If you spot who is doing it, then let's go convince'm otherwise, eh?
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Genital mutilation or religious right?
- Thread starter Godwilling
- Start date
Godwilling
Organic, kinetic learner
I think someone posted Circumcision fact and statistics
which amongst other things it says the following:
Here are some facts regarding circumcision that most parents are unaware of, and some websites and many physicians fail to mention. We thought you should know them.
- About 117 boys die each year in the United States as a result of their circumcision, most from infections or blood loss.1
- The current U.S. circumcision rate is steadily declining. In 2010 it was 32%.2 Thats a huge drop from 56% in 2006 and 65% in 2002.
- Most physicians do not have their sons circumcised.3 Why not, if circumcision is medically advisable? Since most have performed the surgery as part of their training, they are the ones who should know more about its consequences than anyone else.
- Physicians are biased toward circumcision. Circumcised doctors are 5 times more likely to recommend circumcision to patients.4
- Contrary to frequent claims, infants do feel pain as intensely as adults, and very possibly even more.5
- Circumcision regularly removes a shocking 3/4 of the penis sensitivity through the removal of the ridged band, foreskin lips, and most often the entire frenulum.6
- Anesthesia is used in only 45% of circumcisions; the type of anesthetic varies.7 The most effective method does not eliminate all pain, and the most common type used, a topical creme, does almost nothing to reduce it. In fact, a major clinical test of the various types of anesthetics, on actual infants, was halted for humane reasons because of the intense pain.8
- As adults, men circumcised in infancy are almost 5 times more likely to be diagnosed with erectile dysfunction (ED). 9 10
- Circumcised men and boys are 60% more likely to suffer from alexithymia, a psychological trait disorder which causes difficulty in identifying and expressing ones emotions, which can lead to difficulties in sustaining relationships.11
- The complication rate for circumcision varies from 3 to 6 percent. The average male will have more health problems from being circumcised than from being left alone.12
- Circumcision has never been proven to be effective in either reducing or treating cervical cancer, penile cancer, urinary tract infections, or sexually transmitted diseases including HIV/AIDS.13
- Not one medical association in America, or anywhere else in the world, recommends infant circumcision; some even recommend against it.14 At no time in its 75 years has the American Academy of Pediatrics ever recommended infant circumcision.
You're moving the goalposts. We're talking about routine circumcision of healthy infants and you're talking about circumcision of adults in cases where a specific need has been identified. It's apples and oranges.
Infection, accidental amputation, death from blood loss.
The Dangers of Circumcision: What You Should Know - Yahoo! Voices - voices.yahoo.com
I'm not comparing circumcision to cosmetic procedures; I'm saying that it is a cosmetic procedure.
And I fully believe that religion (or lack thereof) is a personal decision that should be left to the individual and shouldn't be imposed on a person by their parents.
Ignoring the risks and negative consequences of a decision when trying to figure out whether it's a good idea is not rational.
It's your right to say your opinion about circumcision, just as it's my right to say mine about it.
I am going to take a stand on this one. I am opposed to giving breast implants to infants.
Controversial!fantôme profane;2881806 said:
Well I am not surprised someone like you would come out in favor of this revolting practice (I realize you didn't actually say that, but I am going to pretend you did because that is just more fun). But think about how confused they would get as they tried to suckle themselves and get nothing but a mouthful of silicone.
A few years ago I spoke at length with a pediatric nephrologist about this exact issue. When I pressed him to tell me what his opinion was he stated flatly that he felt every male infant should be circumcised. He did of course immediately add the obvious, which is that his speciality meant that he saw children day in and day out who had problems, many requiring surgery - he was not seeing a typical random sampling of male children and young teens. However, he said given what he sees on a daily basis, knowing what he knows regarding issues that do develop with the urinary system and kidneys because of the presence of a foreskin, for him it was a no-brainer.
Again - his speciality means that his view is somewhat skewed, but there is no one better equipped to gauge the realistic problems that can arise when the foreskin isn't removed. Perhaps the GPs and others who have come out saying there are no medical benefits to circs failed to interview their local nephrologists.
Again - his speciality means that his view is somewhat skewed, but there is no one better equipped to gauge the realistic problems that can arise when the foreskin isn't removed. Perhaps the GPs and others who have come out saying there are no medical benefits to circs failed to interview their local nephrologists.
Well, infants aren't so naturally well endowed.fantôme profane;2881819 said:
However, I draw the line at males....no boob jobs for them.
Sexual discrimination before toilet training.
Is it a boy or a girl?
Now, I think it's a little early to start imposing roles on it,
Last edited:
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
Even if that were the case, for hygienic and aesthetic reasons alone justify it. I don't plan on having kids, but if I had a baby boy it would be circumcised.
Of course, a major issue is whether or not it's the kid's bizness too.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Right. I mean, personally I don't agree with it which is why I chose not to have my boys circumcised. But since complications ARE very rare, and the emotional "trauma" doesn't seem to have long term effects, I say that since it is also a religious practice I would support leaving the decision to the parents - if they can find a doctor who will perform it (I believe that will become more challenging as time goes by).
Father Heathen
Veteran Member
Honestly, I just said that to get under peoples skin. Like I said I don't even plan on having children.
dawny0826
Mother Heathen
This thread has been an education piece for me, as I didn't realize the male (or female, for that matter) objection to it, nor did I realize the objection to routine circumcision for infant boys.
Per Wikipedia, the only Association, in the US, at least, that acknowledges the health benefits of the procedure, is the American Urological Association, and they encourage that the procedure is presented as an option and equally acknowledge risks.
The CDC provides information, seemingly, from the adult male perspective and there is no mention of infant circumcision. I can only assume, they frown upon it.
With the aformentioned stated, if I were to give birth to a son, I'm one to make informed decisions. I knew before participating in this thread that there's a consultation with a pediatrician BEFORE the procedure is done. I wouldn't consider having the procedure done without a consultation and reassurance that my son was healthy and would recover satisfactorily from the procedure. If I didn't feel confident or reassured, it wouldn't be done. It's as simple as that.
I strongly disagree with this blanket label that male circumcision is a form of mutiliation.
And I ask you...
How many diapers have you changed of infants who have had the procedure done? How many men have you been with who have had the procedure done? How many babies have you cared for, soon after the procedure?
Circumcision wounds heal within a week or two for infants. Umbilical chord stumps hang around longer at times than it takes for circumcision wounds to heal. I've cared for little ones and I've never noticed problems with wound care. I can't attest to this mutilation.
And I've never talked to a man with foreskin envy. I'd seriously like to have a conversation with such a man. I find that fascinating.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Kathryn
It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Many. I have friends whose children were circumcised, and who I've baby sat regularly. To be honest, I don't see much difference between the two "states" - after the wound is healed.
How many diapers have you changed on baby boys who have NOT been circumcised?
Without getting too specific, I'll just say my first husband was not circumcised, and we had four children together. Not a problem. Not an issue. Nothing negative to report whatsoever.
I've been with both "types" and sexual functions don't differ at all from what I can tell. Neither does the experience from a woman's perspective.
How many men have you been with who have not been circumcised?
Several - close friends and family. To be honest, I was appalled that these tiny babies were voluntarily wounded in such a sensitive spot. This played a critical role in my decision NOT to have the procedure done on my boys.
I don't mean this as an attack on your decision to have your boys circumcised. This is simply honest feedback on my part.