of missing volume, saying they can’t state with certainty how the Colorado River could dispose of such volume! It’s nowhere along the River’s course.

Understand that it’s just not about the erosion and exposure of those rock layers; it’s also about the disappearance of those 1000 cu. miles.

The Flood explains the missing volume - and where scientists think it was deposited - perfectly.
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
But there have also been found soft tissue in T-Rex fossils that were dated at least 65 million years old (myo). The dating methods must be inaccurate, in these cases…very inaccurate.
As per both Schweitzer and Rana (separately) the only things that are being preserve are the most robust biomolecules that we know of such as collagen, keratin, heme, chitin, eumelanin, quinones; and blood vessels.

Despite creationist claims, intact proteins have not been recovered. And that what they found were not blood vessels, but chemically reformed, chemically crosslinked. They are only preserved by what is essentially a form of fossilization via extensive crosslinking (as with iron) or have a molecular structure similar to graphite.

So, not only does this not call into question in these cases, it serves as a further problem for young earth creationism. If dinosaurs died only 4400 years ago (or even 10,000) in a great flood, then dinosaurs died under the exact same conditions as everything else. Therefore, we should be recovering dinosaur corpses that are in a similar state of decay as any mammalian or lizard or amphibian remains.

Because supposedly they all died at the same freaking time.

So, where are those dinosaur bones that match the decay patterns of every other "antediluvian" animal?

I'll tell you where. Those corpses do not exist. Because all the dinosaurs lived 65 mya or more..
 
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