Geert Wilders - guilty of "insulting a group"

[MD]

Why are people surprised, this has been happening for years. It is part of a leftist shift towards Islam. The only way European culture will survive is if it moves to the Right.

 

[icehorse]

Why are people surprised, this has been happening for years. It is part of a leftist shift towards Islam. The only way European culture will survive is if it moves to the Right.

I think we need more categories. I'm a liberal, but I'm strongly against the folks you're referring to as "the Left" but who I think are more accurately in the "MCPC" crowd. Your conflation is not helpful.

Borrowing from Bill Maher, true liberals need to stand up for liberal values, and tolerating the intolerant is NOT a liberal value, it's an MCPC value.

 

[icehorse]

Thanks for defending the evil double standard disease

U just proved my point

Can you give an example of what you're talking about? I'm finding your posts too vague. thanks.

 

[Sunstone]

Ithe "MCPC" crowd.

What does MCPC stand for?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The Rights are in truth fascist @ n@zis

Fascism and National Socialism are two distinctively different political theories, both with different motives and goals, though both are total and rigid in their authority and control.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

I think we need more categories. I'm a liberal, but I'm strongly against the folks you're referring to as "the Left" but who I think are more accurately in the "MCPC" crowd. Your conflation is not helpful.

Borrowing from Bill Maher, true liberals need to stand up for liberal values, and tolerating the intolerant is NOT a liberal value, it's an MCPC value.

MCPC? Multicultural politically correct?

 

[icehorse]

MCPC? Multicultural politically correct?

@Sunstone yes, Sultan is correct, sorry, I thought that MCPC was more well known.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

@Sunstone yes, Sultan is correct, sorry, I thought that MCPC was more well known.

It's generally best to assume people aren't going to know an acronym (especially in a non-specialized area of discourse), unless it's the acronym of a very well known organization like the NRA or AARP.

 

[Sultan Of Swing]

It's generally best to assume people aren't going to know an acronym (especially in a non-specialized area of discourse), unless it's the acronym of a very well known organization like the NRA or AARP.

Lol I don't know what the AARP is. That's my non-Americanness showing I think

 

[icehorse]

It's generally best to assume people aren't going to know an acronym (especially in a non-specialized area of discourse), unless it's the acronym of a very well known organization like the NRA or AARP.

I agree - for some reason I thought MCPC was well known on this forum - my bad.

 

[MD]

I think we need more categories. I'm a liberal, but I'm strongly against the folks you're referring to as "the Left" but who I think are more accurately in the "MCPC" crowd. Your conflation is not helpful.

Borrowing from Bill Maher, true liberals need to stand up for liberal values, and tolerating the intolerant is NOT a liberal value, it's an MCPC value.

Things change, people change, demographics change.

Eventually you're going to have to pick a side which is fully against liberal values vs a side that is intolerant to it but allows it to exist to some degree.

I'm brown, of part Middle Eastern origin, hold many liberal values and firmly Right wing.

 

[icehorse]

I'm brown, of part Middle Eastern origin, hold many liberal values and firmly Right wing.

So I'd say that we need more flexible, descriptive labels.

 

[columbus]

So I'd say that we need more flexible, descriptive labels.

I totally agree. I often find myself in trouble because people assume things about my views based on a label that they put on me.

It's just human nature. We are programmed to categorize. We couldn't make it through a day without that automatic mental function. But sometimes it leads us to totally wrong opinions and conclusions.
Tom

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Lol I don't know what the AARP is. That's my non-Americanness showing I think

Probably. I don't know what it stands for exactly, but it's basically some lobbyist/insurance/special interest thingy for old people. I used it as it is one of the examples listed in the AP style guide, making it something that just popped into my head.

 

[fiat lux]

I'm brown, of part Middle Eastern origin, hold many liberal values and firmly Right wing.

I can see then, why Thomas Sowell is a hero for you - and for me too, but I'm not so sure about your Joseph Campbell quote.

 

[HonestJoe]

A few key concepts are that the U.S. limits the total number of immigrants per year, and it also limits the number of immigrants from individual countries. I guess the point for me is that modern countries typically limit immigration. Why would this statement by Wilders cause such a commotion?

The statements in question weren’t about reducing the number of people immigrating to the country, it related to the number of a specific national/racial grouping currently in the country. Wilders made generic statements about reducing the number of Moroccans living in the Netherlands which was not unreasonable interpreted as a threat to that group, especially given that at that point, he held no power to change the situation legally.

Don’t get me wrong, I clearly see the prosecution as entirely political and I think the conviction was a stretch (as the lack of sentence I think admitted) but that doesn’t mean Wilders is morally or socially a harmless innocent. If nothing else, he’s the kind of politician who intentionally stirs up controversy to get attention and paint himself as a victim which is much easier than actually coming up with rational and practical policies. The court cases against him play in to his hands (so much that I can’t help wondering if some of the people pushing them forwards against him are actually doing so for precisely this purpose).

 

[Revoltingest]

It's generally best to assume people aren't going to know an acronym (especially in a non-specialized area of discourse), unless it's the acronym of a very well known organization like the NRA or AARP.

Those are initialisms, not acronyms (which are initialisms pronounced as a word, eg, SWAT, GUI, SNAFU).
AARP could be, but no one pronounces it as "arp".

 

[icehorse]

it related to the number of a specific national/racial grouping currently in the country.

Using the U.S. laws as an example, we limit immigrants by country - it is one of the U.S.'s immigration filters.

 

[HonestJoe]

Using the U.S. laws as an example, we limit immigrants by country - it is one of the U.S.'s immigration filters.

As I said, the statement in question said nothing about immigration, it was about the number of Moroccans in the Netherlands. It might have been poor wording on his part but if a politician is going to make public statements about delicate subjects, they have a responsibility to care for what they say and how it could be interpreted.

 

[icehorse]

As I said, the statement in question said nothing about immigration, it was about the number of Moroccans in the Netherlands. It might have been poor wording on his part but if a politician is going to make public statements about delicate subjects, they have a responsibility to care for what they say and how it could be interpreted.

I also wish politicians would take such care. But they routinely don't. And in this one particular case, political pressure was such that a trial ensued. Why in this one particular case?