Good meat, bad meat

[Mr Spinkles]

It's well known that a lot of the practices in factory farms are inhumane (at least in the U.S.) So how can one tell if meat is produced in a humane way? What about meat bought in restaurants or dining halls?

 

[john313]

if it is purchased from a store or restaurant it is most likely factory farmed. to get "humane" meat, the easiest way is probably to go straight to a farm and talk to the farmer after seeing how they are raised or possibly a meat locker.
even a lot of the meat that is called "kosher" or "halal", which is religiously required to be humane, is still raised in inhumane conditions.
of course i feel obligated to say no meat consumption is the best way

 

[Druidus]

By the way, in the U.S., people assume that "free-ranged" means grazed on a farm with wide open spaces. However, this is often not the case. Usually, it is the same as any other farm, but with a small amount of access to the outside. I'm not sure what size it must be, but trust me, it was not very large at all.

Really, the only way is to travel to the country and find a farm with conditions you can accept.

As John said, I, too, feel obligated to say that no meat is probably the best way.

 

[kreeden]

Mr. Sprinkles , hunt your own .

Druidus , actually free ranged doesn't mean that they get fresh air , it only needs that they are not kept in small cages and are allowed to roam . That may only be inside a large barn , or some other building .

Actually , I think that the best way would be to have all meat labeled , such as genetic engineered food is in Europe .

 

[Zephyr]

If its kosher or halal, it's good enough for me. I understand that it would probably be better to go vegetarian, but I love meat. There should be some better laws, or maybe people should start farming their own.

 

[michel]

keep your own animals is probably the only way; might be a bit tough in town........

 

[EnhancedSpirit]

It's well known that a lot of the practices in factory farms are inhumane (at least in the U.S.) So how can one tell if meat is produced in a humane way? What about meat bought in restaurants or dining halls?

There is no way to know. This is a job for faith.

As for whether meat is actually good for you or not. Well, my theory is that it depends on the person. If someone is born and lives in a tropical environment, there body probably does not require the same amount of good fats that a person who lives in Alaska would need.

The body is a complex chemical cocktail, and while the buildings blocks might be the same, the ratios of all the chemicals in each person will be a little different. And what each person needs to keep the chemicals balanced will be a little different for each person.

 

[Quoth The Raven]

if it is purchased from a store or restaurant it is most likely factory farmed. to get "humane" meat, the easiest way is probably to go straight to a farm and talk to the farmer after seeing how they are raised or possibly a meat locker.
even a lot of the meat that is called "kosher" or "halal", which is religiously required to be humane, is still raised in inhumane conditions.
of course i feel obligated to say no meat consumption is the best way

Go witness a kosher kill and then discuss humane.

 

[michel]

You know, I am rapidly going off the thought of my next meal.........:bonk:

 

[fromthe heart]

I have a lot of concerns about the meat we are buying no matter where it may be. These factory farms have one goal...raise it fast because the next shipment will be coming in just a few more weeks. There are all kinds of growth hormones being given to these animals to get them to slaughter faster to meet the needs of the consumers. Poultry for instance is arriving in stores 6 weeks after it has hatched. The hog farm just down the road from me has the pigs in an enclosed building where to walk in there you'd need a respirator to breathe...so what kind of oxgen are the pigs breathing and what does that do to their chemical makeup? They too are fed a quick grow feed. Cows are being fed or HAVE been fed grain with cow remains in them in many places and that is the reason we have the disease of mad cow developing. Cows are not meat eaters so why on earth would anyone in their right mind feed them this stuff....but it happens. Our meat is gradually becoming not very appealing to think about. I have personally been purchasing a whole beef every year from a farm I'm familiar with so I know we are NOT eating hormones and antibiotics gallore. As far as poultry goes we try to only buy Perdue chickens since they have the least amout of chemicals going into them...they are also fed marigolds to make their skin more yellow so that is a safe way to give the poultry color.


Since we are a meat eating family and always will be as long as we can protect ourselves and eat meat safely. We DO NOT eat pork...it's just not that safe anymore...even the local butcher shops admit to getting their pigs from factory farms.

Well...got a bit long winded there So sorry! I'm shutting up now!

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Well I can certainly see why people would avoid eating meat that has been treated in an inhumane way....but what's wrong with eating genetically engineered, hormone and/or antibiotic-filled meat? My impression has always been that genetically engineered foods are far superior, and can even help solve world hunger.

 

[Prima]

We have a few places here that advertise their meat this way - organic, free-range.

The best (albeit most difficult) way, I think, is to make sure it's from a family-operated farm. Amish farms in particular are often organic and at least give their animals a lot of room to roam, and they have large stalls.

Other than that, I think as the vegetarian numbers grow it will become easier.

 

[Prima]

what's wrong with eating genetically engineered, hormone and/or antibiotic-filled meat? My impression has always been that genetically engineered foods are far superior, and can even help solve world hunger.

The problem is how far the genetic engineering goes. A little bit of genetic engineering and hormones can be ok. However, some farms bulk their chickens up so much that they can't walk because their legs are too heavy.

On another note, another practice is cutting off chicken's feet - that's done to stop the chickens from scratching their handlers.

Another concern is the question of how many hormones and chemicals we take in when we eat the meat that has been treated this way. It hasn't been around long enough for us to see whether it's possible that we're taking in dangerous levels.

 

[Prima]

I haven't looked into anti-biotic meat, it sounds rather odd to me. But I know for a fact that antibiotics have harmful long-term effects.

 

[michel]

I haven't looked into anti-biotic meat, it sounds rather odd to me. But I know for a fact that antibiotics have harmful long-term effects.

They do - on the population that eats the meat. It is a little like the process of vaccination - you receive 'little bits' of antibiotics over a period of time - the bugs in your own body build up an immunity to the anti-biotics, so that when you need them for something serious (pnemonia for example) - the anti-biotics no longer have the same effect on you.

That is why if you are given a course of, say two weeks, EVEN if you feel better - you MUST finish the course - otherwise you have just wasted your time and you have made the problem worse.

 

[Prima]

That is why if you are given a course of, say two weeks, EVEN if you feel better - you MUST finish the course - otherwise you have just wasted your time and you have made the problem worse.

And if you take it longer, you're just killing off the good bacteria

 

[john313]

Go witness a kosher kill and then discuss humane.

my idea of humane is to let them live

 

[Druidus]

my idea of humane is to let them live

Indeed, and it always will be.


As for "free range":

A growing number of people are looking to "free-range" products as an alternative to factory farmed animal products. Eggs (and poultry) may be labeled as "free-range" if they have USDA-certified access to the outdoors. No other criteria, such as environmental quality, size of the outside area, number of birds, or space per bird, are included in this term. Typically, free-range hens are debeaked at the hatchery, have only 1 to 2 square feet of floor space per bird, and -- if the hens can go outside -- must compete with many other hens for access to a small exit from the shed, leading to a muddy strip saturated with droppings. Although chickens can live up to 12 years, free-range hens are hauled to slaughter the same as battery-caged hens, after a year or two. Free-range male chicks are trashed at birth, just as they are in factory farms. Although free-range conditions may be an improvement over factory-farm conditions, they are by no means free of cruelty.

The Associated Press reported on March 11, 1998:

Free-range chickens conjure up in some consumers minds pictures of contented fowl strolling around the barnyard, but the truth is, all a chicken grower needs to do is give the birds some access to the outdoorswhether the chickens decide to take a gambol or stay inside with hundreds or thousands of other birds, under government rules growers are free to label them free-range.

As all free-range animals are still viewed as objects to be killed for food, they are subject to abusive handling, transport, and slaughter. Free-range animals, like all animals used for their milk and eggs, are still slaughtered at a fraction of their normal life expectancy.

​

​

 

[kreeden]

Go witness a kosher kill and then discuss humane.

I wasn't going there ... But it is likely as humane as most ways to kill ? Other then a well placed bullet , but that is chancy .

BTW they don't use as much hormones and the like in raising Bison , yet .

And as for genetic engineering , in thory it sounds good , but in practice it is used not to produce a better and heahtlier good , but a plant that will withstand the use of pesticides , and the like .

 

[Quoth The Raven]

I wasn't going there ... But it is likely as humane as most ways to kill ? Other then a well placed bullet , but that is chancy .

BTW they don't use as much hormones and the like in raising Bison , yet .

And as for genetic engineering , in thory it sounds good , but in practice it is used not to produce a better and heahtlier good , but a plant that will withstand the use of pesticides , and the like .

Look, in the US - according to something Dru came up with you don't even use a bolt gun on anything there before you kill it, so I guess there's not much difference, because you're bleeding everything when it's still alive anyway. Here animals get a bolt to the head.
Genetic modification - and this is what a lot of people don't seem to understand - isn't about producing a better plant the same way that selective hybridisation is. With selective hybridisation, you're crossing corn with corn, or cucumbers with cucumbers. With genetic modification, you're producing a plant that is so laced with insecticide - as a result of the GM - that not only will it kill anything that eats it, any pollinators that land on it will often drop dead as well. You get the same thing from spraying, obviously,but in the case of the GM crop, these things aren't intended for human consumption. However - and this actually happened - you get a plant that produces fibre and can also be used to produce oil, and suddenly litres of GM oil turn up in the vats of fish and chip shops. Oop-a-day.:bonk:
Antibiotics produce faster growth rates. There was a segment on one of the current affairs programs about one of the major chicken producers feeding their birds antibiotics. The birds fed with anti-biotics can go from egg to table in 28 days. That's from fluffy chicken to a minimum dressed weight on 1 1/2kg in under a month. Lots of those chickens can't walk, because they grow too fast for their bones to be able to support them. The other concern is that there's a particularly nasty bacteria that likes to hang out wit chickens called VRE, which is found in approximately 10% of chickens and can be passed on to humans. When you're healthy it just sits around doing nothing, if you're inmmuno suppressed or have to have invasive surgery, it can rear it's ugly head and cause complications resulting in death.