God is everywhere; is God in Hell?

[URAVIP2ME]

Uravip2me yes I’m nearly convinced that we do sleep long time until the appointed time of the Lords return. As to Enoch and Elijah. Well yes I guess they could not ascend into heaven as mere mortals after given that some more thought and a little more study. For flesh and blood cannot enter into the kingdom of God in its present state. A newly glorified resurrection body would be required as mentioned in 1st Corinthians and as with our Lord. As to How Enoch passed away we do not know but its a fair enough opinion with what you have written .But unlike Enoch at least with Moses we do have some description that it was Gods time that he should pass away.

Thank you for your reply.
I am wondering if you might find Acts of the Apostles 24:15 to be of interest____________
There is used the ' future tense ' that there ' is going to be ' a resurrection......
' is going to be ' as in meaning a future resurrection time or day.
Resurrection Day as in meaning Jesus' Millennium-Long Day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
People like King David and John the Baptist are Not yet resurrected - Matthew 11:11; Acts of the Apostles 2:34.
This is because they died before Jesus died. ( John 3:13 )
Only people called to heavenly life 'after ' Jesus died can be called to heaven. - Luke 22:28-30.
Thus, the majority of mankind can have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection back to live life on Earth.
Live forever on Earth as is God original purpose for mankind.
So, to me it is No wonder that Jesus promised that humble meek people will inherit the Earth - Psalms 37:9-11.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

............... Matthew 27:50-53. Look very closely at v52 And the graves were opened: and many bodies of the saints which SLEPT arose. Did they get to enjoy another 3 score and 10 yrs. Not much more is known about the occurrence. Only that the quest for immortality and eternal youth does continue to live within our hearts and is passed on from generation to generation..

We know the Bible was Not originally written in English, so we need to keep that in mind.
I find at Matthew 27:52 is Not speaking about resurrection but that the earthquake opened the graves.
By saying ' arose ' (Not resurrected) would mean their corpses were ' exposed '.
In verse 53 it says ' after ' Jesus' resurrection ( Jesus was Not resurrected on the day he died ).
Days later, Jesus was the first to be resurrected - Colossians 1:18.
So, the ' and came out of the graves ' would be like saying ' and came out of the cemetery '.
Living people came out of the grave yard. Those living people are the ones and Not any resurrected saints.

 

[Bird123]

P.S. Adam and Eve did not have a book to guide them. But then they had children, and then they died anyway. So a book well suits its purpose in this case.

Adam and Eve is just a story. It is not Truth. Books do not always consist of the Truth.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

P.S. Adam and Eve did not have a book to guide them. But then they had children, and then they died anyway. So a book well suits its purpose in this case.

I find Adam and Eve had only One Law to guide them, so they did Not need a guide book or manuel.
They had a beautiful paradisical home, they have plenty of variety in food, and job as care takers of Eden.
They had real freedom: Freedom from worry abut crime, sickness and freedom from death.
By keeping God's ' do not touch His tree ' law would be showing respect and obedience to their Creator, and Father.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Not the barbarian Jehovah's Witnesses.

I am wondering what is found as barbarian at www.jw.org _______________

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Figures. Not to me, though. I don't believe in a "spiritual Israel" separate from the real, physical Israel.........

I find you are far from being alone because many think only of a real, national, physical, fleshly Israel.
In Scripture, after what is called Pentecost, the 'Israel of God' became a ' spiritual nation ' according to 1 Peter 2:9,5.
This is when ' Jerusalem above ' now became the ' seat of government ' - Galatians 4:26.
Not fleshly Jews but ' spiritual Jews ' as per Romans 2:28-29
Or, as Jesus taught the old was abandoned, desolated - Matthew 23:38.
Thus, a 'new nation' at Pentecost was inaugurated as the New Covenant as per Jeremiah 32:40.
With the death of Jesus the old Law was fulfilled - Romans 10:4.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Apparently God does want us to learn from books...

Well, we do have the ' Book of Creation ' as sometimes the ' Book of Nature ' is called.
If God did Not want us to learn from books then He would Not have given us the '66' books of Bible canon to learn from.

 

[YoursTrue]

YoursTrue I’m sure if Enoch went to heaven then he must have died the death for it is impossible for fallen human beings to look apon the full glory of God and live as attested to in Exodus 3:1-17 when God spoke to Moses via the burning bush and other passages such as Exodus 33:20 . So certainly some physical transformation to bodily perfection must have taken place for this to be the case: And as you have said Enoch may have not even realised that he had died. But when looking over the entirety of scripture it does seem to say that we do sleep long time until that appointed day. Of course there are some occasions when this is not the norm. Such as the damsel being brought back to life along with Lazarus and of course when the Jesus was being crucified and had just died with many of the saints coming back to life who did arise from out of their tombs. But in all these instances it seems that all did sleep prior. Matthew 27:50-53. Look very closely at v52 And the graves were opened: and many bodies of the saints which SLEPT arose. Did they get to enjoy another 3 score and 10 yrs. Not much more is known about the occurrence. Only that the quest for immortality and eternal youth does continue to live within our hearts and is passed on from generation to generation..

God does not put the desire in us for eternal life enjoying good health for nothing. We have that desire for a reason. He wants us to look for Him while -- we're alive. We can find Him if we desire. And, of course, Jacob said he saw God. So Jacob called the name of the place Peniel, saying, “For I have seen God face to face, and yet my life has been delivered.” Genesis 32:30. So there are, of course, different ways of "seeing God."
There is a debate among scholars in reference to Matthew 27:50-53, what it means, and when it was written.
The point is that seeing God can be taken in several ways, one example is with Jacob at Peniel. As far as seeing God in His full glory, that is yet to come. But we can certainly understand more about what it means to "see God" now. As an example, if a person were to say he sees God in his life, few would take that to mean that he actually sees God in person, but rather as an influence in the right manner.

 

[YoursTrue]

Well, we do have the ' Book of Creation ' as sometimes the ' Book of Nature ' is called.
If God did Not want us to learn from books then He would Not have given us the '66' books of Bible canon to learn from.

Of course. And, of course, stories and accounts from person to person change, so it is only reasonable to realize that accounts of Adam and what happened were written down as time went on, and basically remain unchanged until now, preserved in the Scriptures. (Adam died -- his wife died -- his children died -- thus they could not relate forever what happened to them, and so it is only reasonable that the Scriptures were entrusted to those God chose. Because word-of-mouth accounts also change, a written document is far better than word of mouth.)

 

[YoursTrue]

YoursTrue I’m sure if Enoch went to heaven then he must have died the death for it is impossible for fallen human beings to look apon the full glory of God and live as attested to in Exodus 3:1-17 when God spoke to Moses via the burning bush and other passages such as Exodus 33:20 . So certainly some physical transformation to bodily perfection must have taken place for this to be the case: And as you have said Enoch may have not even realised that he had died. But when looking over the entirety of scripture it does seem to say that we do sleep long time until that appointed day. Of course there are some occasions when this is not the norm. Such as the damsel being brought back to life along with Lazarus and of course when the Jesus was being crucified and had just died with many of the saints coming back to life who did arise from out of their tombs. But in all these instances it seems that all did sleep prior. Matthew 27:50-53. Look very closely at v52 And the graves were opened: and many bodies of the saints which SLEPT arose. Did they get to enjoy another 3 score and 10 yrs. Not much more is known about the occurrence. Only that the quest for immortality and eternal youth does continue to live within our hearts and is passed on from generation to generation..

Enoch died. There is no doubt in my mind from my examination of the Bible. And death is like a sleep, long or short, but the person does not really know how long he slept until he checks the time. When he awakens.

 

[Thief]

Well, is he? For those who believe in an omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent God and believe in Hell, especially a literal one, is God there? I don't think it matters if Hell is literal or figurative. It's a place where condemned and punished souls are sent by God. Even if Hell is separation from God, where do the souls go? Is God not there also. Please explain the seeming paradox to me. How can an omnipotent and omnipresent God not be somewhere. To me, that negates God’s omni-everything. So, given that God is everywhere, as we were taught by Sister Mary Discipline of the Sisters of No Mercy, is God in Hell along with the tortured souls he sentenced there? Does he exist there?

if you can believe in the parables of the Carpenter.....

a rich man said to the angel....quench my thirst
and the angel said ….Nay, for there is a great divide between us

the rich man was in hell
and apparently ….an angel also
close enough to have conversation

 

[YoursTrue]

Adam and Eve is just a story. It is not Truth. Books do not always consist of the Truth.

No, that is correct, books do not always consist of the Truth. But I find this book, the Bible, does. Since we are discussing hell in this thread and what it is, there are various ways the different religions look at it. I find from my study of the Bible that hell is synonymous with the grave. And of course, some people are cremated, so they aren't buried in a coffin and grave. The word hell is used as a covering term.

 

[YoursTrue]

if you can believe in the parables of the Carpenter.....

a rich man said to the angel....quench my thirst
and the angel said ….Nay, for there is a great divide between us

the rich man was in hell
and apparently ….an angel also
close enough to have conversation

Interesting -- parables are stories using symbolic references.

 

[dfnj]

Well, is he? For those who believe in an omnipotent, omniscient and omnipresent God and believe in Hell, especially a literal one, is God there? I don't think it matters if Hell is literal or figurative. It's a place where condemned and punished souls are sent by God. Even if Hell is separation from God, where do the souls go? Is God not there also. Please explain the seeming paradox to me. How can an omnipotent and omnipresent God not be somewhere. To me, that negates God’s omni-everything. So, given that God is everywhere, as we were taught by Sister Mary Discipline of the Sisters of No Mercy, is God in Hell along with the tortured souls he sentenced there? Does he exist there?

God is everywhere. Hell is not what you think it is. When we die, most people go into the light, look into the face of God and experience God's infinite beauty for all eternity. When you look into the face of God all time stops. You become perfect, complete, and whole without any desires or needs just like our omnipotent God. All you experience is eternal bliss and absolute fulfillment.

Now if you turn away from the light, our omnipotent God has plans for you! Our omnipotent God knows exactly how to educate each errant soul with a perfectly tailored education that is guaranteed to turn each errant soul into the best soul possible. The purpose of God's education is so that the next time you face the light you do not turn away when you look into God's face of infinite beauty. Whatever was holding you back will no longer be a problem. You will no longer be embarrassed or full of self-hate so when you look into the mirror of God's infinite beauty, this time you go into the light and experience eternal Heavenly bliss.

So what is God's perfect method for the education of lost souls? When you turn away from God the first thing God does is give you omnipotent powers. Now at first this may sound like a really good thing. But think about it. You will be wasting your time exercising your omnipotent powers when you could be spending your time experiencing eternal Heavenly bliss! Any time away from experiencing eternal Heavenly bliss is Hell by definition.

So given all each person's psychosis and bad behaviors a person can use their new found omnipotent powers to work out every possible itch that needs to be scratched. But after 10 or 20 million years having sex with two chicks it all kind of gets old. At some point, because of our own limitations of creativity, we simply become bored to the point where we cannot take it anymore. And when this happens the person with the omnipotent powers, now humbled to the point of perfection, is given a second chance to turn back to God and go into the light. Except this time they stay and experience eternal Heavenly bliss. This way God gets to collect every one of his precious souls in way that makes everyone happy.

Omnipotent means without limitations. So of course our omnipotent God uses his powers of infinite love and forgiveness to save every soul that has been cast out into Hell. God's education plan for the people in Hell is perfectly tailored. Omnipotent means not bounded by the laws of logic or physics. An omnipotent God can be all places at one. An omnipotent God can be every possible way of being all at once. My problem with your OP is you make all kinds of assumptions about our omnipotent God having all kinds of limitations.

 

[YoursTrue]

Is this an excuse not to try? Should one remain a caveman or work at solving the problems leading us all to where we are today and beyond? Mankind has already made that choice regardless of how slow things are moving.

No, it certainly is not an excuse. But the reality is that the problems of mankind are way beyond mankind's ability to fix them. For instance -- pollution. That does not mean, however, that a conscientious person would throw motor oil or dangerous drugs and chemicals down the sink drain going to the drinking supply. But reality shows that it's impossible to 'fix' the world. The Bible says that God will remove all causes of trouble. That is why Jesus taught his disciples to pray for God's kingdom to come.

 

[YoursTrue]

Figures. Not to me, though. I don't believe in a "spiritual Israel" separate from the real, physical Israel.

..

I just read something and it strikes me as being true. What do you think? Was Jerusalem (considered by many to be the center of worship for Jews now and in the past) always a spiritually pleasing place to God?

 

[YoursTrue]

God is everywhere. Hell is not what you think it is. When we die, most people go into the light, look into the face of God and experience God's infinite beauty for all eternity. When you look into the face of God all time stops. You become perfect, complete, and whole without any desires or needs just like our omnipotent God. All you experience is eternal bliss and absolute fulfillment.

Now if you turn away from the light, our omnipotent God has plans for you! Our omnipotent God knows exactly how to educate each errant soul with a perfectly tailored education that is guaranteed to turn each errant soul into the best soul possible. The purpose of God's education is so that the next time you face the light you do not turn away when you look into God's face of infinite beauty. Whatever was holding you back will no longer be a problem. You will no longer be embarrassed or full of self-hate so when you look into the mirror of God's infinite beauty, this time you go into the light and experience eternal Heavenly bliss.

So what is God's perfect method for the education of lost souls? When you turn away from God the first thing God does is give you omnipotent powers. Now at first this may sound like a really good thing. But think about it. You will be wasting your time exercising your omnipotent powers when you could be spending your time experiencing eternal Heavenly bliss! Any time away from experiencing eternal Heavenly bliss is Hell by definition.

So given all each person's psychosis and bad behaviors a person can use their new found omnipotent powers to work out every possible itch that needs to be scratched. But after 10 or 20 million years having sex with two chicks it all kind of gets old. At some point, because of our own limitations of creativity, we simply become bored to the point where we cannot take it anymore. And when this happens the person with the omnipotent powers, now humbled to the point of perfection, is given a second chance to turn back to God and go into the light. Except this time they stay and experience eternal Heavenly bliss. This way God gets to collect every one of his precious souls in way that makes everyone happy.

Omnipotent means without limitations. So of course our omnipotent God uses his powers of infinite love and forgiveness to save every soul that has been cast out into Hell. God's education plan for the people in Hell is perfectly tailored. Omnipotent means not bounded by the laws of logic or physics. An omnipotent God can be all places at one. An omnipotent God can be every possible way of being all at once. My problem with your OP is you make all kinds of assumptions about our omnipotent God having all kinds of limitations.

Sorry I don't have time to read each and every post here, so can't follow everything, but I am responding to one of your points.
Please notice that Jesus said he is the light of the world. John 8:12 - When Jesus spoke again to the people, he said, "I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will never walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."

 

[Harel13]

you are far from being alone

That has never crossed my mind.

 

[Prim969]

Thank you for your reply.
I am wondering if you might find Acts of the Apostles 24:15 to be of interest____________
There is used the ' future tense ' that there ' is going to be ' a resurrection......
' is going to be ' as in meaning a future resurrection time or day.
Resurrection Day as in meaning Jesus' Millennium-Long Day of governing over Earth for a thousand years.
People like King David and John the Baptist are Not yet resurrected - Matthew 11:11; Acts of the Apostles 2:34.
This is because they died before Jesus died. ( John 3:13 )
Only people called to heavenly life 'after ' Jesus died can be called to heaven. - Luke 22:28-30.
Thus, the majority of mankind can have a happy-and-healthy physical resurrection back to live life on Earth.
Live forever on Earth as is God original purpose for mankind.
So, to me it is No wonder that Jesus promised that humble meek people will inherit the Earth - Psalms 37:9-11.

Uravip2me I don’t have any problem with Acts 24:15 That we have hope towards God that there shall be a future resurrection of the just and the unjust..As to King David and John the Baptist not being resurrected as yet. That’s right all except for our Lord Jesus Christ. A permanent And final resurrection has not occurred for any of us as yet. Only temporary ones like Lazarus the damsel and the others mentioned in our previous posts. I’m not so sure about the heavenly class and earthly class status that you mention. Sounds very much like a social divide to me. And taking into consideration that we are referred to as saints, brethren, the elect, the church, the children of God And so much more. The bible only mentions one faith And that is that we belong to him, be that past, present or future. You say it’s no wonder that Jesus promised the meek and humble a earthly kingdom. Only a earthly kingdom you think . Uravip2me Jesus did say many heart warming words that day apon the mount. Such as Blessed are the poor in spirit for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are they that mourn for they shall be comforted. Blessed are the pure in heart for they shall see God. Blessed are they who are persecuted for righteousness sake for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. These many other promises that Jesus did speak of as well .Promises given to his people as a whole and not just separately. And Yes so it shall be at the end of all things that all Gods people shall look apon a new heavens and a new earth: For this one is truly passing away and shall one day be no more. Revelations 21:1

 

[Prim969]

We know the Bible was Not originally written in English, so we need to keep that in mind.
I find at Matthew 27:52 is Not speaking about resurrection but that the earthquake opened the graves.
By saying ' arose ' (Not resurrected) would mean their corpses were ' exposed '.
In verse 53 it says ' after ' Jesus' resurrection ( Jesus was Not resurrected on the day he died ).
Days later, Jesus was the first to be resurrected - Colossians 1:18.
So, the ' and came out of the graves ' would be like saying ' and came out of the cemetery '.
Living people came out of the grave yard. Those living people are the ones and Not any resurrected saints.

Yes the bible was originally written in Hebrew Aramaic and Greek which our translators do know extremely well.. We don’t even have the originals and nor do we need, as we have a wealth of manuscripts and early writers to varify what has been said . There is nothing inferior about the English language. All we need is to search deeper into the usage and meaning of the word that’s the reasons why we have dictionaries. Not that I believe that Matthew 27 50-53 has ever posed a problem. But let’s take a look at that possible explanation you mentioned. If we go with the earthquake scenario and that its only talking about the damage inflicted apon the tombs by the earthquake thus revealing the many dead bodies of the saints In their tombs . Than this would become problematic for In the next verse Matthew 27:53 it goes on to say ( and CAME OUT out of their graves AFTER HIS resurrection, and WENT INTO the holy city and APPEARED unto MANY ) this is talking bodily functions In motion. To go from their tombs and to visit And be seen by others amongst the holy city to whom appeared unto to many. Another problem would be If they were not fully bodily resurrected than how could they be recognised? I mean a lot of those people would have been in varying stages of decay probably many were just bones and what a nightmare that would have been having all these skeletons and half decayed bodies walking around the streets. So it had to be a full bodily resurrection body for them to be recognised as well. Yes Jesus was truly the first resurrection of immortality while the other resurrections mentioned were only temporary ones . Whereas with the future resurrection body that we all do await for that shall be a non perishable body as well perfect in every way.