Gods responsibility

[idav]

Fine, God is a monster. Have it your way.

We're all capable of being monsters, and we're capable of not being monsters. Even psychopaths can learn to control themselves.

Another one of my thoughts, I know I should stop that.

We make parent liable for things children do. However as they gain more knowledge and independence we accept the blame to be on the child. So in society we recognize when someone should be blamed or not.

So the question becomes when has god become no longer liable? Have we learned enough to be independent, do we know enough? There is the rub, knowledge. Do we know as much as god? Obviously that would be a no. However do we know enough? That last question I think is the important one, if we really know enough to be liable for what we do. God would have needed to give us knowledge and the ability to decide from right and wrong. Did this happen enough to release god from any blame? The big thing is we are not omniscient and that is the area we need gods help. Cause we are idiots and don't know better when we can't predict all the ramifications of seemingly innocent things.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Another one of my thoughts, I know I should stop that.

We make parent liable for things children do. However as they gain more knowledge and independence we accept the blame to be on the child. So in society we recognize when someone should be blamed or not.

So the question becomes when has god become no longer liable? Have we learned enough to be independent, do we know enough? There is the rub, knowledge. Do we know as much as god? Obviously that would be a no. However do we know enough? That last question I think is the important one, if we really know enough to be liable for what we do. God would have needed to give us knowledge and the ability to decide from right and wrong. Did this happen enough to release god from any blame? The big thing is we are not omniscient and that is the area we need gods help. Cause we are idiots and don't know better when we can't predict all the ramifications of seemingly innocent things.

We still have free will and personal responsibility.

 

[idav]

We still have free will and personal responsibility.

Yes just as a child should but they will still blame the parents as if the child is their responsibility.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Yes just as a child should but they will still blame the parents as if the child is their responsibility.

We're not God's responsibility. That insinuation diminishes the power and potential of mankind. We were made in His image. We're not lost little children who need to be coddled.

To me, this all just sounds like whining and failure to take responsibility for your own failings. Wah wah wah. Grow up.

 

[idav]

We're not God's responsibility. That insinuation diminishes the power and potential of mankind. We were made in His image. We're not lost little children who need to be coddled.

To me, this all just sounds like whining and failure to take responsibility for your own failings. Wah wah wah. Grow up.

I can only take responsibility for what I know and can control which is very little in god standards.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I can only take responsibility for what I know and can control which is very little in god standards.

God's not interested in controlling us or our lives in general. He wants us to be mature and make our own choices. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to comprehend.

 

[idav]

God's not interested in controlling us or our lives in general. He wants us to be mature and make our own choices. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to comprehend.

That isnt hard to comprehend but within reason. You dont just throw someone into deep waters expecting them to learn to swim.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

That isnt hard to comprehend but within reason. You dont just throw someone into deep waters expecting them to learn to swim.

That assumes we're helpless. We're not.

 

[idav]

That assumes we're helpless. We're not.

No it assumes its possible we can drown even if fighting for our life. I would never say we are helpless.

 

[Thief]

I say ...as we stand before heaven.....we ARE helpless.

We leave this life with only the way we think and feel.....
We stand from the flesh naked.

Anyone standing over us in that hour will have the advantage.
They will know the language, the territory and the scheme of things.

They will say 'worthy to follow'...or turn away and leave us wherever we fell.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

As long as it had the choice to decide for itself, the responsibility lies with it.

So in your mind, there's no such thing as being the accessory to a crime?

"Yeah, I bought him the gun and ammunition. Yeah, I knew he was going to use them to kill that guy. Yeah, I could've told the victim that he was on his way over to kill him... but he's the one who pulled the trigger, so my hands are clean."

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

We're not God's responsibility. That insinuation diminishes the power and potential of mankind. We were made in His image. We're not lost little children who need to be coddled.

To me, this all just sounds like whining and failure to take responsibility for your own failings. Wah wah wah. Grow up.

Tell that to Kitty Genovese. She could've used some help.

There was a wide outcry when it came out that many of her neighbours heard her screams when she was first attacked, but did nothing. This gave her attacker the opportunity to find her again, rape her, and stab her to death.

Do you think those witnesses did nothing wrong by ignoring her screams?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

God's not interested in controlling us or our lives in general. He wants us to be mature and make our own choices. I don't understand why this is so hard for people to comprehend.

I hope you don't believe in miracles or divine revelation, because if you do, it's got to be RF's most hypocritical statement of the day.

 

[sojourner]

So in your mind, there's no such thing as being the accessory to a crime?

"Yeah, I bought him the gun and ammunition. Yeah, I knew he was going to use them to kill that guy. Yeah, I could've told the victim that he was on his way over to kill him... but he's the one who pulled the trigger, so my hands are clean."

"The devil made me do it" is not an adequate defense. Blaming God is like blaming genetics, or diet, or illness. The bottom line is that we are culpable for our own actions. You're creating a false dilemma here by putting God in a position to be subject to humanity. God is not subject to humanity.

 

[sojourner]

Tell that to Kitty Genovese. She could've used some help.

There was a wide outcry when it came out that many of her neighbours heard her screams when she was first attacked, but did nothing. This gave her attacker the opportunity to find her again, rape her, and stab her to death.

Do you think those witnesses did nothing wrong by ignoring her screams?

Again, this is a false dilemma. We are made in the image of the Creator, therefore, we have responsibility -- not the creator.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

"The devil made me do it" is not an adequate defense. Blaming God is like blaming genetics, or diet, or illness. The bottom line is that we are culpable for our own actions.

I think you're operating from an illogical foundation here. The guilt of the murderer and the accomplice are two separate questions. We don't say that the guilt of the murderer implies the innocence of the accomplice or that the guilt of the accomplice implies the innocence of the murderer. The fact that the murderer is responsible for his own actions doesn't absolve the accomplice of his role in enabling those same actions.

You're creating a false dilemma here by putting God in a position to be subject to humanity. God is not subject to humanity.

God, if he exists, is just one more player in the game like anyone else. Maybe a bigger, stronger player, but still just a player. Saying otherwise is irrational special pleading.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Again, this is a false dilemma. We are made in the image of the Creator, therefore, we have responsibility -- not the creator.

Your "therefore" does not follow. Each person - God or human - is responsible for the foreseeable consequences of their actions.

 

[sojourner]

I think you're operating from an illogical foundation here. The guilt of the murderer and the accomplice are two separate questions. We don't say that the guilt of the murderer implies the innocence of the accomplice or that the guilt of the accomplice implies the innocence of the murderer. The fact that the murderer is responsible for his own actions doesn't absolve the accomplice of his role in enabling those same actions.


God, if he exists, is just one more player in the game like anyone else. Maybe a bigger, stronger player, but still just a player. Saying otherwise is irrational special pleading.

God isn't an "accomplice" any more than the cabbage we ate for dinner last night is an "accomplice."

God isn't "one more player in the game." God is the game. It's not special pleading, because the rules are God and God can't be exempt from God's Self.

 

[sojourner]

Your "therefore" does not follow. Each person - God or human - is responsible for the foreseeable consequences of their actions.

Responsible to whom, Penguin??? God is responsible to God -- not to us, nor to our sense of right/wrong, nor to our sense of morality.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

God isn't an "accomplice" any more than the cabbage we ate for dinner last night is an "accomplice."

Your version of God has foreknowledge and will akin to a cabbage?

God isn't "one more player in the game." God is the game. It's not special pleading, because the rules are God and God can't be exempt from God's Self.

Word salad.