Genome sequencing leaves Creationists unable to respond

[Riverwolf]

I dispise the use of the word evolutionist,

Me, too. :yes:

 

[waitasec]

I wouldn't use the word "creationist" for this belief. It if a very ambiguous, confusing term, and I reserve it for the full-blown, whacko, Young Earth Creationist who chooses myth over science. In other words, it's a "scientific" (or anti-scientific) position, not a theological one. If you accept ToE, then you're on the pro-science side. How you deal with that is your theology, not your (fake) science.

thank you for pointing that out...

 

[Breathe]

<<snip rant>>

Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. It was simply a slip of the finger, calm down. There's no need to get so hostile about it, I'm not in the best of health right now, so I may make some mistakes.



By the way, perhaps I should add some clarification to my post, so people don't think I'm some kind of creationist:

Although I believe in God and accept evolution, I do not follow theistic evolution: I believe in naturalistic evolution, that we weren't guided to this form by God or anything like that, this isn't an "optimal design", etc.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

It is impossible to justify the thought, that God controls the day to day process of evolution.

There is certainly the possibility that he formulated the rules of the process into the laws of the universe.

I rather doubt that God ever tinkers with the physical aspects of his creation, or with the process itself.

Evolutionary Systems created by God would be as he wished them to be from the start. Where they will lead is known only to him.

 

[micrurus]

Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. It was simply a slip of the finger, calm down. There's no need to get so hostile about it, I'm not in the best of health right now, so I may make some mistakes.



By the way, perhaps I should add some clarification to my post, so people don't think I'm some kind of creationist:

Although I believe in God and accept evolution, I do not follow theistic evolution: I believe in naturalistic evolution, that we weren't guided to this form by God or anything like that, this isn't an "optimal design", etc.

fair enough, my apologies

 

[Thief]

It is impossible to justify the thought, that God controls the day to day process of evolution.

There is certainly the possibility that he formulated the rules of the process into the laws of the universe.

I rather doubt that God ever tinkers with the physical aspects of his creation, or with the process itself.

Evolutionary Systems created by God would be as he wished them to be from the start. Where they will lead is known only to him.

I would agree with you....the rules are His to make.
Also...once in motion...the churning chemistry will produce something....
as intended.

But to go so far as to say....'God does not tinker'....
is to believe in a God ....inert...and possibly dead.

Such belief also rules out the event of Chapter Two of Genesis....
an obvious tinkering....to change the course of Man.

It also rules out spiritual tinkering......prophets.

 

[Onlooker]

I find thinking like that just another case of creationist moving the bar to meet their beliefs to rationalize imagination. only in my opinion

in modern society with evolution pretty much being fact, your going to see a shift in creation thought's with the bar being moved backwards to meet religious needs so they dont seem crazy like belief in YEC

Sounds like you have weighed all scientific options on abiogenesis, cosmology and evolution.
Discussions about nonprovable issues become emotional, political and mystical.
As science progresses we understand more and fit our emotions, politics and beliefs to these.
Example: the universe is at least 11 dimensions (maybe more). So tell me how you think that plays into your believe in evolution, God, time travel and other issues.
You are mistakingly saying they move the bar backwards. In science you constantly change your theory to fit current findings.
The one thing I see not happening in our "modern society" is allowing ID to be taught.
An argument is a 2 sided sport. If you outlaw/demean/label/prejudice/fire/not hire/not tenure all discussions and discussants concerning ID, maybe you are not really in a free "modern society".

 

[Breathe]

fair enough, my apologies

No worries, no apologies needed.

 

[Onlooker]

I think a lot of creationists fall into this category as well. It makes a lot of sense; if one assumes a creator, then believing and studying evolution is studying the mechanism the creator used for life.

I agree. Problem is evolution by definition assumes no outside force. It also has a sticky time with abiogenesis.
In fact, abiogenesis has many theories but the 2 that keep coming up in debates are the crystal grown protein terrestrial belief or an Alien extraterrestrial (panspermia) belief (Crick was fond of this one). Seeing my avatar, one would believe I favor the latter. But in fact I favor an ID form of abiogenesis.
In the scientific method, both sides (or all sides) of an argument are discussed. Only in politically correct or repressed societies are arguments not openly discussed.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Glad I'm not a Creationist

 

[waitasec]

This is posted under...science versus religion....

Have you assumed religion cannot accept science?

God first.

no one can reason with a mind like that which has already made it's mind up.

why is it a taboo to question the idea of god. you're just not, why not? because you're not.

 

[Thief]

no one can reason with a mind like that which has already made it's mind up.

why is it a taboo to question the idea of god. you're just not, why not? because you're not.

Not reasonable because I believe in a Spirit?

If the universe is self creative...then you are subject to it.
You are the sum of your chemistry....and when it fails ...so do you.

If the Spirit came first.....Creator first.....
then there is hope of continuance.

No spiritual life?.....really?
I think that to be shallow.

 

[micrurus]

Not reasonable because I believe in a Spirit?

If the universe is self creative...then you are subject to it.
You are the sum of your chemistry....and when it fails ...so do you.

If the Spirit came first.....Creator first.....
then there is hope of continuance.

No spiritual life?.....really?
I think that to be shallow.

I think that spiritual life is a form of selfcomfort that flows forth from the inability to accept death

 

[Thief]

I think that spiritual life is a form of selfcomfort that flows forth from the inability to accept death

Nay....
As did my Inspiration.....when the hour is upon me....

"it is finished."

 

[waitasec]

Not reasonable because I believe in a Spirit?

If the universe is self creative...then you are subject to it.
You are the sum of your chemistry....and when it fails ...so do you.

If the Spirit came first.....Creator first.....
then there is hope of continuance.

No spiritual life?.....really?
I think that to be shallow.

but none of that is determined. and to think it is, feeds into narcissistic tendencies. we are no more important then the fish in your aquarium in the scheme of things, and for some that's a hard pill to swallow.

 

[Thief]

but none of that is determined. and to think it is, feeds into narcissistic tendencies. we are no more important then the fish in your aquarium in the scheme of things, and for some that's a hard pill to swallow.

Not really....
What is Man that God is mindful?

Insignificant?...unimportant?....no more than dust in the wind?....

yeah...

 

[waitasec]

Not really....
What is Man that God is mindful?

Insignificant?...unimportant?....no more than dust in the wind?....

yeah...

we're all doomed then...
unless god is not and the laws of nature are indifferent.

 

[Thief]

we're all doomed then...
unless god is not and the laws of nature are indifferent.

The laws of nature are indifferent.
Try standing at the edge of a high place and convince yourself....
gravity cares.


Otherwise...
A few....able to do so...will stand up from the dust....
and perhaps stand well before God.

As it is written....
'For the great day of His wrath is come, and who shall be able to stand?'

Then consider, that God might be indifferent.

 

[waitasec]

The laws of nature are indifferent.
Try standing at the edge of a high place and convince yourself....
gravity cares.


Otherwise...
A few....able to do so...will stand up from the dust....
and perhaps stand well before God.

As it is written....
'For the great day of His wrath is come, and who shall be able to stand?'

Then consider, that God might be indifferent.

well here you are implying god is not indifferent...and is concerned with how he was observed. sort of how we observe a worm...we're not even remotely inclined to care what a worm thinks of us, how much more are we not even considered in the scheme of things in regards to nature.

 

[Thief]

well here you are implying god is not indifferent...and is concerned with how he was observed. sort of how we observe a worm...we're not even remotely inclined to care what a worm thinks of us, how much more are we not even considered in the scheme of things in regards to nature.

And which side of the fence do you prefer?

You can say God is indifferent....I agree.
There are 6billion people on this earth and most will fail.

You can say God cares....I agree.
There are plenty of prophets and scribes....who make such report.