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God is disproven by science? Really?

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
The matters you listed as far as evolution are concerned are not immoral, it’s survival of the fittest and the strong survive. I mean if you could throw or club better you got more opportunity to
mate and reproduce. Fauci would be out though and not sure how that gene made it through :D.
But seen as we are talking morality I will assume there really are no atheist just people who claim they are to excuse themselves. That’s just my opinion of course. :).
As for abortions and killing innocents well about 900,000 last year. Not a good look for those who promote that.


Sorry but how is an abortion a "killing of an innocent"? Not even the Bible supports that.

By the way, survival of the fittest does not mean that only the strong will survive. Where did you get that from?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I like a Dad like that, don’t mess with my family or else!
“Thus says the Lord of hosts: ‘I will punish Amalek for what he did to Israel, how he ambushed him on the way when he came up from Egypt.”
‭‭I Samuel‬ ‭15:2‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
But guess what? That never happened. The Exodus was fiction. So now you have a God ordering vengeance for something that never happened. Can you say "Psycho"?
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
The matters you listed as far as evolution are concerned are not immoral, it’s survival of the fittest and the strong survive. I mean if you could throw or club better you got more opportunity to mate and reproduce.
I didn't make up that list of evolved moral tendencies. It's the result of research ─ I quoted an example >here<.

Evolution favors the critter that lives long enough to reproduce. Humans ─ like many other living things ─ are gregarious, and get great benefits towards surviving and breeding by living cooperatively. That's why our built-in morality has evolved to include respect for authority and loyalty to the group. It's also why it includes deriving a sense of self-worth through self-denial, right up to dying for the tribe if necessary.

You can see that an individual may have a conflict between respect for authority and wishing to treat others with decency and compassion ─ indeed a conflict with any moral feeling and his or her own needs, desires, appetites.
But seen as we are talking morality I will assume there really are no atheist just people who claim they are to excuse themselves.
Supernatural belief isn't a requirement for leading a moral life. I haven't checked the figures lately, but the stats for the US previously showed that unbelievers are proportionately underrepresented in prison populations.
 

MrIntelligentDesign

Active Member
Or, can intelligence come from: non-intelligence _________________
Yes, if you claim that God does not exist, then, you basically claim that an Intelligent Designer or Intelligent creator of say, universe, life, etc, does not exist. But, what do you mean by intelligence and why?
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Yes, if you claim that God does not exist, then, you basically claim that an Intelligent Designer or Intelligent creator of say, universe, life, etc, does not exist. But, what do you mean by intelligence and why?
No No NO.

YOU state what YOU mean by "INTELLIGENCE".

And we can take it from there. You'll recall I asked you this before.
 

MrIntelligentDesign

Active Member
But clearly not us atheist's or you'd have given a coherent answer to my earlier questions by now.
I did. Which
No No NO.

YOU state what YOU mean by "INTELLIGENCE".

And we can take it from there. You'll recall I asked you this before.
Did you ask me? Did I answer you in the other thread about the link how I discovered the topic of intelligence?

Unless, you cannot nail the topic of intelligence and its variants, you cannot explain almost all topics in science, especially in Biology or God, etc...
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I did. Which

Did you ask me? Did I answer you in the other thread about the link how I discovered the topic of intelligence?
Just state what definition of "intelligence" you were using in the OP and we can go from there.

Without such a definition, you don't know what you're talking about, so neither do I.
 

firedragon

Veteran Member
In post # 28, the OP deflected to how creationists are insulted by non-theist scientists in a defense of his OP. He said his OP is "cute." Considering his attempt to justify himself, I would say that he meant to insult the intelligence of the people who oppose his belief.

I don't know about this persons character or if he thinks atheists are stupid. I have seen many atheists in this very forum who think that theists are by default stupid. I only spoke of the OP where it's about Intelligent design. If he or anyone insulted anyones intelligence later, I have no clue. Maybe it was done. That's irrelevant to my post.
 

MrIntelligentDesign

Active Member
Science doesn't "usually" offer proofs. Rather, it offers theories (the best idea that we have to date, based on many facts, tests, and logic). (That was my definition, not a dictionary definition).

Math offers proofs.

Science does correct misconceptions in the bible, and misconceptions of church elders (pope, cardinals, bishops, pastors). For example, in the Dark Ages, scientists were routinely threatened to recant their statements for fear that it was blasphemy. The church decreed, didactically, that meteors could not fall from God's perfect heaven. Some scientist was tortured for saying that they did.

Science says that dinosaur bones are at least 6.8 billion years old. Some Christians believe that it is only 6,000 years old. But, since Special Relativity says that time dilates at relativistic speeds, and time dilates in strong gravitational fields, it could very well be that science proves that it is 6,000 years old (according to some reference frame). In fact, it should be possible to calculate how strong the gravitational field would have had to have been. You could alter that calculation assuming that God was traveling at some percentage of the speed of light (for each percentage). A graph could be made.

There is much friction between theists and scientists. Theists often state ridiculous things, (Jonah in the belly of a whale)(blowing a ram's horn "shofar" to knock down the walls of Jericho).

But, when scientists get involved, things seem stranger still. The newest theory is that a comet impact knocked down the walls of Jericho. There is no rock debris, but the ground is scorched from the point of impact, 14 miles from Jericho, and microscopic diamonds are in the 4 foot layer of ash. Regular forest fires would not be nearly hot enough to form diamonds.

Some scientists speculate that the nearby towns of Sodom and Gomorrah could have been leveled by the same event. But I noticed on the map that Jerusalem would have also been leveled at that distance, so it likely had a different cause.

Many scientists are theists. Neil De Grasse Tyson believes that we are in a virtual world (like the Matrix movie). This isn't very scientific, since scientists usually have a reason for their beliefs.

Enricho Fermi said that it is the hand of God that moves subatomic particles.

Einstein, though a Jewish born atheist, balked at the notion of quantum mechanics (random processes), by saying that "God doesn't play dice with the universe."

Scientists are frustrating to theists, because they only accept ideas if there are compelling reasons to do so. Theists, on the other hand, have gut instinct that God exists.

Shrewd politicians think of theists as perfect patsies to get votes, because they never question that something is true, and always believe what they are told. Consequently, they are told that Guantanamo didn't allow torture (because they changed the definition of torture, so they could deny it). Theists still believe in their politicians, who make war (defying God's commandment not to kill). Theists believe in people's laws, not God's laws. Oddly, this means that well meaning theists can be duped into following Satan (as they have been).
In the topic of origins, both religions and science are faith-based.
 

MrIntelligentDesign

Active Member
Have you ever heard of turning the other cheek, loving your neighbor as yourself, loving your enemies, and treating others the way you want to be treated? Since you're a Christian, I assume that you've read the New Testament. Hence, you should know that these commands are directed towards the followers of Christ. So, where does the name-calling ("non-intelligent people") fit in with them?

And isn't it the primary responsibility of a Christian to be an ambassador of Christ and fulfill the Great Commission to "go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the father, of the son, and of the holy spirit"? I don't recall any scriptures in the New Testament commanding the followers of Jesus Christ to prove that God exists to unbelievers. On the contrary, Romans 1:19-20 states that since the creation of the world, God’s invisible qualities have been clearly seen and can be understood. If this scripture is the infallible and inerrant word of God, then why do you think it's necessary to prove his existence to atheists? If God is all-powerful and all-knowing as the Bible claims, then why does he need you and other creationists like you to prove to unbelievers that he exists?
The Bible told us to love our enemies, but the Bible also told us to condemn sin.

In science, the enemy of science is ignorance, especially, the ignorance of intelligence.

Since both science and religions (before I discovered intelligence), they both had no clue on the topic of intelligence or its variants, that is why both science and religion cannot answer this:

How can you show or demonstrate if an X is intelligently designed or not? X = particle, life, species, cell...etc..

Thus, science should not insult religion, or vice versa. But, Evolution is reigning in science even though Evolutionists do not have clue on the topic of intelligence, thus, both religions and non-religions are delusional. But if you are against the cow of Evolution, you will be fired in your job.

I have the right to say non-intelligent since I discovered intelligence and its definition and explanation in science, as used in OP. All, you do not have that right and privilege, unless, you rediscover intelligence and answer the question above correctly.
 

MrIntelligentDesign

Active Member
No No NO.

YOU state what YOU mean by "INTELLIGENCE".

And we can take it from there. You'll recall I asked you this before.
Here is the answer: I am posting here some excerpts from my upcoming e-book for the falsification of Evolution, after I submitted three articles to major secular science journals.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Chapter 7:


...
intelligence = problem-solution-solution, (F1) .. intellen
intelligence = cause-effect-effect, or (F2) .. intellen
intelligence = action-reaction-reaction. (F3) .. intellen

Non-intelligence = problem-solution (nF1) ..naturen
Non-intelligence = cause-effect (nF2) ..naturen
Non-intelligence = action-reaction (nF3) ..naturen


45Some of you may ask, why I included cause and effect and action-reaction? In real life applications, these phenomena had the same application with intelligence. I will show later below. After many years of actual testing and refining and applying in real world, those were discovered too.

46From these two experiments, I could easily derive and define intelligence in a single, scientific, universal, correct and universal definition. This is the precise definition of intelligence, that could sum up probably 80+ invented definitions in one scientifically derived definition.



Intelligence is the principle of reinforcing an X to survive, to exist and to succeed in a certain degree of importance and it always acts on asymmetrical phenomenon.

...

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


TAKE NOTE: If I am wrong in my discovery of intelligence, then we will be forced to accept that intelligence = non-intelligence, and violate the non-contradiction principle in logic.

But I think I am right, and that is my basis in all of my posts, my replies, my explanations and my life, as a free-lance scientist.

Either I am wrong or moron/stupid, or a genius who had appeared once in a century.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Here is the answer: I am posting here some excerpts from my upcoming e-book for the falsification of Evolution, after I submitted three articles to major secular science journals.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Chapter 7:


...
intelligence = problem-solution-solution, (F1) .. intellen
intelligence = cause-effect-effect, or (F2) .. intellen
intelligence = action-reaction-reaction. (F3) .. intellen

Non-intelligence = problem-solution (nF1) ..naturen
Non-intelligence = cause-effect (nF2) ..naturen
Non-intelligence = action-reaction (nF3) ..naturen


45Some of you may ask, why I included cause and effect and action-reaction? In real life applications, these phenomena had the same application with intelligence. I will show later below. After many years of actual testing and refining and applying in real world, those were discovered too.

46From these two experiments, I could easily derive and define intelligence in a single, scientific, universal, correct and universal definition. This is the precise definition of intelligence, that could sum up probably 80+ invented definitions in one scientifically derived definition.



Intelligence is the principle of reinforcing an X to survive, to exist and to succeed in a certain degree of importance and it always acts on asymmetrical phenomenon.
So after you've read all of that, what is YOUR definition of intelligence?

Or don't you know?
 
So you have no idea what you're talking about?

Okay, that's clear.
Seems @MrIntelligentDesign does know what he’s talking about, that:
Many people mostly atheists believe that God has been disproven or has being shown to be non-existent. But if you knew the definition and explanation of intelligence, or its variants, or synonyms, you will never claim such illogical claim. Thus, intelligence protects the existence of God from those non-intelligent persons.

I think this has been demonstrated
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
It was the old ID, and that ID never uses intelligence but complex from Darwin. Basically, it was Darwin vs Darwin..
The n properly define your terms, you have not even been able to do that, tell us what your testable hypothesis is and what reasonable test could possibly refute it. And what evidence supports your claim.

And by the way, that "reasonable test that could refute it" is extremely important. If you do not have one then your whole claim falls apart. To even have evidence one first needs a testable hypothesis. And claiming "if they ever prove evolution is right that will refute me" is not a reasonable test since science never "proves" anything. Your test needs to be based upon the merits and predictions given by your hypothesis. That is how evidence works in the sciences. They have that definition because there are a lot of loons out there.
 
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